A free demo to commercial.

[Gothic Lolita]

I'm planing to do a free demo and go later commercial.
Could this turn out well?

I want to implement the complete basic gameplay, which I planned. So it's possible to have a look at all the things.
So everyone can see what you can do and if it's fun. But to complete the stuff, you need to buy.

It's because I need to clear some licence issues I will run into first.
If I wouldn't get any licence, I will stay free. If I get the licence, I would sell it.

I know, I asked it allready on my profile, but I got told, that might others could be interrested in it too. (\s/)

 

[♥SOURCE♥]

Could this turn out well?

Why not? I would suggest stating to your players that the final version of your game could end up being commercial. 

 

[EternalShadow]

A lot of commercial games have a free demo.

 

[Shaz]

Going to move this to Commercial Discussion


It depends on what you mean by "free demo". If you only mean the first hour or so (or allow to play until reaching a certain point), and then pay for further play, this is the standard shareware model under which most games are sold.


If you mean create a free complete version of your game, then once you have all the licensing stuff taken care of, release the same thing commercially, that's probably going to have a few more problems.


You could certainly promote it as "free until a certain date" or something like that and let people know in advance that you plan to charge for it down the track. That would go a long way to avoiding complaints about "why do I have to pay for it when you were previously giving it away? I'll just get a pirated copy."


If, however, you mean a full version of the game and then when you get the licensing stuff taken care of, make changes to the game so you're releasing an upgraded version commercially, that would be okay too. Just make sure people know the differences between the free and paid version (and that it's not easy for them to grab the resources from the paid version and shove them into the free version to get around your payment requirement).

 

[Andar]

Another point:


I suggest waiting with the demo release until the game is almost complete.


If you release a demo and the players will have to wait a year until you have the full version ready, almost all interest from the demo will have faded away.

 

[Gothic Lolita]

It depends on what you mean by "free demo". If you only mean the first hour or so (or allow to play until reaching a certain point), and then pay for further play, this is the standard shareware model under which most games are sold.

If you mean create a free complete version of your game, then once you have all the licensing stuff taken care of, release the same thing commercially, that's probably going to have a few more problems.

You could certainly promote it as "free until a certain date" or something like that and let people know in advance that you plan to charge for it down the track. That would go a long way to avoiding complaints about "why do I have to pay for it when you were previously giving it away? I'll just get a pirated copy."

If, however, you mean a full version of the game and then when you get the licensing stuff taken care of, make changes to the game so you're releasing an upgraded version commercially, that would be okay too. Just make sure people know the differences between the free and paid version (and that it's not easy for them to grab the resources from the paid version and shove them into the free version to get around your payment requirement).

1. That's the way I allways meant it, but writen it a bit dumb

2. If I would do it that way, I might would make may only one path playable instead of all.

3. There is actually a small problem I see for myself, because if I say it migh get commercial. Some might say in advance, they don't play it, because I have to pay in the end for it anyway. :/

    But if I don't mention it, then the people may get the way you're saying. :/

    That's why I thought about a free version too, because I really don't know, if my qualities are good enough for selling. :/

4. I guess to avoid piracy, the encryption scripts and the editor encryption is a way to do it.

    One thing that would be only in the full version, will be for sure Steam Achievements, because I'm planning to greenlight it too.

I making you hard work with all the moving stuff in the forum with my wrong posts, really sorry for that. :'(

Another point:

I suggest waiting with the demo release until the game is almost complete.

If you release a demo and the players will have to wait a year until you have the full version ready, almost all interest from the demo will have faded away.

I thought so one time too, because people losing very quick interrests in things. :/

But I was thinking about updating the demo to a certain point and then say, full version release at xx.xx.xxxx. Or is that a bad idea? (\s/)

Sorry for the late reply, but had a lot of problems today, so I couldn't answer that fast. :'( /)

 

[whitesphere]

If you're not sure your game is good enough to sell, you could post a thread for the Demo here, and ask playtesters their honest opinions.  You could also purchase some of the commercial RPG Maker games and see how yours fares.

I know, myself, I have a long way to go before any game I make would be something I'd consider commercial quality.

 

[Gothic Lolita]

Well, I wouldn't spend my minimum of amount of money I call my own on bad or mediocore games. :/
I could be often happy, if I got 10€/12,42$ a month that's left for me...

I wish there would be more commercial games on Steam Greenlight, because it's easier to buy there.
You only need to buy a steam wallet and then the games you want instead of any creditcard numbers and stuff. (\s/)

 

[Andar]

But I was thinking about updating the demo to a certain point and then say, full version release at xx.xx.xxxx. Or is that a bad idea?

yes and no...
If you can release at date X that is no problem.


However, Betatesting and Bughunting usually needs the same time as creating the game - and if you don't keep that in mind, you're not going to make that date. And not keeping a promised date for release will hurt your credibility.


No one cares if it's a week later, but if you place that date too early in the development process, you'll either have an incomplete game or need months of more work to make it bugfree.


If you don't have completed a game yet (including bughunting), then you won't have the experience to estimated the time needed. So if this is your first game, wait until it is complete and you start bughunting before giving out any date for release or a demo.

 

[Gothic Lolita]

I have experienced that allready, have made some Games In A Week and failed, because I didn't left enough time for bughunting. :/
But well, I have it allready experienced it, made a part in 100 hour and the bugfixing was around 50 hours, so I kinda know that point.

I also get sometimes mad at programmers from greenlight, if they say like march.2014 and you look on steam and they still not appeared there.
So I get the point, that you should set a realistic release date. (\s/)

 

[Geoff Moore]

I'd definitely read this before you post a demo, though you can see from the comments that not everyone agrees with the article.

 

[Gothic Lolita]

That's a bump. :/
I thought it will help the people to decide, if a game is good or not...
Wait, may there is the problem, because some will say: "Devinitivly not worth the money."
With only a trailer you can say: "That looks interresting, I want to play it." (\s/)

 

[whitesphere]

I've heard the way to make a good estimate for time to develop is take your estimate, then double it.

So if you think you have 2 months left, make it a 4 month estimate.

Also, friendly playtesters are invaluable and will find bugs you've missed.

*Edit*

I read the link that mostly useless put up and a page of the comments.   Basically, the moral of the story seems to be, if you release a demo, it has to be a GOOD demo.  Some devs release poor quality demos which hurt sales.  Several of the comments said how they wouldn't even look at a game that didn't have a demo, because they need to be able to try it out first.

But, On The Other Hand, they also said RPGs are the hardest to convey through a demo.  So it sounds like a wash.

 

[Andar]

The cases of demos helping or hurting are very simple to explain:


A good demo for a good game helps a lot - everything else hurts the sales.


If the demo is bugged or badly selected from the game, no one will be interested in the game anymore, even if you solved the bugs (maximum is that they might purchase it much later after others have checked and proven the bugs are gone)


If the demo works perfectly, then the player will be able to learn what the game really is about - and if that game is bad or not to their interest, then they won't purchase it.


The problem is the second half - a lot of new game developers have a let's say inflated opinion about their capacities and their stories/games.


Then they claim that the demo hurt the sales of their perfect game and that they could have sold more games if the demo wasn't there.


Unfortunately that is the same as saying: The game can only be sold if no one knows that it's crap...


And as soon as you sold one crap game under false hypes, your name is reduced for the next sale - do it two or three times and you'll never sell under that name again.


No one ever said that game developing is a way to fast money (at least no one who cared for their players) and getting a good reputation will take some time, during which you will have slow sales. If you target that, good demos will show the true quality of your games (be they are good or crap).

 

[Gothic Lolita]

Several of the comments said how they wouldn't even look at a game that didn't have a demo, because they need to be able to try it out first.

That's what I prefer too, if I'm unsure about a game, then I want a demo. On steam are tons of game, which I want to play a demo first, before paying it with the bit of money I got.

I rarely even buy games without demos anymore. (\s/)

If the demo is bugged or badly selected from the game, no one will be interested in the game anymore, even if you solved the bugs (maximum is that they might purchase it much later after others have checked and proven the bugs are gone)

Unfortunately that is the same as saying: The game can only be sold if no one knows that it's crap...

And as soon as you sold one crap game under false hypes, your name is reduced for the next sale - do it two or three times and you'll never sell under that name again.

1. I agree, if I think about the "Reverse Side Demo". It crashed a lot, no checkpoints, no save games and only about 15 minutes gameplay. It looked to me like a visual demo. 

2. Sometimes I start to think, that's the way big companies like Square Enix is thinking these days. If I think about FF 13-2, Lightning Returns.

    But some are making pretty awesome games, with good demos, like "The Evil Within". <3

3. If I would really fail badly with the first game, I may don't even try a second one. It's not like I'm a professional programmer, so it's more a desperated try to save my messed up life and situation. :/

EXTRA:

I might will stay with a demo, that allready let the player have a look of the beginning from the 6 stories. 

They also will have a look at many game aspects, that will be added as bonus.

But I will let some surprises left for the full version. Also the stories will be way more extended, then they are in the demo. (\s/)

 

[bgillisp]

Maybe you should do what some of the others have done on here that released a commercial game? I think they restrict the demo to about 1.5 to 2 hours of playtime (approximate). That should be enough to let others decide how they feel about your game hopefully. I know once my game is final if I decide to release it as commercial chapter 1 is going to be the demo for the game (as that is going to be about 2 hours of play time in my game it looks like). Might even increase it a little as the game is planned for 6 - 9 chapters (depends on if I decide to add the last twist I have planned, or just call it a wrap when chapter 6 ends).

 

[whitesphere]

To add to what Andar said:

The sad irony is the ability to judge how good we are at something, like making RPGs, depends on our ability to make a good one.  If we are just starting out and can only make bad RPGs, we won't be able to honestly assess how good the game is.  Of course, when we can make (or at least recognize) really good RPGs, we can be utterly ruthless about our own creations, so it can go too far the other way.

If you ask a professional musician, s/he can probably tell you every spot where s/he made a mistake in a performance, but most of the audience probably didn't even notice.

So, overall, if your RPG is good, and you make a good demo, it will help or at least enable sales that wouldn't have happened otherwise.

 

[Gothic Lolita]

The next question is, how do I post it here?
Do I need to add the aprovement from Hasbro here too?
Or do I need to look an other way to sell it?

But as long as it isn't planned well I should wait.
Because they want these informations here:
http://www.hasbro.com/corporate-2/images/Hasbro-Permission-to-Use-request-form.pdf

Performance is okay for me, as long as I have 30 FPS, but most of the PC users want to see 60 FPS.
That could be a problem maybe too. :/

But all in all, I may start with simple trailers and after a longer time, when I got enough to play, I will add an demo. (\s/)

 

[Sharm]

Woah, wait, this is a fan game?  That changes everything, especially if it's an MLP game.  Hasbro's been defending their IP on games as hard as they can.  Absolutely get their permission before even doing a free game.  I doubt you'll get it but at least you won't be blindsided by getting a C&D or being sued.

FYI, the policy here is that we don't support anything that violates copyright or IP laws but if you want to post a game that does that's all on you.  So technically, no, you don't need Hasbro's permission before posting it here.

 

[Gothic Lolita]

I also seen a lot of free stuff disapear, but there are a lot of free MLP RPG's out there. That's why I thought free is okay.

For commercial I was allready informed, that you need a permission. They also want as much video material, demos and stuff you can get together.
Plus they need a huge discription about what will be in the game. What does C&D mean?
Not really in common with the short stuff like CC and stuff. (\s/)