Bad Reputation of RPG Maker

Discussion in 'Video Games' started by dulsi, Feb 10, 2019.

  1. TheoAllen

    TheoAllen Self-proclaimed jack of all trades Veteran

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    I did hear that some Unity games got backlash too for using asset flips, so it happens to other engines as well. However, I don't join their community, so couldn't point out how many.
     
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  2. bgillisp

    bgillisp Global Moderators Global Mod

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    That is true. Jim Sterling had a video series going where he did nothing but play Unity Asset flips. Many were really bad too, though there were a couple that I'd say had some promise of a good game in there, just not many.

    Incidentally, Player Unknown Battlegrounds uses pre-bought assets, and has come under flak for using them from time to time.
     
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  3. Powerise

    Powerise Veteran Veteran

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    Maybe, lots rpg maker games with costum sprites and graphic, and different plugins still loved by rpg fans...
     
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  4. Mordridakon

    Mordridakon I am a dragon! Veteran

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    RPG Maker is a tool, it can be used for good games and terrible games. Obviously its reputation comes from the deluge of quickly made bad games, which can be easily made because the engine is easy to use, not the occasional gem.
    Anyone can make a bad game, but it takes talent and hard work to make a good one.
     
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  5. Gallimed

    Gallimed Villager Member

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    I'd say it's because people feel a big disdain if they see the normal RTP graphics, or something akin to the RPG Maker style. For them this is just a big red flag that the game doesn't have anything revolutionary and won't stand out from the rest. You could have a great story but having these graphics, or even tracing on these graphics won't have people come soaring to your game

    You then have games like Yume Nikki and OFF that features entirely custom made graphics which will drive people to try the game, and make a fandom out of them.

    If you look at LISA: The painful, you don't see how it was make in RPG Maker because it's like a platformer. You only see how it was made in RPG Maker when you enter a combat, and even then the combat has it own system that stands out

    With all that said, RPG Maker can be great. You could not know how to code and make something amazing. It just that people wants graphics that stands out so it doesn't scream "RPG MAKER" on first glance
     
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  6. Seacliff

    Seacliff RPG Maker Mastermind Veteran

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    I don't have an issue with RPG Maker games using the RTP, but I think the more ambitious a game is, the more of a hindrance the RTP will become. This extends to the use of stock or common store assets in general.

    You can promise great gameplay or a great story, but you can't prove that until after you convince someone to play your game. Many RPG Maker using RTP games tried to make that promise, and not all of them delivered. A 'hook' is needed, and the only thing a player can really know about a game before playing it is how it looks.

    Jim Sterling did have a really interesting video in partial defense of store assets though. In short, they are a great tool for independent developers to fill in the gaps of skill they cannot provide themselves. The problem becomes more severe when you see the same assets across dozen of games, but even then a simple skill in editing or a unique approach can go a long way.

    He held a small contest regarding a model of a Spider with a bulb of a human head he constantly sees in asset flips. Since he believes the overuse of the design made it lose its 'charm', he asked his viewers to make any can of edits to the model they could, no matter how large or small, to make the design more interesting again.

    There were a lot of creative submissions, but the winner of the contest used the model as a level for a stage rather than using the model as a generic enemy. Jim praised the submission for taking a unique approach without having to really edit the model itself.
     
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  7. bgillisp

    bgillisp Global Moderators Global Mod

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    @Seacliff : Yep, I saw that video too. Premade assets can be good if used well. The problem is few use them well.

    To be fair, AAA games promise this too, and they often fail to deliver. I think the consumers as a whole are just jaded right now in general.
     
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  8. Seacliff

    Seacliff RPG Maker Mastermind Veteran

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    True, but AAA games can have hundreds of people behind them. And they can have conflicting visions on what they want to achieve with a project. Simply hiring a team of talent 3D artists for them is as simple as throwing enough money the right talented people, which probably isn't even that much in comparison to the larger budget.

    I think the promise is weighted more if it comes from a small team, or just one person. If someone is skilled with drawing, I can trust their artistic expertise might carry over into writing or game design as well, or at least that they are working with people equally as skilled in those areas.
     
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  9. VisitorsFromDreams

    VisitorsFromDreams Veteran Veteran

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    I think the biggest issue with RTP when it comes to the promise of a unique game experience is that if you have seen the RTP before the game inherently feels less unique right off the bat. If the visuals arent unique how can I really know as a consumer that any other aspect of the game experience is actually unique?

    It also means the game doesnt have its own voice, AAA games might fail to deliver more often then not in a lot of ways but atleast you can recognize most games at a glance from their visuals, you cant do that with most RTP games. At first glance most RTP games looks the same as any other RTP games, theres nothing to distinguish those projects at face value. The content might be nothing like other titles but its generally impossible to tell without taking the time to play them and thats a risk of both time and sometimes money that most people arent (and shouldnt have to be willing) to make.
     
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  10. Lonewulf123

    Lonewulf123 Veteran Veteran

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    I think someone on the first page said this and I agree with it as well. Most people see rpg maker as a hobbyist tool first and foremost, and for that reason many people will never see anything made with it as “legit”.

    Quite sad because the engine doesn’t matter. The truth is, many people hate rpg maker games for things you should really fault devs for: lazy reuse of assets, poor story telling and gameplay, and more. All of these things aren’t unique to rpg maker, but because it’s easy to use their are more rpg maker games with these qualities.
     
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  11. Jhale M.

    Jhale M. Goddess of health, purity and truth. Veteran

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    I think if the dislike for RPG Maker comes from Steam users, then you should feel mad. Steam is full of people writing unrealistic opinions because many of them are just outright trolling and joking instead of reviewing. This is a big part Steam's fault because you are required to review a game in order to rate it. This results in me believing many games are bad because good reviews can be a lot more simple, fake and seemingly uninformed while negative reviews are larger and more exhaustive many times. But at the end of the day, I decide to mostly judge games on what I have experienced through playing them and I feel that is the only reliable way to judge Steam games.

    In my opinion, Steam will soil the opinions on tons of games and companies whether or not a lot of hard work was put into them. It seems like the best way to get people to play your games whether they like them or not is to add trading cards to them because Steam's level up system requires the use of trading cards and I have started to focus on games that have trading cards as well. And of course, don't expect your game to sell itself. Every RPG Maker game is basically obligated to be advertised well to make up for the more accessible design process that was used. If people only see the bad games from the community due to low price and the better games being high price without much advertisement, there will probably never be a good reputation of the engine's capabilities.

    If you are very serious about using an underappreciated or disliked method of developing something, you are going to need the courage, integrity and stubbornness to keep pushing your releases and make them as marketable and well known as possible. I think the one thing that saves RPG Maker games is when their art is strikingly different. Unfortunately, RPG Maker is mostly known for artistic design and that's what gets most recognized, rather than good gameplay and story. Then again, we can expect from this age that a lot of things are judged on first impression as we have a lot of information to go through in life and if the most important aspects are not quickly or immediately notable, then you won't sell people on it.
     
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  12. HayateKung

    HayateKung Villager Member

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    Use the best tool for your job, that's what I've been told about regarding my concern about this. I was really skeptical at first, but seeing the limited time I have, I decided to just go for it.
     
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