Has the interwebz become a more friendly place for women?

[Chiakscare]

@ Athryl I play a lot of online games, too. Depends on the community around the game as well. But, Oh God. I used to play a lot of League of Legends. Pre-made 5's only (if you value your sanity at all) and for the love of God, please don't mention girls. And people want built in voice chat for that game. Nope. Nope. So much nope. Mute. Mute them all.

You. We should play some League together.

Both of you... to the Fields of Justice!,,,, with me, too, please.

 

[Clord]

I have read about attraction and that women often choose to hide their gender in-game.


There was this Steam stalker recently who did try to flirt me due my profile and replies somehow made me female in his eyes.


If he knew how I looked like, he would have been immediately repulsed in an unlikely event he would actually believe me.


One's gender identify or whatever doesn't mean that they might have a matching body to fit.


I'm comfortable to identify as a female, male and even as both genders. Leaning more to female side of things of course.

 

[Celianna]

Perhaps it's my imagination, but have women become more present on the internet? I feel like there are more female blogger, youtubers and gamers, compared to 5 years ago.

 
It's just you it's always been 50/50 for those who've been using the internet since way back in 2000. It's just that you yourself, probably confined yourself in a space (much like Touch said) that only had a lot of men. It's kind of like saying you never really see women reading comics, while you love to read Marvel and stuff, ignoring the fact that loads of women read shoujo manga.

Once I started venturing beyond my little bubble of Elfwood and a handful of web comics, I was frankly shocked by the level of hate out there.  I was especially disgusted by a lot of things I saw written by gamers--who, until then, I had regarded as a pretty enlightened and egalitarian group.

I never kid myself into thinking gamers are a bunch of nice people only, they can become some of the most vile human beings you've ever encountered. As soon as they think they're being 'attacked' (this can be an attack on their ego) or 'threatened', they sling back with even more venom and hatred. Hence all the ragequitty people who play FPS like CoD, or those on MOBA games.

 

[Clord]

I believe that "females" are more likely to hide their gender and avoid the discussion about the matter (or simply like and tell them they are male.) So it made illusion that they have not been that much around in the internet.


This is of course a bit stupid, as there are tons of online stores aimed to females and they buy a lot from those stores.


Let's say you are playing a game that is 5v5 and everyone uses voice chat.


Your team consist of two females and three males for example. One female opens her mouth and the team hears her. Three guys get distracted and are trying to flirt the girl instead of actually trying to win the match, while that one female either doesn't give a damn or find it ridiculous.


Whatever really, it's just my naive example.

 

[Celianna]

Ironically, I just witnessed this exchange on World of Warcraft:

Spoiler

(context was that women use vacuum cleaners like 'Hoovers')

So Pine, to your original question, I'd say no, we still have a long way to go.

 

[Amysaurus]

I don’t think the attitude towards women has changed. I just think the places you’ll see certain attitudes expressed have changed.

All things considered, my gender has had very little impact on my experience here. The community has always been kind, welcoming, and you can tell that members are held to a higher standard of behavior than in many other communities.. The worst I’ve gotten are a few flirty personal messages, which I promptly delete.

Then again, for all intents and purposes I am a dinosaur. I'd like to think most people know better than to mess with a scary lizard woman. 

I don't generally go to many other online communities, unless I know several of the members beforehand. The Youtube comment section is already a beautiful train wreck, so I pretty much refuse to touch it (shine on, you crazy diamond). Most of my tries at online games have ended in "wnt to b my gf lolz?", and many other communities are just harsh towards others, irregardless of gender. 

9 times out of 10 I just end up back here and thank goodness that this community is friendly.

 

[Chiakscare]

Ironically, I just witnessed this exchange on World of Warcraft:

Spoiler

(context was that women use vacuum cleaners like 'Hoovers')

Spoiler

So Pine, to your original question, I'd say no, we still have a long way to go.

That is hysterical!

It speaks to the immaturity of men online (not everyone, of course) and the utter lack of interaction these people have with the opposite sex.

I think it's the men who have a long way to go. (again, not everyone)

 

[JosephSeraph]

I have read about attraction and that women often choose to hide their gender in-game.

There was this Steam stalker recently who did try to flirt me due my profile and replies somehow made me female in his eyes.

If he knew how I looked like, he would have been immediately repulsed in an unlikely event he would actually believe me.

One's gender identify or whatever doesn't mean that they might have a matching body to fit.

I'm comfortable to identify as a female, male and even as both genders. Leaning more to female side of things of course.

This reminds me of something I posted on tumblr today xD

On somewhat of a side note, I must also add I feel the rpg maker forums -- at least RMN since I've never really been active here -- have become so much more queer-friendly! We often find people of all sexualities, gender identities and of all sorts of backgrounds here. (Or there at least.) That makes me happy.

Yet another interesting thing is how we don't know eachother's ethnicities! Except for the few that post on the post your picture thread, hardly ever ethnicity comes into play on the internet since we do'nt really know nor even think about it. Which is lovely.

 

[Celianna]

9 times out of 10 I just end up back here and thank goodness that this community is friendly.

What's funny is that people who break the rules here, and get reminded that they shouldn't be an rear end in a top hat, go to complain on the Reddit RPG Maker community (Reddit is a site infamously known for being a toxic community) that our community is toxic, and staff are rude and hostile.

I remember reading a comment there the other day, where someone said they were banned for giving out criticism, and I couldn't rack my brain who they were. I mean, we take our bans very seriously here. Until I realized that he was the member who felt he was being 'silenced', and he was told to knock off his rear end in a top hat critique as he was just insulting staff/RPG Maker as a whole. We didn't ban him either. People love fabricating lies out of thin air to make themselves out to be the victim.

But basically, people like him think our community is toxic, when in reality, they're the ones poisoning the well.

 

[Athryl]

I think I saw that post too - I check/post on reddit but I definitely agree it's a pretty hostile environment and often lacks real moderation. I mean I get some people want to be able to say anything and everything, but an official forum isn't the place to ask for that sort of freedom. What happens here represents a company and their products.

And yeah WoW chat can be pretty awful...for women and for anyone really. I try to always answer questions there cause I know new players mostly get sarcastic answers.

 

[Makio-Kuta]

Didn't reddit shut down a couple of really toxic communities a couple months ago, much to the very angry backlash of the people who were in them? (Because they lost their outlet for toxicity)

Anyway, in my own personal experience the only real difference now is that women on the internet feel more confident in being able to say that because there are good communities like this that take how people act very seriously. I do recall reading a study a while back about what % of females purposefully lie about their gender or don't mention it in MMOs and it was staggeringly high because of the way they were treated when it came out. I can only imagine how much larger that % was if you go even further back.

I know I would NEVER have mentioned my gender (or age) when playing Quake online. Less in terms of how their reaction would be, and more in terms of "This wasn't a think a girl should be playing." and how strongly that stigma was pressured on me by media. Girls can feel more confident expressing that they are a girl who likes video games now than they could before. That confidence is the change that I see.

Unfortunately, that increased confidence has not come hand-in-hand with an increased level of respect. You don't have to dig too deep to find cases of women involved with videogames or other 'nerd culture' on the internet being harassed for the mere fact that the are female. (and that treatment still extends into real life too)

Anonymous communities are the worst, but then they ALWAYS are the worst because accountability is negligible.

I've luckily only had one VERY negative experience related to the RM community with someone long in the past because I was female. It has left an annoyingly strong impression on me however and nothing gives me the impression that the internet has moved past that sort of thing happening again to someone else.

 

[Amysaurus]

@Celianna: I've heard so many complaints about this community, but I have to agree. The people who seem to have the most trouble here are the ones looking for it. The staff here, from everything I've seen/read aren't rude or hostile at all. They say what needs to be said, in what I would consider a straightforward manner. It may be as simple as people mistaking the colored text as hostile, but that's entirely their own issue. That's just my two cents.

@Chiakster: This is an interesting case. I've seen it happen just as many times with men as with women, usually with the same kind of outcome. It's immature, it's unfriendly, but it has a lot to do with the collective power one feels while in a group. Simply put, when you believe you're part of the majority, it becomes much easier to say something insulting and slink back into the crowd. It's as if you have a "shield" due to others quite possibly making the same comment that you do.

 

[GrandmaDeb]

I don't have broad exposure to the things you folks experience. As Touch mentioned, I have my arenas and I am to a degree sheltered by them. This does not mean I am therefor ignorant of what goes on outside of my direct experience.


Unwanted flirting and trash-talk is one kind of problem. Belittling and critical behavior is another. But the thin veil of privacy we have online makes it particularly difficult to be harassed in cyberspace. A determined person can quickly move from knowing you by an online avatar and persona to having a picture of your backyard. Creeper behavior is still around and deserves the thrashing it gets in responsible communities such as this one. Public remarks go personal and intimidating very quickly when foolish, awful people are allowed to behave wrongly. No one should be treated that way at any time.


Are things better? I think in general public discourse in well behaved public forums such as this one are more tolerant, less bigoted, more accepting. Troll-mouth is no longer funny to much of anyone, at least in some places.

 

[AwesomeCool]

It really depends on the place (most places are negative towards girls).

Although there are some women out there that really not really helping (female streamers objectifying themselves and thus enforcing such behavior, girls using there gender for leverage, etc), it still is inexcusable the way women are treated on most place on the internet.

I honestly feel that society is heading in a direction where men and women would rather work against each other then work together (at least here in American society).  

@Chiakster - It is honestly the few bad eggs that are making men look bad.  Just like there are a few women that make other women look bad (ex. radical feminists).

 

[Rukiri]

The internet should be friendly to all genders, races, colors, and beliefs, oh and age!

I personally say who cares, have a grand 'ol time!

 

[GrandmaDeb]

The internet should be friendly to all genders, races, colors, and beliefs, oh and age!


I personally say who cares, have a grand 'ol time!

It is truly a wonderful thing about the internet that one can be judged by "the content of one's character" rather than by appearance, social status, income, gender (and similar issues), and - as I have found to be highly gratifying and delightful - to befriend and learn from people around the world.


"If you are wise, you are wise for yourself, And if you scoff, you alone will bear it." - Solomon


Online, "If you are a jerk, you are a jerk all on your own. If you want friends, be one." =D

 

[mlogan]

Online, "If you are a jerk, you are a jerk all on your own. If you want friends, be one." =D

So well said!

I don't have a lot to add, as others have echoed my sentiment - that is more about where on the internet you are.

But I also have to add that women on internets =/= internets a nicer place to be. I've been a member of a some parenting forums, mostly comprised of women and have seen some really ugly and literally crazy stuff happen. It might not be quite the same as the insults that some male gamers tend to throw out, but it's there nonetheless.

I do appreciate this community very much and that it tries to make it a safe place for all people to be a member.

 

[Pine]

Just wanted to mention that reddit is garbage. No matter what you do, don't go there. It's like the 4chan of this time and age.

 

[Banquo]

But I also have to add that women on internets =/= internets a nicer place to be. I've been a member of a some parenting forums, mostly comprised of women and have seen some really ugly and literally crazy stuff happen. It might not be quite the same as the insults that some male gamers tend to throw out, but it's there nonetheless.

To be fair, I imagine parenting is an extremely touchy subject for some people. Who wouldn't feel attacked if someone even slightly critizes how you raise your kids?

Just wanted to mention that reddit is garbage. No matter what you do, don't go there. It's like the 4chan of this time and age.

Yes, there's a fine line between freedom of word, and anarchy.

 

[Celianna]

People who march for the freedom of speech thing on the internet, just want to be able to be an rear end in a top hat to everyone. Much like how someone will say something insulting, and based on your reaction, will say "it was just a joke! Why can't you just take a joke!?"

Words have meaning, and sometimes, it's best to censor those words when we know it will only cause hurt. Hence the fact that a well moderated community is a much nicer place to be, than say Reddit or 4Chan for example.