About *******

[JtheDuelist]

I hear a lot of people say good things about *******, and almost every video about the topic on YT says you should start one as soon as possible. My question is "Should I?". I can't work a full time or even a part time job due to disability, so I usually can't fund myself for better hardware and software (heck, it is why I have to use the laptop I keep referring to as a '2005 hand-me-down toaster", use only free art, video, and audio software, a heavily used condition pen tablet, had to wait until Steam's winter sale to get MV for $20, and currently only plan on uploading games to itch.io since I can't afford Steam DirecTV's fee). That being said, I always work on my projects every single day, and usually keep my already very small but built fanbase updated on progress on a weekly to biweekly basis, so they know I put my heart into my projects. Just curious if I should set one up or not.

Also, follow-up question- can ******* donations be sent directly to a PayPal account instead of a credit card? (This is more of a question my dad would ask me)

 

[Kes]

You might find some of the posts in this thread helpful, as it is dealing with a similar query.

 

[JtheDuelist]

@Kes I already read that before I made this. I didn't find the answers I needed.

 

[bgillisp]

My thoughts:

1: If you set one up, you could gain money. If you don't, you will always have $0 in income. So I'd say take a shot at it...

however....

2: If you are on disability checks make sure having one isn't a violation of your checks. I know there is a certain income level in the US where they cut you off if you make more than that in a given year, so you may wish to find out what that limit is (I think it is $15,000 a year, but might be off). I just point that out as it says you are in the USA on your location so will be something to check out if the income from ******* could have implications on that.

 

[JtheDuelist]

@bgillisp I think my limit is around $5000 since I don't work.

 

[Matseb2611]

It's generally a good place to post updates even if you don't get all that much from it. It can replace a blog easily and allow your fans to keep track of your progress. And as mentioned already, getting some money from it is better than no money.

If I may give some advice regarding backer rewards - choose the kind of rewards you know won't take a lot of your time to make (or money), otherwise it would defeat the purpose of *******. You need your time and money on the main craft you're there for (game-making), so rewards should be simple enough that they don't distract you from game-making.
Or you can just be entirely transparent and let the backers know that there aren't any special rewards for higher tier backers and that those tiers only exist if people want to give you more support than just $1 a month. If you are honest about that, nobody will come to bite your head off.

 

[JtheDuelist]

@Matseb2611 If I did do it was thinking something like this.

Tier 1- $1: Name in the credits of all games I make
Tier 2- $3: Tier 1 + Name being refenced by a random NPC in all games
Tier 3- $10: Tier 1 + a full NPC cameo in all games rather than just being referenced by a random NPC
Tier 4- $20: Tier 1 and 3 + early access to demos before demos go public
Tier 5- $40: Tier 1, 3, and 4 + your NPC cameo also serving as a secret boss in games
Tier 6- $75: Tier 1, 3, 4, and 5 + get a full copy of every game before they go public
Tier 7- $100: All the above + Get to design a unique enemy by you for every game + A personal Patron highlight page on the Downfall FES Wiki (the page being written just for you by me)

 

[Shaz]

I'd reconsider your higher tiers. You're promising something, forever, for what will ultimately be a small contribution. If someone gives you $100 they get to design a unique enemy in every future game you make. Where's the incentive to make another donation? What if you eventually get 100 people who donate $100? That means you HAVE to have 100 unique enemies in every single game. The more people who donate that amount, the more your next game is being designed around the enemies, and that isn't good. Having 100 enemies because you promised 100 people they could design an enemy, is not a good reason to have 100 enemies. And what if their enemies just don't suit your game?

If someone gives you $75, you're going to give them every game you ever make. Where's the incentive for them to make another donation?

If someone gives you $40 (and you'll have a lot more of these, than people who give you $100), you're making them a secret boss. So in addition to all the unique enemies people get to make up, you'll have that many bosses in your game , they'll outweigh the regular enemies.

Big rethink required there, I suggest. Give them something special to say thanks, but don't promise away your future game design or income.

 

[JtheDuelist]

@Shaz I was going to set the limit of highest tier donators to like 7 or something. As for the rest, that was just an on-the-spot idea, not my final idea.

 

[Shaz]

That's still promising an awful lot, for every game you ever make. Is that the kind of reward other people give? Are you putting yourself in a position where you're not going to enjoy making the game because of the pressure you've put on yourself with these promises?

I'd look more along the lines of giving something that's easier to produce/fulfil, and removing the limit or making it much higher.

 

[JtheDuelist]

@Shaz Again, this was just on-the-spot, so I haven't set anything in stone yet...

 

[Shaz]

Yeah, I'm just saying to put some more thought into it before putting it up. Consider what kind of commitment you'd be forcing yourself into with each one. You don't have any memorabilia listed there, and that's pretty easy to set up and cheap to produce. Here are some examples:

A mouse mat with your company/game logo for a $40 donation
A mug with your company/game logo for a $60 donation
A t-shirt with your company/game logo for a $100 donation

I don't know how realistic those prices are, but those are things you can create once and then order as many or as often as you need to. And as you make more games, if you have returning fans, they may well give you another $60 each time you do a game, just to have the whole set of mugs. I know people who would do that.

Look around and see what others are offering. Do similar, but also go for something that sets you a bit apart.

 

[JtheDuelist]

@Shaz I could always make smaller tiers first then add ones that involve that kind of stuff later that are higher up or something.

A possible rework (again just on-the-spot):

T1 ($1)- Name in the end credits of games, YT vids, and my RMW forum signature
T2 ($5)- T1 + NPC cameo appearance
T3 ($10)- T1 & T2 + Be a beta tester
T4 ($15)- T1-T3 + early access to demo versions
T5 ($30 - Limited to 20 people only-)- T1-T4 + download key to the first game that comes out after your first pledge (IE: you pledge on 10/1, but the next game comes out on 12/1- you get a download key for that game only - you have to buy the others that come out after it or the ones that came out before it, assuming the game is paid for- if next game is free to play, the key is for the next pay to play one)
T6 ($70 -Limited to 5 people only-)- T1-T5 + Design a secret boss for a game

Do these sound more reasonable before adding memorabilia stuff?

 

[Shaz]

yeah, they do, at least to me.

You're not giving your beta testers a free copy of the game? That's pretty standard - every time I've beta tested a game (20+, for established indie studios, not individuals or startups), I've always received a free copy. But if you did that, it would invalidate T5.

 

[JtheDuelist]

@Shaz I know a few people who beta tested my older RPG Maker stuff just for fun because they loved RPGs. Though T5 may cover T3 and inspire them to go just a bit higher knowing they get a free game for a bit more. I think this rework makes more sense for my working conditions and still provides people something (because, hey, some people may like to brag to a friend saying "Hey, guess what? I'm getting to cameo in a game!") Again, I'm just an individual, so I can't afford free copies to all the testers- at least not yet, anyway.

 

[Shaz]

Sure you can - they cost you nothing! And these people are helping you in a massive way!

 

[Matseb2611]

Yeah, definitely set a limit to those higher tier rewards, and also, for providing incentive for someone to keep supporting you over long-term, make the rewards monthly in nature rather than 1-off. For example, for a $10 reward tier, I post a new monthly desktop wallpaper in theme of one of my games at the start of each month. They don't take me long to make, and since it's a new one each month, there is some incentive for people to keep supporting you.

Another good thing is providing behind the scenes content for backers of a certain tier, whether it's a post delving into detail of a game you're working on or even a short video to showcase a snippet of development process. Fans can enjoy that kind of stuff.

I know some devs also engage with their fans by having a monthly multiplayer session with them on some game (usually for higher tier rewards and limited, or else you might run out of time if too many people want this).

 

[JtheDuelist]

@Matseb2611 Yeah, that's another idea I had during the night, as well as maybe monthly avatars of characters from my games, as well.

I've already been providing my fanbase with bits of play test footage, but doing video of my actual creation process seems interesting- I don't have a mic, so that might off put some people.

And is it sad the only multiplayer games I play on a regular basis are Unison League, Splatoon 2 (rarely), and Monster Hunter Generations? My multiplayer options are much smaller than others, so this would be an extremely rare reward if I did it.

Edit: And I already have two goals in mind at the time being- finally upgrading my PC after 13 years so my development process doesn't slow down to frequent lag that I usually suffer using a 2005 laptop (goal 1) as well as being able to afford to get my first game's remake up on Steam (goal 2- my first game can be played on the 3DS's RPG Maker Fes Player).

 

[Matseb2611]

Yeah, avatars or any other similar assets like banners and the like can be very nice.
If recording the development process footage will be trouble due to no mic, you can always for now just make it as a regular post with screenshots and some behind the scenes info that you don't normally share to the public.
Yeah, I'm no multiplayer gamer either, so I can understand that. Just thought I'd suggest it anyway since some devs have that as a reward for fans.

 

[JtheDuelist]

@Matseb2611 And I think you just gave me goal 3- Get a mic (or a set of good headphones with a mic attachment). My uncle from New York makes gaming computers for living, so I can get one a bit cheaper from him than elsewhere. Good thing my family is headed up that way at the end of April to deliver some furniture to family up there (my dad helps out at a local furniture store, even though his main job is a freelance florist)- maybe my uncle will let me help him and get hands-on if I order a gaming computer from him (I'm about $150 from meeting his quoted price, so I'm getting there- been saving Christmas and birthday money for the last two to three years).