How much money have you actually made off a completed game?

[bgillisp]

@lianderson : cornia transplant. Basically they take the cornia off your eye and put a new one on. It's very expensive too. Bill was $20,000 before insurance kicked in. I joked the bill should have come with a painkiller!

@Tuomo L : I don't know why that quote makes it look like that is my game, I didn't release it. Though on pricing, some people do avoid games < $4.99 too as they feel they are just mobile trash or achievement hunter games at that point so why even check it out? So it can backfire pricing it too cheap.

 

[jkweath]

@bgillisp yeah, that's part of the reason why I didn't price the game that low to begin with, even though IMO the game is probably more suitable with a $1.99 price tag. (I wouldn't price it at 99¢ because then I couldn't put the game on sale unless I put it on sale for less than 99¢, which would just be a waste)

That being said I have looked up games like Labyronia RPG, Cubicle Quest, and others on SteamSpy and, assuming the numbers are somewhat accurate, they've made a pretty decent amount on small pricetags despite being standard RTP games. I plan on pricing my next game similar to theirs.

 

[Tuomo L]

That being said I have looked up games like Labyronia RPG, Cubicle Quest, and others on SteamSpy and, assuming the numbers are somewhat accurate, they've made a pretty decent amount on small pricetags despite being standard RTP games. I plan on pricing my next game similar to theirs.

The problem with using Steamspy as measuring stick and thinking of it as accurate is that it's not.

Again, it was off by over 10K in my case. That's not a minor misaccuracy.

 

[bgillisp]

But, just like everyone else who says it, you are not giving numbers to prove it. So can we please either prove it with numbers, or stop saying it is inaccurate? Due to the lack of evidence being presented everyone else has to just take it as correct as the other side has not presented ANY hard evidence to the contrary.

Basically, if this was a trial and you were trying to prove steamspy wasn't accurate, you wouldn't convict a jury alive that you are right with the evidence I've seen presented so far...by anyone.

 

[jkweath]

The problem with using Steamspy as measuring stick and thinking of it as accurate is that it's not.

Again, it was off by over 10K in my case. That's not a minor misaccuracy.

My assertion right now is that SteamSpy might be inaccurate for games that have sold fewer copies (perhaps less than 10K?), but gets more accurate as games approach the 100K mark.

I looked up your game Save Your Mother. SteamSpy says it has sold about 3,600 copies +- 2,200. Remember that this is copies sold, not the games actual revenue numbers.

The +- is the important thing here: if your game has sold significantly more (or fewer) even after factoring in the margin of error of 2,200, then yeah, its inaccurate and we probably can't get a good estimate for other games with similar numbers.

But like I said, for now I'm assuming SteamSpy is more accurate for titles that have sold more than 100,000 copies, such as Labyronia RPG, where it wouldn't be as big of a deal if it were off by 10-20K. I'd research more but I'm on mobile ATM.

Edit: SteamSpy's About page says it is generally inaccurate for games that have sold less than 30,000 copies, so there's that.

 

[starlight dream]

But like I said, for now I'm assuming SteamSpy is more accurate for titles that have sold more than 100,000 copies, such as Labyronia RPG, where it wouldn't be as big of a deal if it were off by 10-20K.

Since Labyronia was mentioned a few times I'll tag @Labyrinthine just in case he wants to see this or add something.

He has mentioned elsewhere that his early games did sell a very big amount of copies.

@jkweath the amount of sales aren't due to pricing alone though. From what I've read Steam used to make it easier for indie games to get exposure. But I haven't sold anything on steam yet, so I'm not placed to say.

 

[Labyrinthine]

@starlight dream
As for Labyronia RPG and its first two sequels, I sold those games to outside publishers and got 6000 dollars all in all as a lump sum. They are selling the games for 0.99 $ per game. They went to sell over million copies combined, according to Steamspy. I don't earn royalties from them because of the deal we made. This was more than 3 years ago.

My main game, Labyronia Elements (which is a LOT better game than the prequels), has sold less than 200 units in 3 months and I've earned about 150 $ so far. The game costs 3.99$, but it's a very large game with 60-90 hours of content. The previous games were lasting 6-10 hours per game.

I and someone else concluded the severely lower sales concerning Elements might have something to do with the market exploding in Steam. So many games to choose from, and gaining visibility is hard because of the way Steam handles it. Apparently other people have had similar troubles today.

Games that sell well get more exposure. I think it kind of sucks, because basically it means that those who already earn millions with their games get constant free advertising (and even more money), while the small indie makers get barely any.

 

[jkweath]

@jkweath the amount of sales aren't due to pricing alone though. From what I've read Steam used to make it easier for indie games to get exposure. But I haven't sold anything on steam yet, so I'm not placed to say.

I can say from the little experience I have that Steam does at least A) give you some exposure when your game is pending release and on its first week of release. It also gives some extra exposure on discount sales too, I think. The majority of my game purchases are from discount sales--of course, it could just be from the 80% discount, but I think it's partly due to increased exposure.

@starlight dream
As for Labyronia RPG and its first two sequels, I sold those games to outside publishers and got 6000 dollars all in all as a lump sum. They are selling the games for 0.99 $ per game. They went to sell over million copies combined, according to Steamspy. I don't earn royalties from them because of the deal we made.

My main project, Labyronia Elements (which is a LOT better game than the prequels), has sold less than 200 units in 3 months and I've earned about 150 $ so far. The game costs 3.99$, but it's a very large game with 60-90 hours of content. The previous games were lasting 6-10 hours per game.

I and someone else concluded the severely lower sales concerning Elements might have something to do with the market exploding in Steam. So many games to choose from, and gaining visibility is hard because of the way Steam handles it. Games that sell well get more exposure. I think it kind of sucks, because basically it means that those who already earn millions with their games get constant free advertising (and even more money), while the small indie makers get barely any.

Oh, cool! I had no idea you had an account here. I've seen your game pop up frequently on Steam; it's one of the first games I looked up on SteamSpy when I got curious about how well RPGM games can sell. I had no idea about the publisher deal, though.

Also your post helps my theory that SteamSpy is at least somewhat accurate for games that sell many copies, so thanks for that!

I think you're right about the market exploding. I remember reading the article about RPGmaker saying that almost 200 games RPGM games have released on Steam in the past two or so years alone. Not much we can do about that.

However, there is one type of RPGM game that, according to SteamSpy, is pretty popular. The Chosen RPG and Dark Elf (NSFW) came out fairly recently and seem to sell a lot despite the reviews generally saying they're low-quality RPGs. I wonder if they sell due to publisher influence or if it's just the sex appeal alone.

 

[Labyrinthine]

I can say from the little experience I have that Steam does at least A) give you some exposure when your game is pending release and on its first week of release. It also gives some extra exposure on discount sales too, I think. The majority of my game purchases are from discount sales--of course, it could just be from the 80% discount, but I think it's partly due to increased exposure.



Oh, cool! I had no idea you had an account here. I've seen your game pop up frequently on Steam; it's one of the first games I looked up on SteamSpy when I got curious about how well RPGM games can sell. I had no idea about the publisher deal, though.

Also your post helps my theory that SteamSpy is at least somewhat accurate for games that sell many copies, so thanks for that!

I think you're right about the market exploding. I remember reading the article about RPGmaker saying that almost 200 games RPGM games have released on Steam in the past two or so years alone. Not much we can do about that.

However, there is one type of RPGM game that, according to SteamSpy, is pretty popular. The Chosen RPG and Dark Elf (NSFW) came out fairly recently and seem to sell a lot despite the reviews generally saying they're low-quality RPGs. I wonder if they sell due to publisher influence or if it's just the sex appeal alone.

The Chosen RPG was published by the same people who published the first Labyronia games. They must have some super marketing tactics in use.

 

[bgillisp]

The Chosen RPG was published by the same people who published the first Labyronia games. They must have some super marketing tactics in use.

Heh...I'd say what those tactics are, but they are very not PG13, and then I'd have to moderate myself, so I'll just be quiet here.

Still, I do think it is due to how flooded Steam is these days more than anything. I've seen many games stall near the 1000 copies sold point, and I think that is just due to the fact that Steam has around 7,000 games released every year. The window is so small now it is hard to get your game noticed. And I wouldn't call what they do promoting now, as all I ever see on Steam are the top 10 best sellers and top 10 new releases, then I can see the next 10 new releases coming up. That's honestly it. So if you are not in those three lists, I don't know your game has come out unless I go digging on other pages.

 

[jkweath]

Heh...I'd say what those tactics are, but they are very not PG13, and then I'd have to moderate myself, so I'll just be quiet here.

Does it rhyme with "goobies"?

When I released Mari and the Black Tower, I received a bunch of fake emails for free promotion in exchange for game keys. A few of them, though, seemed to be from legit promotional services that I might try out with my next game release. One of them is called "Indie Boost", not sure if anyone else here is familiar with them. I'm thinking about using a few of these services to see if they can help out; at worst I can at least make my money back on the exposure.

 

[Labyrinthine]

Does it rhyme with "goobies"?

When I released Mari and the Black Tower, I received a bunch of fake emails for free promotion in exchange for game keys. A few of them, though, seemed to be from legit promotional services that I might try out with my next game release. One of them is called "Indie Boost", not sure if anyone else here is familiar with them. I'm thinking about using a few of these services to see if they can help out; at worst I can at least make my money back on the exposure.

I got those emails too... --.--

 

[Andar]

There are problems with all those ideas of "free Promotion for game keys", because they usually work by offering the keys to players for writing reviews on games.
And sooner or later it is revealed that a good number of your reviews were done that way, hurting your reputation no matter what.

And even the better ways of offering keys as lottery prices or attaching them to sale bundles are often limited in effects, so you should make sure that whoever makes such an offer should explain to you how exactly they are using the keys and what exactly the promotion will be.

 

[Tuomo L]

Does it rhyme with "goobies"?

When I released Mari and the Black Tower, I received a bunch of fake emails for free promotion in exchange for game keys. A few of them, though, seemed to be from legit promotional services that I might try out with my next game release. One of them is called "Indie Boost", not sure if anyone else here is familiar with them. I'm thinking about using a few of these services to see if they can help out; at worst I can at least make my money back on the exposure.

I've received numerous mails from many of these people. Since I have more than one game out, I sometimes get multiple mails in a row with just replacing the name of the game in between them.

 

[jkweath]

I got those emails too... --.--

I've received numerous mails from many of these people. Since I have more than one game out, I sometimes get multiple mails in a row with just replacing the name of the game in between them.

After receiving two nearly-identical emails from two different email addresses, I looked it up and found out that many people like to claim they're streamers/reviewers/etc for free keys. Then they either just have a free game to play, or they can sell the key on G2A for profit.

Thankfully I did get at least a few legit emails. One of them was a group from Russia. Ever since I gave them free keys, I get at least a few sales a week from Russia. Totally worth it.

 

[bgillisp]

You know, this might be a legit topic for another conversation, mainly who are the reliable people you can use to increase exposure for your game? Just a thought as I'm sure others would be interested in learning about this too.

 

[CleanWater]

The Chosen RPG was published by the same people who published the first Labyronia games. They must have some super marketing tactics in use.

Actually, these tactics are more simpler than we think. I received some free bonus money for advertising on Facebook. I normally have hundreds of views on my posts there, but with this money promoting a particular post, it got thousands of views (oddly, my other posts not promoted are still stagnated in the hundreds).

Also, a good free alternative, is to send your game directly to curators through Steam Connect now, it raised my page views a lot for my specific audience (and gathered some sales on old games that I weren't selling for some time).

Side Note: Playing Labyronia 1 these weeks, it's a nice game!

 

[Labyrinthine]

Actually, these tactics are more simpler than we think. I received some free bonus money for advertising on Facebook. I normally have hundreds of views on my posts there, but with this money promoting a particular post, it got thousands of views (oddly, my other posts not promoted are still stagnated in the hundreds).

Side Note: Playing Labyronia 1 these weeks, it's a nice game!

Cool It was my first game so don't expect a masterpiece : -D I just hope more people were to play my main game (which is Labyronia Elements)

 

[Matseb2611]

Steamspy figures mostly show how many people own the game on Steam, but it doesn't really discern how many of those were sales at full price, how many sales at a discount, how many sales from bundles, and how many were free key activations from giveaways. It is a good indicator of a "general" idea, but it's not too precise.

I would confirm though that my older games did receive much more exposure and sold much better than the more recent releases. Steam market has become saturated, and also its new algorithm has made it even harder for indie devs to get noticed. As some people stated already above, you basically need to be popular already to get more exposure, so the popular games become even more popular and unpopular sink down even further. I think I saw year-by-year figures not long ago showing that roughly 90% of all sales on Steam every year are by top 20% of games. That means the lower 80% of games get the tail end of whatever is left over, and that would undoubtedly include 99% of indies.

I wouldn't go into specifics, but I would say that about 2-3 years ago, each new game of mine had noticeably more traction than these days. It will also strongly depend on the game itself of course. Just to give you some idea, two games I released last year: 1) Mercury, which is a cyberpunk RPG with an engrossing plot and choice & consequence mechanics, 2) Renegade Grounds, a short dungeon-crawler with bare-bones plot but more emphasis on strategic combat. Both had roughly similar budgets (about £600 or $700-800). They also both came out at roughly the same time (Mercury came out in mid August, and Renegade on the first day of September, so Mercury has a 3 week head start, but it's negligible by now). As of right now, Mercury has sold around twice as much as Renegade Grounds. It's already broken even. Renegade Grounds hasn't broken even yet. By current Steam standards, I consider Mercury to be a success. I know had it come out 2 years ago, it would've done as well as City of Chains (which to this day still manages to outsell most of the more recent releases each month). In the past I had a game break even in 2-3 months or so. Now it takes roughly half a year (in Mercury's case) or longer (in Renegade Grounds case).

I have released another project, just last month in fact. Snares of Ruin. I am still waiting for January royalties, but going from the numbers my publisher gave me after the first week of release, it did pretty well and already better than Renegade Grounds did in half a year. So, the game genre matters A LOT. I think also if you've been lucky enough to get a fair few positive reviews in the first week or two after release. If you haven't, then it will be an uphill struggle for that game (Renegade Grounds still sits at exactly 3 reviews last I checked, two of which were negative and there haven't been any new ones for months; by contrast, Snares of Ruin had about 7-8 reviews after just 1 month of being out and last I checked, they were all positive).

So I guess what I want to say is - you have to experiment a bit but don't put all your eggs in one basket. See what does well and what not, and then make more of that which does well. There is no guarantee your first project will do well. Or your second, or third. But if you then compare, you will get a good idea of where to go from there.

 

[Plueschkatze]

Thanks for sharing your experience @Matseb2611!

But people keep in mind that popular genres (settings) change over time, just as they do for book authors, etc.
You should probably keep an eye out for that. Steampunk has been a popular genre for a few years (as have been postapocalyptic and vampires (urban fantasy) before etc. etc.). But now it's more towards sci-fi again I think (cyberpunk, space military etc.). Fantasy is always pretty popular, tho. There are also niche and popular settings. Western, dinosaurs etc. are pretty niché, while romance and fantasy are super popular ones.
So if you start developing a game now and it will take you years you might be unlucky with chosing a genre/settings that's trending now, because you might release once the market is super saturated and noone wants to see another vampire game/movie or another zombie....

So when you make a dating rpg and choose the 'wrong' setting it might be less popular as if you'd had luckily chosen a trending one, tho it's basically the same mechanics and gameplay.