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Jesse - PVGames

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I do remember when I made the transition originally from the High Fantasy stuff to the Wild Steam, which was the first resource pack where you could build your own characters, and again with the Medieval resource packs, some vocal people were upset with the fact that they had to make their own characters and would have preferred to have characters already made so that they don't have to figure out how to do it, which is why I added pre-made character examples as well with those packs, for the people who didn't want to deal with it.

It sort of boils down to there being two types of game-makers on these forums: those who see a pre-made character and create a story/personality/whatever around them, and those who have the ideas of their character already in their mind and need to match that up to what is available. Those who work with the resources they have on hand, and those who seek out resources that fit their vision. Any resource pack can only ever please one of the two.

So, of course, any decision that I ultimately make is going to disappoint some people. Unfortunately, the character creator process is an untenable one at present; if I can figure out a way to make the process easier/streamlined and less in need of so much manual editing, I would happily go back to it. But for now, I am to the point where I look at it and just dread doing more of it, which results in me just not doing it at all (in which case there would be no new resources anyway).

I am also fairly active on these forums and always receptive to feedback and suggestions. If there is a specific kind of character you would want to see in the pack, all you would need to do is tell me. I can't read minds, so I can't just guess what specific character you have in mind, but I will listen if you tell me :)
 

The Stranger

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@Jesse - PVGames I appreciate all of the hard work you've put into your previous packs, I really do. I can only imagine how tedious making those tiny character pieces was for you, so I understand why you may have wanted to knock it on the head. Still, it's hard not to be disappointed with such a decision.

I just can't use pre-made characters effectively. They don't feel like my characters, but ones created by someone else that I'm simply shoehorning into my story. There's no way you are capable of creating such a diverse cast of characters to cover all bases, nor do I expect you to even try, which is why the character pieces were so amazing. Those pieces allowed us to alter a character's appearance as they progressed through a story. It allowed us to create some truly unique protagonists, antagonists, and other supporting characters with relative ease. We were able, with a little elbow grease, to pretty much have any type of character we wanted or needed. To have that level of creative freedom taken away is a bitter pill to swallow.

I will say that the new multi-directional battlers sound fantastic, though.

I really hope these new packs work out for you, mate. :)
 
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Davekron

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I'd love to see the remastered Cthulhu :)
 

mardin

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There's no way you are capable of creating such a diverse cast of characters to cover all bases, nor do I expect you to even try, which is why the character pieces were so amazing. Those pieces allowed us to alter a character's appearance as they progressed through a story.
What he said plus the fact that once you set up the Character Generator (The Freeware you put out) it was so easy to create a whole set of characters on the fly!

I am using the same 3D Engine as you do. I know how much work it is that you're doing. And I know that rendering one piece of bracers in 50 different poses isn't anywhere near as fun as some map assets. But it is what it is, every new piece for the character creator multiplies our options as gamedevs!


It sort of boils down to there being two types of game-makers on these forums: those who see a pre-made character and create a story/personality/whatever around them, and those who have the ideas of their character already in their mind and need to match that up to what is available. Those who work with the resources they have on hand, and those who seek out resources that fit their vision. Any resource pack can only ever please one of the two.
Didn't you do both in most of the medieval packs? There were premade characters as well I recall. Plus the additional character packs like the hero pack and the townsfolk pack are other options for these guys who for some reason can't/won't use the character generator.

You say The Mythos Horror pack is going to be the biggest, with options to build exterieur and interieur of a whole city! And we will have to fill these city of ours with just 25 characters...in my point of view that's not nearly enough, unless we build a ghost town.


I think the pack will have success and I know I'm going to buy it anyway, since the artwork alone will be great and I'm a huge Lovecraft fan plus the map assets will definetly useful for some medieval maps as well. But if I'm going to make a game with it, it will be with NPC's of the Medieval Character Generator, safe to say.


I just really hope you find a solution to automate the process of making these character assets so that you will return to it someday.
 

Jesse - PVGames

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@Davekron - Oh, there will definitely be that! Can't have a Mythos pack without the big guy himself :)

@mardin - I am glad you understand the amount of work that goes into it! Though, it is over 500 different poses as opposed to 50, not counting the busts/faces etc. Each pack has anywhere from 20-70+ individual items for each gender. So, let's say a pack has 40 items for males and 40 for females, that is well over 20,000 individual graphics, not counting the templates themselves (which are not really an issue to me). It's a lot of work, and then to edit out the green parts and correct the color bleed, it is very draining over time. I am surprised I stuck with it this long :)

Because a number of people asked for pre-made characters to be included in the Medieval packs (presumably these people did not want to make their own characters or perhaps found the task of doing so too difficult or time-consuming), I added a few pre-made characters to each pack, but they were made out of the character creator pieces. They were not characters I made special for the packs per-se.

The two-dozen characters I mentioned was the absolute minimum, I would love to have closer to double that, with multiple weapons for most (or at least for a core group of them).

I am not worried about the success of the pack. The first Mythos was one of the best selling packs around, and one of the few that has been used for completed commercial games. The second Mythos will be bigger and better. It is one of the more requested packs.

If we discard the characters all together, I would think that the monsters and the map pieces alone would be worth it. There are still, to this day, almost no other resource packs available that offer all of these things together, especially not of this quantity.

I've kept the scale the same for the characters and tiles, so you can mix the tiles and characters back and forth with the Medieval resources. There is no reason why you couldn't make characters with the Medieval resources and use them with the Mythos resources, depending on the clothing options chosen. It's not like the Mythos characters would dwarf the Medieval ones or vice versa. They are comparable in size, and even share some of the same animations.

At the end of the day though, I am not giving up on finding a better method of developing character creator pieces. I still love the idea of building your own characters. I just can't sit here and edit 20,000-60,000 images for every pack anymore. I have spent nearly the past month avoiding doing it because I am just too burned out from it, which is why I was working on a hobby game (a top-down shooter) instead. So I had to make a choice: either move forward with SOMETHING or continue to do nothing. I would much rather move forward with something, and I will keep searching for ways to make the character creator pieces easier in the future.
 

gRaViJa

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If there would be a train and a station in the new Mythos pack, that would be super awesome!
 

Dungeonmind

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I for one wouldn't have a problem at all if you seized making character pieces all together and just made default ones. At this point if someone wants to make a custom character, there is enough for them to do so and on the other hand if the other type of user wants pre-made characters, well they will get that too. I think you can even just focus strictly on npc's for each pack, as we have enough character pieces to make heroes now. I am more concerned about whether or not you will continue to make more medieval line stuff as your tiles are just wonderful. I wouldn't mind seeing the snow pack! That definitely would be a nice addition for tiles.

I also understand how much work this has been for you, I am thankful you have released everything you have already did for us and wouldn't blame you if you had to stop. I just started parallaxing with your resources / cause of your resources and that's just a good thing anyways!

About the new mythos pack. I am very intrigued that you will have the resources for an abs in there. I always looked at the medieval line of resources and they always reminded me of elder scrolls games in a lot of ways, so an ABS was always something that I was interested in!

Anyways, thank you so much for all the hard work you have already put into your resources, I am thankful for how much we already have! (I always wondered how you managed to make so much resources!) :)
 

BloodletterQ

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I can understand the amount of work you’d have to put in. To me, it seems like the current amount of character pieces works well enough. But the pre-made characters actually will require users to be more creative. And I probably wasn’t ready for advanced resources like yours.
 

blakebishop1989

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Will there still be a northern clans pack? A vikings one?
 

BloodletterQ

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My suggestion should the individual parts prove too ambitious would be:
  • Make a bunch of NPCs per pack using items you would have separated in the pack.
  • Open a shop where we can request custom characters.
 

mardin

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My suggestion should the individual parts prove too ambitious would be:
  • Make a bunch of NPCs per pack using items you would have separated in the pack.
  • Open a shop where we can request custom characters.
Or a 127.0.0.1/banned.url Page instead of a shop...
 

BloodletterQ

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Couldn’t think of the word for it. Or just outfits and base bodies+hair could also work.
 

killdude

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Please make a scifi pack im begging you :))
 

Jesse - PVGames

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@blakebishop1989 - Yes; overall the packs that I will be making, aside from my diversion for the new Mythos Reawakening resources, have not changed. I will get back to the Medieval stuff before long!

@killdude - I did make a Sci-Fi pack, if you were not aware of it :) Another Sci-Fi pack would be fun, but I got rather burned on the first one. Some day, I am sure, I will be ready to be hurt again :)

@BloodletterQ / @mardin (and @The Stranger since this is a subject of interest for you) - If I go back to making character pieces, I think I would go more for this approach, creating outfits instead of individual pieces. Base templates, complete outfits, and separate headgear/hair instead of each individual piece. This would be easier for people to manage I think overall, without having to worry about clipping issues with certain pieces overlapping. It does take away options, of course, but it is something of a middle-ground that wouldn't be too stressful and time-consuming on my end.

The question would be though - go back to the old animation templates or go with the new ones? Might be hard to answer without having seen all of the animations and their 8-direction counterparts. I would also have to be rather selective about what universal animations to choose because once the animations are chosen and resources are made for them, there is no going back. You can't add new animations because all of the older stuff will not support them, and retroactively creating resources for the new animations based on the older stuff is problematic because... where do they go? Free updates? New pack? It also creates the problem of exponential growth which will ultimately lead to way too much time required to keep updating all of the older content.

What I might do is once I get enough of the animations for these new characters set, I will make a basic character showing off all of them and post them here on the forum. Maybe there can be a discussion about which ones you guys think are the best and must-haves, and which ones can be done without, and from there I can assemble a mastersheet for them. I think once you see the newer animations and the 8-directions, you will not really want to go back to the old animations anyway. I also need to keep in mind that while it is tempting to just have EVERY animation possible for this, it creates a HUGE number of files which take up gigantic amounts of space. It's not practical, and honestly, I doubt Degica would even want to sell something like that.

Another thing I could do, in addition to the above with universal templates and outfits and what not, is also have special pack-specific characters that use animations not found in the templates.

Thoughts? Suggestions?
 

killdude

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Ohh jesse but is this for mv i didnt see a scifi pack from you.İ think its myhos horror pack but its for vx.My hope is for mv.Otherwise i theres any scifi pack for mv please send link.Id love to buy!
 

mardin

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@Jesse - PVGames : That sounds better (much better!), since it would allow me for example to fill an asylum with different nurses and doctors, so that they all have the same outfit but different skin colour, headgear and hairstyle. It would also allow the main protagonist to wear different clothing, and that would be huge for me!

Still not sure if this isn't more work for you in the end than the old character creator sheets, since with the 8 directional attacks you would have to render that for every different outfit as well. That means one-handed melee, two-handed melee, ranged (with variations for: crossbow/rifle, bow, gun) and maybe dual wield and unarmed. Not to mention Hit and Block animation.
 

Darmok0

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I've followed your work since the first pack released. If you're working on a new method to cut down the workload then I'm sure it would not only benefit the fans of your assets, but also you as the creator as well. Burn out using your old method could (in theory) lead to a dislike for something that you love to do - and let's not forget the possible health risks too. Good luck - looking forward to news on your future release.
 
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