Battle Choreography

[KanaX]

Does anybody happen to have a source of insight regarding battle choreography, as we get to see it on the small/big screen and games? Do you have any personal experience with it? Please feel free to share anything related.

 

[Alexander Amnell]

   When I was younger I participated in a few martial arts demo teams, first in taekwondo then later in Krav Maga. I don't know what you specifically want insight into, I guess the first thing that comes to mind is it's all BS really, whether Hollywood trying to sell films, or martial artists trying to attract more bodies into the dojo there is virtually nothing you'll find as a student in those flashy demonstrations of perfectly choreographed movements and dance-like fluidity that'll translate into helpful in an actual physical confrontation, at the end of the day it's pretty much ballet while waving weapons around. 


   Don't get me wrong, it's a lot of fun to participate in and the flash does have a great entertainment value if that's all you are going for, but if you are at all looking for realism you're barking(or meowing) up the wrong tree. The way most rpgmaker games do it, where a couple of slash animations play and then someone is on the ground is probably a more realistic view on actual combat than any actual choreography you can think of.

 

[KanaX]

Since my current project in rather weak in terms of gameplay, I'm working on a bastardized version of QTE that keeps a level of challenge while, at the same time, it allows me to go for some visually impressive scenes. Definitely not "a couple of slash animations play and then someone is on the ground ".


I can deal with the animations pretty well, but I want to gather knowledge on what to animate.


1.Where do I start my process?


2.For how many parameters should I account for? (example: members of combat, environment, random factor, continuity, "realism")


3.Where do I give emphasis?
4.Are there any stages that I need to nail down?
5.How do I come up with what's the best possible sequence.


6. How do I keep the dynamic exchange between my elements going and when/why/how do I change it?


If anyone who has ever tampered with the concept, (or read something related) could give me some input, I would appreciate it.


EDIT: And no, I'm not looking for realism. I'm going all anime up in here. Yes, I will obviously obey the rules of my universe and I'll have to keep a scaling system for the capacity for the characters (DBZ is a known anime which fails horribly in this department. There are characters that can blow up planets introduced within the first 20 episodes of the anime and hundreds of episodes later, when their capacity for destruction has increased a thousand-fold, they still just kinda break rocks).

 

[Alexander Amnell]

   So you are talking more about how to choreograph via animation than a discussion of the choreography itself. That makes more sense.


   The most important thing to consider is spacing (look up the centerline theory for a plethera of more insightful responses than I could give, both in staging and reality), as it has an adverse effect on what you can do and how it is perceived to others. A big portion of fighting (pertaining to hand to hand or non-projectile weapons) is spacing, keeping the opponent out of your space and trying to get into theirs. The problem where realism is concerned there is that it's far to easy to just invade your opponents space and diverge the fight into a ground brawl or run them into a wall or a tree or any number of environmental hazards...which is not at all pretty most of the time. While choreographed exchanges usually revolve more around the 'opponents' testing each other with pass after pass before the victor breaks into the opponents space for one decisive clean deathblow. (which is another deviation from reality, where such clean-cut ends are rare and extremely difficult to pull off to such perfection or else near impossible in regards to hand to hand) Luckily since this is animation were talking about that opens up a lot of doors and means you don't have to worry so much about environmental factors since you create the environment yourself and can tailor it to the needs of your scenes.


   Another consideration is the weapons used. Probably the best thing to do once you've chosen that is to study said weapons extensively, learn where their advantages and disadvantages lie and watch how actual practitioners use the weapons in their forms (not choreography, just the weapon use itself to learn how it should animate and how it should not be) as a model for your animations. There are few things that kill the immersion of a fight scene for me faster than when I know a weapon is used improperly for dramatic effect (cutting someone open with the blunt end of a sword, parrying with the actual edge or people just banging their blades together repeatedly as if that wouldn't result in one or both of the weapons splintering into uselessness in real life)


   As for emphasis, since you are referring to this in reference to quick time events I think the focal point for when a qte would pop up would be the end of each pass. a few exploratory blows to be parried, dodged etc for entertainment value as each opponent seeks an opening culminating in an attack by the opponent with the qte flashing right beforehand and if pressed allows your character to parry or otherwise evade the blow or respond with an attack of their own, if not the opponent breaks your center and either maims or kills you. I think a cool mechanic for such a representation might be found in a sort of stamina/adrenaline system where at the end of each pass the loser loses a bar of stamina (probably no more than two or three bars each in the most intense of confrontations to keep it from dragging on to long) whereas if you perform the qte correctly on an opponent without adrenaline you get a deathblow, if he has some you break his guard and injure him (subtracting adrenaline) and the two break contact for a moment before going in for another pass, with the rules working in reverse for when the player fails the qte so that you can have cinematic qte events without the general frustration of instakills for failure that turn players off of games like EOE and Resident evil whenever they use them.

 

[KanaX]

This is some solid advice. Thank you. As for the penalty of the QTE failure, I definitely need to consider what you said. My initial attitude (3 years ago) was "Yeah, yeah the more deaths the better", but now I think that I'd rather focus on immersion.

I don't expect people to have good reflexes, or be on their toes constantly. The purpose of the system (the way I imagine it will work) is just something to make to experience more fun, with some timing and controllable spacing interacting with the QTE buttons. But still, I guess that a death at the wrong place and time will throw off the mood a great deal.