Dual and Double Attack not working

[zombiecharger65]

Hello all,

I must be doing something horribly wrong. I have only been using RPG Maker VX ACE for about 3 weeks now so I have hiccups every now and again.

Here is what I am trying to do.

I added skill type Dual Attack to Katanas, and Double Attack to Claws. When a player equips that item I want them to perform dual attack or double attack as their basic attack.

I searched the forums but found nothing useful. I found a script by Yanfly but that is not the route I want to take.

Equiping the weapon should give the skill to the player automatically but it does not.

I had to change the skill type on the skill from None to Special to even make it show up as a command. The player can use the skill even without it being added as a skill type on that actor or that class but yet it will not apply automatically.

Any ideas what I am doing wrong? Will it have to remain as a Special Skill or can it indeed become the main attack when that weapon is equipped?

Again, I do not want to use scripts of any kind in my game. I want it to be pure and basic.

 

[Engr. Adiktuzmiko]

Explain why yanfly's attack replace cannot be used in your case... AFAIK, it is one of the easiest that you can use for this...

I added skill type Dual Attack to Katanas, and Double Attack to Claws. When a player equips that item I want them to perform dual attack or double attack as their basic attack.

You add SKILL TYPE to the weapons then you wish that they will add SKILLS to the user?

 

[zombiecharger65]

I do not want to use scripts. That is the reason. What I want to know is why the add skill, when added to the weapon does not add the skill unless I flag it as a special skill and put it in that command box. There has to be a reason. This is a stock skill from the game itself, it is not one that I created, so there has to be a way to make it work. The skill itself comes out of the box as Skill Type None, but I had to make it a Special Skill to even get it to register in the battle system.

Anyone know why this is? It works just fine when I have applied it to enemies, why won't it work with the characters?

 

[Engr. Adiktuzmiko]

For the skill to show in the commands, your actor should have the skill type in his traits or his class traits... or the weapon should add that type along with the skill...

btw, if you want your weapon to use that as the default, you'd need scripts for that...

 

[zombiecharger65]

That is just it, even without the skills added to the actor, it works under special but will not show otherwise.

Also, I am unclear on this, but if I add skill type to a character, will that character always have that skill? I only want them to be able to use the skill when a specific weapon is equipped that has that skill as one of its benefits.

 

[zombiecharger65]

I double checked and by adding Dual Attack or Double Attack to a class or character, it is always there.

I guess I will just have to leave it as a special command then.

I just can't seem to understand why even if it comes as default with None for skill type, that it won't work unless it is under a special command. Scripting should not be needed for default game skills.

 

[Andar]

zombiecharger65, please avoid double posting, as it is against the forum rules. You can review our forum rules here. Thank you.

The reason for your problem is most likely that you're mixing up the definitions of skills and of skill types.

Skill types are groups of skills as a sorting mechanism for allowing different actors be assigned different kinds of skills fast.

The skill types are defined in the "Terms" tab of the database, default ones are "Special" and "Magic".. Many games change that to allow for different types of magic or different types of combat skills.

Skills themselves are the actions that can be used by the actors or by the monsters in the game

The battle command menu always consists of the base commands ATTACK and GUARD and all skill type menues that the current actor has available (skill types can be added by actor, by class, by equipment or by events).

When you select a skill type in combat, the engine moves to display all skills of that skill type that the actor has learned.

So in order to use a skill in battle, the actor needs both the skill and its skill type added - adding only the skill or only the skill type will not give the option to use the skill.

Skill type "None" means that only the enemies can use that (in the case of ATTACK and GUARD there are special overrides), because the skill type "none" is never added to the actor's battle command menu.

To change this structure of the command menu you need scripts - but as you said for yourself, this is not neccessary to use the skills. You just have to remember that to use a skill, the actor needs both the skill type and the skill added.

You might be interested in the following tutorial I once wrote (it is for advanced users, but it should be able to point you into the correct direction on how to use skill types and skills to achieve special customizations of skill selections:

http://forums.rpgmakerweb.com/index.php?/topic/10235-a-way-to-customize-skill-useconditions-without-scripting/

 

[zombiecharger65]

Thanks, Andar. I have simply settled on the work around of letting the skill just show up under special and sealing Attack when the weapon is equipped. I don't care for it but it does allow the player to know that it is a special skill and that a regular attack with that weapon is not possible.

I was able to leave the skill type as none, to not equip that skill to the actor or class and still have it useable.

Everyone on here loves to use scripts but I really want to leave the game engine as is. So far everything that I have wanted to do I have been able to without using scripts, it was just a matter of finding a way to work around the problem.

I appreciate all the feedback and suggestions. And thank you for the quick response. I think you can close this topic and mark it as solved.

 

[Andar]

Thanks, Andar. I have simply settled on the work around of letting the skill just show up under special and sealing Attack when the weapon is equipped. I don't care for it but it does allow the player to know that it is a special skill and that a regular attack with that weapon is not possible.

I was able to leave the skill type as none, to not equip that skill to the actor or class and still have it useable.

Your answer indicate that you still don't understand what skill types are - and it contradicts itself, because you cannot have both skill type "special" and skill type "none" under a single skill. If the skill type is "none", then that skill will never show up under "special" - so whatever is set to "none" in your skill, it is not the skill type. That is set to special if the skill apears under special during combat.

I suggest not using the "workaround" however it is done, because if you don't use skill types correctly then you'll set yourself up to a lot of headaches when you try to add more than a simple weapon skill. Or to be more precise, I think that the entries in your database are using the skill types correctly (otherwise this wouldn't work), but you don't understand what really happened to get to your result, even if it is what you wanted.

And it's not correct that everyone here tries to use scripts - it's just that people who don't use scripts usually have less questions and are thereby posting less.

 

[zombiecharger65]

Regardless, I made it work within my game. I wanted 2 things from it. 1. I wanted the skill to work by default with a weapon rather than normal attack. (I understand this will not work without a script). 2. I wanted the skill to only be useable when the weapon is equipped. (I have accomplished that).

The work around will have to do unless someone has a magical answer that doesn't involve adding scripts, which has already been establish is impossible.

I tried a lot of different combinations to make it work last night and I got confused by it. Andar, you are correct about None versus Special. I have the skills set for special now. The only thing that threw me off was that 001:Attack is set to skill type None, Guard was set for skill type none, Item etc. All of those are skill type none and by default so were Double Attack, Triple Attack and Dual attack. There was obviously a reason for those skills being set as none and just about every other default skill being set as special.

I am not trying to be difficult, I am merley trying to wrap my brain around why those few specific skills come default as None and everything else in the default skills are either Special or Magic based.

 

[Andar]

The only thing that threw me off was that 001:Attack is set to skill type None, Guard was set for skill type none, Item etc. All of those are skill type none and by default so were Double Attack, Triple Attack and Dual attack. There was obviously a reason for those skills being set as none and just about every other default skill being set as special.
I am not trying to be difficult, I am merley trying to wrap my brain around why those few specific skills come default as None and everything else in the default skills are either Special or Magic based.

What probably confused you is the fact that the first two skills have two differences (not only being set to "none" as skill type) - see the default notefield of those two skills.

The only function of skill type "none" is to prevent the actors/player from using that skill, reserving those skills for use by enemies. As you have already learned, those skills which were set to NONE will not be able to be added to the actor's skill selection in combat. They can be used in the attack patterns of enemies, but not in the skill groups of actors.

That the other default skills are set to "special" or "magic" is simply because there are no other skill types pre-defined. If you follow the link in my signature, you'll find a reference to sample games and unencrypted games - download some of those to see how skill types are used if you have more than two skill types.

Now, if you look at the notes to the default skills attack and guard, you'll see that they state that the skill #1 will always be used as the ATTACK skill, while skill #2 will always be used as the GUARD skill. That is an internal override connecting those two skills to the command attack and guard on the battle command menu.

No matter how you name those skills in the database, they will always be executed by those two commands. So I suggest that any edit you make in those skills in the database should not change their function.

Someone else learned that the hard way when he tried to use empty skill names for sorting, renamed and deleted the damage from the first skill (thinking that the attack command would switch to a different skill he named attack) and then wondered why his other skills worked but the basic attack never did damage again...

 

[zombiecharger65]

I had no intentions of messing with the skills at all. That just seems like too much work for me. Everything else in my game was a blank slate though. I made all weapons, armor, shields, helmets, accessories, enemies and everything minus the tile sets from scratch. I've used the generator to make hundreds of actors so far and have used photoshop to edit and change all monsters and battlers. 

I have put a lot of work into this game and as you might be able to gather, a lot of the reason I don't want to use scripts is that 1. it can create problems later on and 2. I want this to be purely my game. I don't want to borrow from other people. I paid for a lot of the Add On Packs and expansions but that was mostly for extra tile sets and battlers. My girlfriend is going to be using a Graphics Pad and Photoshop to create all of my Battlers for me as well (if she can draw them well, that is!).

I just want to keep this game as pure as possible.

I do appreciate all of your help and guidance though.

Thanks again.