Game & Map Screenshots 6

[Kes]

@lemongreen

I am dubious about having a carpet under the tables and chairs, (rain, mud, spilled food and drink etc.) and simply cannot believe the carpet under the tent.  The tent would be placed directly on the ground, as it would have to be secured to it in some way and the carpet would prevent that.  You could have a carpet inside the tent, but not the way you have shown it.  Also the use of the carpet is one of the reasons everything looks over organised - the neat rectangles overwhelm the rounded shapes of your tent and tables.

 

[Dream3r]

Adding Dirt:

Yeah I pictured this going a lot better in my head. About an hour in and I just keep deleting and redoing the same type of work.  It doesn't look right.  Perhaps I just need to keep going and later when details are added it will look right...

Spoiler

Ignore the trees ontop of one another.  This is just a photoshop file that I'm trying to practice with different dirts and such to make the ground less flat.  It's nearly 3 am so I'm going to call it a night and see if I do a better job in the morning.

 

[cabfe]

You need to know if the snow has melt because of the temperature or because people/animals walked repeatedly on this path.

The final aspect would be different and it'll help you pinpoint the right aspect to give to it.

 

[lemongreen]

@ksjp17:

Actually I was thinking of the "carpet" under the tables as more of a synthetic, like a plastic, but if it's really that detrimental I'll just replace them with a close approximation (I'm afraid it looks a little weird to me for the tables to sit directly on the grass itself) . (Also, I was planning on adding an awning type of opening to the tent, but I can still pull back the carpeting [or even choose an entirely different one] on the tent if it's really that much of a problem)     

 

[Dream3r]

You need to know if the snow has melt because of the temperature or because people/animals walked repeatedly on this path.

The final aspect would be different and it'll help you pinpoint the right aspect to give to it.

Thanks Cabfe, I think I get what you mean.  If the snow was melting due to temperature it would be a slow fade where as just walking on the path would only remove the snow in that particular area.  At least that's what I got from that.  Regardless I'll be going with the later since the temperature is below freezing the whole game and I just wanted some of the main paths to be revealed, whereas the rest is up to you to travel/get lost.  The question is having the right amount of confusion like you would have in real life without it being aggravating for a game.  (Of course right now only about 10% of the map is done so you shouldn't get lost at all in it)

 

[hian]

Adding Dirt:


Yeah I pictured this going a lot better in my head. About an hour in and I just keep deleting and redoing the same type of work.  It doesn't look right.  Perhaps I just need to keep going and later when details are added it will look right...


Ignore the trees ontop of one another.  This is just a photoshop file that I'm trying to practice with different dirts and such to make the ground less flat.  It's nearly 3 am so I'm going to call it a night and see if I do a better job in the morning.

If I was going to make changes, they'd be the following -


Firstly, your snow lacks texture, which is the primary reason the enviroment looks flat and kinda dead.


The best thing you can do, is either find some pictures of real snow, or snow textures in google, create a new layer,


tinkle with the opacity and a apply a filter or two and then merge the two snow-layers together.


This is the fastest and easiest way of making your snow look more like snow, and less like just a white canvas with some dirt on it.


Secondly, since non of your objects (trees etc) have shadows, and such a strong and clear outline, the don't


like as if they're coming out of the surface (your ground layer), but rather as if they're plastered on top.


Also, I'd probably do with the dirt layer, as I adviced doing with the snow. Dirt is grainy, and has detail.


You can also create more illusion of depth by adding mounds, stones etc. to the ground.

 

[Dream3r]

If I was going to make changes, they'd be the following -

Firstly, your snow lacks texture, which is the primary reason the enviroment looks flat and kinda dead.

The best thing you can do, is either find some pictures of real snow, or snow textures in google, create a new layer,

tinkle with the opacity and a apply a filter or two and then merge the two snow-layers together.

This is the fastest and easiest way of making your snow look more like snow, and less like just a white canvas with some dirt on it.

Secondly, since non of your objects (trees etc) have shadows, and such a strong and clear outline, the don't

like as if they're coming out of the surface (your ground layer), but rather as if they're plastered on top.

Also, I'd probably do with the dirt layer, as I adviced doing with the snow. Dirt is grainy, and has detail.

You can also create more illusion of depth by adding mounds, stones etc. to the ground.

Those are some things I'm trying without a lot of success.  At least as far as mounds and such go.  The textures I'll have to try out, I really want to add depth to the environment.

As for shadows that's a long ways down the road.  I might make some plain circles as placeholders but the goal is to have detailed shadows that alter as the day goes by.  The thing is I haven't found a way to do that the way I want yet.

Thanks for all the tips

 

[Nova]

overgrown dungeon o3o

 

[Kes]

@Pikachu

There are a couple of items which don't fit with 'logical placement'.

The top pile of little stones (up and right from the player) is fine, because it's near a wall.  The lower pile of little stones (down and right from the player) is in the middle of nowhere, relatively speaking, and so looks odd.  Where did it come from?  If it fell there, would it not have at least cracked the floor tile underneath it?  The lamps - how did the lamps near these 2 piles of stones and the lamp bottom left get there, when all access to those tiles is blocked?

 

[Dream3r]

@Hian

This is a little closer to what I would want it to look like (has some texture added, shadows closer to what I want, but no depth of terrain)

Spoiler

Now keep in mind this is in photoshop still.  I'm not sure how we're going to implement shadows correctly.

1)  They need to angle correctly depending on the time of day.

2)  They shouldn't make the ground darker where they overlap.  Shadows are areas of no light, you can't get darker than no light.

3)  They need to be displayed both above and over events.  When Val walks through the shadows should cover her, so they need to be above other events, but at the same time they shouldn't appear over trees and such below them because technically the shadow would cover their backsides, which you can't see.

4)  Events aren't placed perfectly in spots on the map, they're spawned when you start the game, so the shadows would need to be spawned individually with each tree and not as a layer on its own.

________________________________________________________

It's more or less a technical issue at this point and not a graphical one.  We need smart shadows....

 

[Kes]

 Shadows are areas of no light, you can't get darker than no light.

Actually that's not true.  Look at shadows.  Unless something out of the ordinary is happening they do not block all light, and so you can have areas of more intense and less intense shadows.

 

[Dream3r]

Actually that's not true.  Look at shadows.  Unless something out of the ordinary is happening they do not block all light, and so you can have areas of more intense and less intense shadows.

Depending on what the light source is and how the angles of those sources.  If I stand by my window I cast a shadow (I just did to test) and no matter what I put between me and the shadow the shadow intensity remains the same.  That being said if I were outside I guess that would change since light is bouncing off of all the objects around you....so in this case being outdoors in the pic you're right...hmmm

 

[hian]

@Hian


This is a little closer to what I would want it to look like (has some texture added, shadows closer to what I want, but no depth of terrain)


Now keep in mind this is in photoshop still.  I'm not sure how we're going to implement shadows correctly.


1)  They need to angle correctly depending on the time of day.


2)  They shouldn't make the ground darker where they overlap.  Shadows are areas of no light, you can't get darker than no light.


3)  They need to be displayed both above and over events.  When Val walks through the shadows should cover her, so they need to be above other events, but at the same time they shouldn't appear over trees and such below them because technically the shadow would cover their backsides, which you can't see.


4)  Events aren't placed perfectly in spots on the map, they're spawned when you start the game, so the shadows would need to be spawned individually with each tree and not as a layer on its own.

This is a very large improvement from your previous work.


There is still something that bugs me about the way the objects on the map stick out from the actual map.


Do you have an outline tool in your image editing software? If so, try to add a new outline around the objects (don't remove the old one)


that has the lowest strength/intensity, but where the outline radios is relative high(-er - experiemnt).


This gives the objects a soft shadow outline that blends them into whatever is in the background.


If it stands out to much, copy the layer you just made, then undo the changes. Create a new layer beneath,


paste, and then adjust opacity until you get the rigth feel.


Perhaps you should work a bit more on the snow, because it still seems kind of uniform, but


I concede that this might be an issue with my laptop screen, not your snow.


1. I don't know how your time-lapse system works, but you could just make [four] different maps/overlays


unique to each time-period, and have it change through events.


2. This isn't true. Shadows are not just areas of no-light, they're areas of decreased light,


existing on a spectrum because of the "bleed-over"-effect.


Consider the difference between the quality of shadow thrown if you have a heavy blanket hung


up for drying outside, as opposed to one of these white, knit pieces where there might be tiny openings


between the stiches.


These two objects will not cast an equally strong shadow. This is because the light that passes through


the tiny openings, break up the integrity of the over-all shadow cast by the knit blanket.


Since most objects aren't one big block of light-jamming surface - and because shadows are weaker


in their periphery, some shadows will look stronger than others, and some shadows, especially when


overlapped by different light-sources, will create a darker shadow where they overlap.

If I stand by my window I cast a shadow (I just did to test) and


no matter what I put between me and the shadow the shadow intensity remains the same.

This is because your body is already blocking the light. The light can't pass through two solid objects


both positioned in-line from the light-source - that goes without saying.


What you should have done instead is take out a secondary light-source, and put an object in front of it,


so that the shadow it casts overlap with yours and check the result. I think you'll find that the


part that overlaps will be darker.


This can even happen with just one light-source if it's big enough, and the objects are properly placed.


3. If you're working with a multi-layered parallax script, make the shadows a part of the upper layer,


together with all the other objects that are supposed to be shown above players and events, and


you're good to go.


4. If you're envisioning using real-time time-lapse with shadows that move


dynamically, you might as well give up on adding shadows to your parallax altogether.


It's not going to be consistent.


Either focus on making good shadows on your parallax and make due with the simple shadows on


the objects and characters through a script - or use an advanced lighting script, and give


up on parallax maps.


As far as I know, unless you can pay someone to make some kind a script joining these two methods,


there is simpy no way to make this work in RPGmaker at the moment.

 

[Dream3r]

@Hian

Ah good explanation.  guess I was being hard headed.  I apologize KSJP for being an idiot XD  Shadows can get darker.

As for the parallax vs shadows.  I feel like I'm on the verge of achieving it.  See in the pic above it's just in photoshop but in the engine the trees, bushes, and all other wildlife is spawned through an event.  Like shown below...

Spoiler

The issue here is that with parallaxing the shadows won't work properly.  See if Val walks through a shadow it should be above her and cover her in the shadow.  But it shouldn't be above all events because then if there is a tree below another tree (due to the top down view of the game) the shadow would cover the tree below it.  As seen here...

Spoiler

Technically the shadow should be behind the tree here, but it's not.

So that's the issue basically.

Also thank you for all the tips on making the objects feel like less objects.  I'll work on that.

EDIT:

Is this what you meant by another outline outside the tree?  (Slow fade into the map)

Spoiler

 

[StrawberrySmiles]

@ Dream3r

- It seems your objects are kind of just slapped on the ground, and not really part of the environment. Maybe snow could be added on the bottom of the trees and such?

 

 

[Dream3r]

@ Dream3r

- It seems your objects are kind of just slapped on the ground, and not really part of the environment. Maybe snow could be added on the bottom of the trees and such?

I REALLY want to do that but I can't draw snow for crap.  I plan on having snow cover the bases as well as having roots and such around trees...but I'll have to have that drawn later

 

[Candacis]

@Dream3r:

I agree with what the rest said. One of the biggest problem with your outdoor maps now, is that the objects stick out very much and don't feel very grounded in the environment. Little details like specks of snow on the treetrunk bottom or some partially snow-covered grass sticking out from the snow where the treetrunk is, might do the trick. Same goes for the bottom of the bushes.

@hian:

Love the look of your game, makes me very curious about it. I agree with the others, that the text font/effect/size need a bit of work to blend in more. Maybe a different font? I'm also not sure about the frame around the portraits/faces or the locations.

 

[RocketKnight]

I try make it's looks celestial, but i'm afraid i had failed.​

 

[Miss Nile]

Actually, I think you've done a very good job. I love the looks of this church and the windows especially are very beautiful. The stairs could use some rails or something, though? They look a bit flat at the moment.

 

[Ronove]

I think that looks pretty Rocket. Maybe lower the brightness on the window though? Cause we lose the details that are on the window and if you took the time to create that, shouldn't we be able to see the details a little bit?