Composing and Arrangement

[creation27]

Hi guys, thought I'd registered the forum seeing there are some very talented composers on here making music for video games. I recently became interested in making music for gaming, and I need to experience something different. I have tried to make my own piece but I always end up throwing it away afterwards. My struggle is I don't know how to write song. I can play the keyboard real good but I'm suck at composing. I also know a little bit about music theory, although I am not classical trained. I cannot read film score or music sheets. I only play by ear. My strongest personal conviction right now is that if I can learn how to write music, then I can compose a piece to call it my own. Yet, I always end up imitating others. I don't have originality. I mean... I know which instruments to use, but I don't lknow how to make them compliment each other. In other words, each instrument by itself is like kissing each other and talking with each other.

The biggest struggle for me is putting them all into a constructive arrangement with little details here and there - if you know what I mean. So with all that said, I would like to ask for some advice on how to do this. I don't really have an "idol" composer(s) that I look up to, but I am also an RPG addict and really love those Japanese music, like in Xenogears, Chriono Trigger, Final Fantasy etc. Those were the old days.

 

[Quigon]

Well here's a secret of mine - I literally can't for the life of me read any kind of music notation (save for piano roll MIDI stuff), so most of my songs are quite trial and error by ear. Imitation, while not something to aspire to do forever, is a good start. Immerse yourself in all the music you want to write one day, whether it be classical, techno, rock, whatever - and just hammer on. Look up tutorials and watch videos on arrangements, just give it your all. You won't get far if you don't commit to really going for it, and that takes time and practice. There's not really a 'shortcut' to good composition - it's just something that comes naturally with time.

 

[Jonnie91]

Well here's a secret of mine - I literally can't for the life of me read any kind of music notation (save for piano roll MIDI stuff), so most of my songs are quite trial and error by ear. Imitation, while not something to aspire to do forever, is a good start. Immerse yourself in all the music you want to write one day, whether it be classical, techno, rock, whatever - and just hammer on. Look up tutorials and watch videos on arrangements, just give it your all. You won't get far if you don't commit to really going for it, and that takes time and practice. There's not really a 'shortcut' to good composition - it's just something that comes naturally with time.

^What he said

It doesn't matter whether you have all the music knowledge (although sometimes it helps) musical theory is good...but it doesn't make a good composition. making a track FEEL right is the secret to good composition, if you put your heart and soul into the piece and it sounds relatively decent. then that's how to make a good composition. 

Although, that doesn't mean it'll be easy xD it will be tough you will be pulling out your hair, and screaming at your screen, and at yourself...that could just be me though 

Researching the interwebs for tutorials helps a lot, but it can only give you the tools, you need to use your imagination to compose amazing music  

 

[djDarkX]

Oh, a JRPG fan?  Sweet.  I can pawn off my music on you! lol

In all seriousness, I listen by ear since I can't do notation either, but I usually take my time when I reproduce music from the SNES/Gameboy(Advance)/Genesis/Playstation/N64 systems.  It's not easy sometimes, but worth the payout.  By the way, nowadays most people, even professionals, "mimic" a style, a song or create their own style based on something else.  Coming up with something ENTIRELY new is extremely hard especially with the way music has become so saturated with songs/compositions.

Your best bet, in my honest opinion, is to listen to what you like, get inspired, think of music you'd like to write, hum it and record yourself then transcribe that to notation or a piano roll in your favorite sequencing software.  I currently have a piece recorded in Audition, but have yet to transcribe it into music in FL Studio.

Also, you can re-arrange music you really love and remaster it in your own style, with added phrases, measures, articulations, etc.  A good example is me taking the battle theme from Final Fantasy III (not VI) and making it into a faster Symphonic Rock/Metal piece when the original was just square waves on the NES...which I did. lol

Anyway, that's my take on it.  Good luck!

 

[diamond16]

First off, welcome!

Secondly, don't be afraid to borrow from existing songs while you are learning. You can learn a lot about structure, melody and harmony by deconstructing a piece.

You said you played keyboard? Take a piece that you can play really really well and just play the left hand. You are going to recreate the melody using the right hand. This will give you an existing chord progression to work from so you can just focus on composing a memorable melody.

Don't worry about other instruments at the moment, you know the inner workings of your instrument and what sounds good and bad on it.

To work on harmony, take an existing melody and try experimenting with chords to create a completely unique progression.

Treat these like training exercises. You might not end up with a finished product but you will be honing your skills.

Keep practicing!

 

[creation27]

I thank you all for trying to help, but I guess it is imposible to compose a song without knowing music theory. I think what I need to do is pick up a book on music theory and composing that is related to ochestral. The way I play the keyboard isn't classical. I consider myself more of urban worship type of stuff, chord progression, diminished, triads ( root, third, 5th, and 7th). To me, gaming and filming are almost the same composition and it is way too HARD! In gaming and filming there's a lot of stuff going on that I'm not even familar with in the type of chord progression that I already know. Very hard. They are different level.

 

[Quigon]

I thank you all for trying to help, but I guess it is imposible to compose a song without knowing music theory. I think what I need to do is pick up a book on music theory and composing that is related to ochestral. The way I play the keyboard isn't classical. I consider myself more of urban worship type of stuff, chord progression, diminished, triads ( root, third, 5th, and 7th). To me, gaming and filming are almost the same composition and it is way too HARD! In gaming and filming there's a lot of stuff going on that I'm not even familar with in the type of chord progression that I already know. Very hard. They are different level.

What program are you using? Like I said before, I'm extremely lacking on the music theory sound of things. I find that using programs with a piano roll function is helpful in that respect, as they allow a greater level of writing simply by ear, and what sounds good.

If you decided to write music in Sibelius though, you'd have a harder time.

Seriously though, don't be dissuaded due to a lack of theory knowledge - just dive in there and experiment. The results might be iffy, but I've always found the best way to learn something is just to do it.

 

[creation27]

I use Cubase for recording because it's easy to edit the cc and expression and all that stuff. I do it through my Korg M50 workstation keyboard and I also use it as a midi controller for third party plugins. I don't know what Sibelius does as I have never try it myself before.

Can somebody offer some advice on creating a musical argument? By that I mean like each instrument must be able to interact each other. Like I;ve said, I can play but I cannot come up with anything like an argument that will work well in it's entire context. Open to all suggestions. Most of what you guys are telling me is something I already know. But how do you guys do it though? Like..how do you guys do those small details part, fill-in, breaks, or whatever you call them. The song has to change right? It can't be repitivie all the time I assume.

 

[diamond16]

You need to know the chord sequence and know what notes fit with each chord. For example, with a C major chord, the notes are C, E and G.  Now, you're not just going to use those 3 notes, but your piece will sound a lot better if you use chord tones on the main beats (yes, there are exceptions to the rule, but you need to know the rules before you can break them).

Then you need to consider how your melody with progress through the chord changes. I might go from C Major to F major so my 'safe notes' are C,E,G and F,A,C so I may make the melody go from G (5th of C Major) to A (3rd of F major) to give the melody a strong tonal centre.

If you listen to my song Lion Manta Neath, I've built the whole thing up from one melodic idea and made the four individual brass parts work together to form a cohesive composition (excuse the horrible samples though )

 

[creation27]

That is a very nice piece of composition diamond! I was able to follow the lead melody for the right hand, but for the bassline you used an orchestra playing left hand in lower octave? I couldn't follow because the string seen to play very loud on top of it. I understand when you say I have to know which key to go with the chords. Your left hand is just the root key complimenting the right hand keys. As long as the left hand is in the same chord that is fine, I just make sure it is the lowest key. I also heard an tapamni playing a one hitter for the lower bass key too. The melody line is the same in the beginning..all you did was play it again but you change to an F, F#/Gb, G#/Ab on the second part - makes a huge difference in my ear.

That's creative! Same melody but different keys.

Now,  what is challenging to me is how you make the transition to something diminshed? I like that! I always thought about doing soomething like that for the transition but I don't know how. I guess you have to know the diminish keys in every scale?

 

[vanillacoke]

Music theory only goes so far... there is no right or wrong way to write good music.

Start by making a simple major scale chord progression and using notes within that chord write a melody.

The melody doesn't have to always be notes within the chord, however this is a very easy way to make your melody compliment the base structure of your music.

I often find myself playing the same 4 bars over and over and over, changing the melody ever so slightly until it feels right.

Don't be afraid to make changes to your piece, sometimes something will sound good then maybe seem a little out of place when moving on to the next section.

Sometimes simple is the way to go.

As for harmony, try adding harmony at several different steps to get exactly the feel you want from it.

Sometimes good music will take a lot of trial and error, other times it just hits you. Just keep at it. ^_^

Repetition of a nice catchy melody can make a piece stand out, but be careful not to overdo it.

Strings, in my opinion, are your best friend. They can be used as a faint, soothing, sad effect in the background. Or they can be used for short, quick, stabbing effects.

Depending on how you use them, pretty much any instrument can sound good together.