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The Stranger
The Stranger
Maybe they just enjoyed those games regardless of whether or not other games had used the same mechanics and systems better.
Tai_MT
Tai_MT
If that's the case, then they should just say so. "I enjoyed X, but these other games did it better". They do not do this, however. Instead, they praise games for features that other games do better. What makes it even harder to take seriously for me is... Often the games getting praised... they were beaten by a system that is over 10 years old, which means we're dealing with willful ignorance.
The Stranger
The Stranger
A lot of people don't experience things that way though. If I don't like something, I'm going to find it difficult to point out positive aspects of it. It doesn't really matter if it was the first to use a certain system or mechanic. Sure, I can understand something else did the same thing prior, but that's largely irrelevant to my experiences and enjoyment of those mechanics.
The Stranger
The Stranger
Should I praise Dark Souls, for example, just because Code Vein and The Surge use similar mechanics and systems? I don't think I should. I know what these games were inspired by, but that doesn't change my opinion on the source of their inspiration.
Tai_MT
Tai_MT
I do not personally like Dark Souls either, but there are aspects of the game I would praise as being very much well done. That is sort of the joy of actually having played so many games before. The ability to draw on many experiences and break down experiences into "I was having fun doing this" and "I was not having fun doing this" instead of rating it as an "overall experience".
Tai_MT
Tai_MT
I enjoy "Hollow Knight", but it has a myriad of flaws that I lambaste the game for, despite the things it does well. This is sort of what it means to engage in "game design" overall. When a person tries to seriously talk about game design and uses a game that didn't even do what they're talking about well... It's difficult to take them seriously. Especially when a better example is easily cite-able.
The Stranger
The Stranger
Some people can have their entire experience of something, not just games, ruined by one or two things. Also, some people, myself included, will latch on to a single idea in a game and will love it for that one thing alone. There might be other games that have done the same thing better, but which lack the one aspect we find appealing.
Tai_MT
Tai_MT
That's also a part of game design though. If you found a single particular aspect of something really great, and you know another game did the overall system much better... You can now talk about combining both aspects to make a new system. Effectively, talking about innovation and iteration. Many game devs do not talk like that.
The Stranger
The Stranger
For me, it was the vampire theme in Code Vein which made it good. It made the frustrating and crappy parts bearable for me. lol. If it didn't have the vampire theme, then I'd probably not like the game at all. I do try to point out the flaws of games I've enjoyed to others when recommending them, though.
Tai_MT
Tai_MT
That's what devs should be doing. "I liked X, here's why, despite Y and Z flaws that brought the experience down". Meanwhile, a lot of devs just talk about, "Game X did Y amazingly! Here's how!" and ignore any and all flaws, and are just propping up a game they enjoyed (or were paid to enjoy, depending on where you see this dev).
The Stranger
The Stranger
Oh! I understand now. Yeah, defending a game to the death, and pretending it's perfect, isn't a good thing. You see it quite a lot on discussion boards dedicated to specific games. Some try to shut down critique of a game, saying that the board is for fans only, and if you don't like it then you shouldn't play it, have bought it, shouldn't ruin other people's fun, etc.
TheoAllen
TheoAllen
Eh, sometimes the flaws are neglectable and they didn't notice or didn't mind if it exists. So they never mention. "It is fine the way it is". Most of the time, when discussing game dev, I'm just like agree to disagree and to each on their own. Now, if they actually present the game and want feedback, that's a different matter. The product and context are here to be assessed.

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