I need help: Players, store page, price, game, trailer...

Discussion in 'Commercial Games Discussion' started by thalesgal, Sep 29, 2019.

  1. thalesgal

    thalesgal Veteran Veteran

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    Hello!

    So I finally managed to finish my game yeeey!! It was not easy to create something from scratch, so after a lot of work (A LOT XD) I could manage to finish my game \o/
    The feeling after create a entire game was very pleasant ^^

    Then, after finishing it, I was able to publish it on steam. It was great to see my game on the steam page, It's very exciting! \o/

    BUT, I thought it would be easy to sell the game, but I realize that it's VERY hard hahaha XD

    So I´m here to ask for your help. I know there are a lot of people here who have already created games, or people who have played many indie games and have a lot of knowledge that could give me some help.

    I got a lot of views on my store page, but I couldn't convert the views into sales!
    Here is my numbers:
    viewss.jpg

    As you can see I got 11,770 viewers on my store page! But I only sold 8 units xD

    So I was wondering what is wrong.
    Maybe the game trailer is too long, or maybe the screenshots are showing bad details about the game, maybe the description was poorly elaborated, or maybe it would be the price that´s too high...

    So I would like some tips to help me improve game sales!


    I will leave some keys here to you to download the game for free. Whether you want to help me by taking a look at the game, or if you want to play the game for fun. What matters to me is that people play the game!
    (If by the time you are reading this message the keys are already in use, please send me a PM and I will gladly send you another key!)

    (Removed by moderator so spam bots don't steal them. PM the author).

    I got a lot of feedbacks from friends! But it would be great for me if people with knowledge of RPG Maker could play too, and give some feedback!

    That´s it. Thank you very much in advance!

    Game store page:
     
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  2. bgillisp

    bgillisp Global Moderators Global Mod

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    I think many just go to pages and add to the wishlist until the next sale. I'll take a peak tomorrow though when I'm more awake, though your story is why I didn't release on Steam and instead went another route when I released my game two weeks ago. And while I don't have exact sales numbers yet I can say I've confirmed I've got more than 8.

    Also we get many spam bots on this site, so I removed your Steam keys so they don't get stolen and on G2A or worse. I changed the note to say PM you for a key.
     
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  3. thalesgal

    thalesgal Veteran Veteran

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    #3
  4. bgillisp

    bgillisp Global Moderators Global Mod

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    I purchased it before I went to bed, so I can check it out and give thoughts on the game too. I guess that makes me sale #9? And yes I know you had offers of keys but I know how hard it is to sell a game so I'll usually buy them if it looks interesting and at least play a few hours of it, and the idea at least looks interesting enough to sell me on it at the asking price.
     
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  5. thalesgal

    thalesgal Veteran Veteran

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    @bgillisp thank you so much!!!! You made my day hahahah :D

    Looking foward to know how was your experience with the game!! Thank you!!
     
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  6. Wavelength

    Wavelength Pre-Merge Boot Moderator

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    I've moved this thread to Commercial Games Discussion. Please be sure to post your threads in the correct forum next time. Thank you.

     
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  7. NinjaKittyProductions

    NinjaKittyProductions Professional Murder Hobos Veteran

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    This review is just from a presentation stand point. I have not bought or played the game as of yet.

    What I liked:
    • I liked the screenshots. They seemed to point of some of the key features of the game. Honestly, it is where I look first, then I watch the trailer.
    • It has voice acting. Not too many RPG Maker games come with voice acting. So it's a nice change of pace.
    • Speaking of voice acting, I also really liked the battle voices. I am assuming they came from a DLC pack (I am not totally sure about this) but nonetheless, they were a good touch.
    • The ability to summon/change party members on the fly for different and unique skills/abilities seems really interesting.
    • Story line/Story hook. It is something completely random and I love it for that.
    What I disliked:
    • The length of the trailer. Five minutes seems a bit too long for an RPG Maker game trailer. There are AAA titles that do not have trailers that long. Honestly, I only made it in about 2 minutes before turning off the video.
    • The price. This might be a biased opinion but most of the other RPG Maker games that I have bought or played ranged between $1 to $5. Only a couple of them were in the $10 range. Not saying that your game is not worth the price that you are asking for, just saying that for a player/buyer such as myself, it does hurt its standing.
    Other thoughts:
    • I found your Steam page to be just fine. The description of the game was short and sweet, which seems to fit the story telling of the game itself.
    • The additional screenshots showcasing features was a nice touch.
    • It definitely has a target audience so that might be why you have so much traffic albeit only a few sales. Not everyone likes puzzle games (I personally enjoy puzzle games ^_^).
     
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  8. Bex

    Bex Veteran Veteran

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    Your Game seems to focus on your battle System, but in Trailer and on Pictures and in explanation, you
    just explain showcase very little about the Mechanics or cool Situations where they are used.
    The trailer looks on first glimpse more like some map not screencoordinate clunky battle system, for me as rpg maker user i can see
    that that is maybe not true and its possible that your game abs is much better than you showcase it, specialy if its the main thing about the game besides humor. Remember Zelda, they would show off in trailer or pictures, different attacks, maybe explain how to execute, the boomerang, the bombs how it blow open a rockfilled entrance, not sure if such stuff exists in your game, but definitelly show them.

    Your Game shows maps with very big space, thats often what starter rpg games look like, i know you need the space for the gameplay in your game, and thats ok. So dont worry about this to much, but maybe try to make that the Steam Pictures show best angles of your Maps.

    Actualy your Maps look more like prototype Levels which got some Polish and fitting Tiles, but there is Room to make them better looking,
    while keeping it simplistic.
    https://forums.rpgmakerweb.com/index.php?threads/shift-click-mapping.14387/

    In sewers map, you could slightly Tint the Screen to some color, same for other Maps, but its important that you dont overdo it.
    Some maps look better that way. But dont change your game now, just use the best pictures you got.

    You dont have Puzzles in your Game? Just asking didnt saw any.
    Story only a minimum and some Jokes? I learned not to assume things in Games which they dont show me, say thanks to the big Game Companys =).

    Trailer to Long, dont comes to the Point, not realy creating excitement the Gameplay and variety of Gameplay it shows is suboptimal presented
    for a commercial Game, specialy if its more than 5€, specialy since in quality it looks more like one of those indi flash browser games where you dont expect much quality because its free or for 1 to 3€.

    The presentation power of the pictures and movie and the high Price for this kind of Games, would turn me away.
    Sorry i dont mean to be rude, but i dont have much time also i got a injured back and cant sit very long at the moment. (Also iam not native english and excuse if i sound somehow grumpy, not my intention)

    Since long time i searched through some 2d rpg games on steam and i also ended on your Page, looked at it gave it a few mins even,
    but left unsatisfied.

    My recommendation: Rework parts of your presentation. Maybe lower the Price to 5 Euros if that is possible, than maybe do a 80% discount if it still dont sale. (Iam a noob with this and this only represents my feelings, so i could be totally wrong and sorry did not list the positive stuff, there was potencial and i glimpsed a few cool things which maybe took you some time to create, good job on those)

    Edit: Your presentations gameplay looks repetitive(just the presentation i dont say your game is that way, i never played it), try to focus a little more on showing variety maybe.
    What do Pets actualy do for you besides fighting for you? maybe showcase 3 of them and let the rest to explore for the player, but 3 explained is better than 0.

    If this would be a free game on the forums with this presentation, out of interest i would have downloaded it to check it now.

    If you are risk taking, iam not sure how Game Demos are handlet these days, like a Playable Demo of the first Level or something like that, not sure if this rises or partialy kills sales for games.

    EDIT: You got some puzzle explanation which i totaly oversaw, because its hidden behind a button which is easily overseen. That should not be hidden in there, it should be visible directly.
     
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2019
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  9. thalesgal

    thalesgal Veteran Veteran

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    @NinjaKittyProductions hi! Thank you so much for answering!!

    Thank you very much! :D
    About the voice acting I actually had it done on fiverr. There are a lot of good people there, I sent the text and they acted for me.

    Thank you so much for these tips!!
    I will change the trailer to another with a maximum of 1 minute length. Maybe I'll put 3 trailers of 1 minute each, what do you think?

    Thanks also for the price tip. I'll wait for some more feedbacks, and I'll consider lowering the price to $4.99.

    Thank you so much for the analysis, the tips, and the compliments!! I'm very glad you enjoyed the overall presentation of the game!
    I will make the modifications as you said, and I'll send you a PM with a game key!
    I don't want to bother you, I'm sending as a thank you for the tips! But I will be very happy if you can play a little bit sometime haha!


    @Bex hello!! Thank you so much for answering!

    Yeahh I felt the same when I was uploading the pictures xD but when it comes time to create the content on the page it seems that a blank thing cames to my mind and I forgot about the features of the game...
    But It sure has!!! I made a lot of features to the mechanics of the game, and a lot of cool situations to use it haha... but as you said, it is not being shown in the pictures.
    Thank you so much for bringing this up, sometimes we just don't realize or don´t see... I will change and add some pictures for sure!


    Got it!! Thank you very much it was a nice tip!!

    Thank you! I needed to see this! I mean, sure there's something wrong, and you showed me. 8 sales (9 now that @bgillisp has bought the game haha Thanks! <3) It is nothing compared to the 11k visits on the page. It was a terrible performance xDD

    Thanks! I will work on new pictures showing better angles, and showing more features of the game. And I will remove that vídeo trailer, and post more videos with more impact, more dynamics, and shorter... of course haha

    I will send you a key also by PM! As I said earlier, I don't want to bother you. I will send to you as a thank you for the tips! If you can play in the future I'll be very happy haha

    Thank you very much to everyone who helped me. When I finish the changes I will mark you in the post so you can see what has changed. And if you can, give me a new feedback :D
     
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  10. Musashi

    Musashi Veteran Veteran

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    Honestly, to me it looks like your game has a lot of potential and could be reworked to something way more successful, but:

    1 - It need better graphics. Nobody wants to hear this, but it's true. Maybe you can't afford a custom tileset, but you can still find some cheap options around, or just improve your mapping skills, or hire someone to do it for you. The RTP is already well known by the regular Steam users and it makes the game look cheap, so unless you have something really special about your game or how you use the RTP, people won't even give it a chance, specially at this price. Maybe even just a lighting system would be enough to make it more appealing.

    2 - Still on the graphics, they also don't really match your game or at least the idea I get from reading its story. You have a somewhat dark story about a casino and slavery but the game look very childish. I'd suggest making your game look more like a casino, including using all the techniques they use to grab people's attention. Even the skills could look and play more like casino games, that would be cool! If the idea was to make a more childish game, then maybe using a casino wasn't the best idea :blink: I don't think parents would be happy with their kids playing a game about a casino and I don't think many adults want to play as a little girl in a happy casino. Is she a little girl btw? She looks like a woman but since you described her as a girl I immediately thought she was supposed to be very young. I know you have a story there, but I think people would find more funny to play as some broke middle age man in a cheap suit or some kind of crazy/weird old person in a scenario like this. Some small kid lost in a weird/scary casino is a fun idea too, but now I'm guessing your character is just some regular woman.

    3 - The main character looks boring. I mean, it's a blonde girl. I see so many devs making this mistake with their main characters...It would look cool if she was inserted in this bizarre world full or weird characters (something like Spirited Away for example), but again, that's not what happens here, every characters looks kind of ordinary and uninteresting and that's a specially big problem in a game with a "pet" system. Maybe some character customization options would be good.

    4 - You have a fast paced game, fast combat system, timers, rock'n'roll music and all of that, and your trailer starts with 1 minute of nothing. Make a 1 minute trailer full of action from the beginning! That's what you game is about after all (I think).

    5 - Price. In my opinion it's a $2-3 game to maximize profits and popularity.

    Now, if you don't want to rework your game and only need tips to improve sales, then yeah, make a better and smaller trailer, lower the price and avoid using words like ABS/Action Battle System to sell your game - try describing it in a way everyone can understand. If you google "ABS games" you won't find anything relevant, same for Action Battle System (except for some RPG Maker content, I believe only we use this terminology) and you are using these terms as big selling points. Try using "real-time combat" instead or something like that.
    Make a gameplay video and post it on YouTube, or ask someone to play and record your game to show more of it. Some people prefer to see actual gameplay instead of trailers in order to buy a game.
     
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  11. bgillisp

    bgillisp Global Moderators Global Mod

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    I'm going to disagree on the price comments. Steam is such a wildcard and I've seen games for $0.99 not sell at all, and I've seen $29.99 RPGMaker games sell well. To give you an idea, my game is $19.99 and it's sold more than this game based on the reports I've gotten so far.

    If you go too low you show people you don't value your game, and it can also come across as a cheap cash grab, or a cheap mobile port. I myself don't buy many of those games that are too cheap as I feel you are saying well this is junk anyways so why should I buy it?

    As for the suggestions: Maybe do another video showing off the battle system. The game is very action paced based on the 20 minutes I could play today, so show that off more. Slightly better screenshots that are not as empty may help too, though since you are using an ABS you don't want to go too crowded in game either. Maybe one of the zones that look decent, or are before a battle triggers even?

    And I do agree that maybe you should get someone to play through your game too and post reviews and such. I'm working on doing that for my game this week too. I know studioblue and hawkzombie do let's plays here, maybe there are more?
     
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  12. jkweath

    jkweath Goes Fast Veteran

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    Congrats on the release of your first game! I took a look at your store page. Here's my opinion:

    -I get the impression from reading your store page that your first language isn't English. No big deal if it isn't. That being said, if I ever read a store page that looks like it was written by someone who's not particularly skilled in English, I get the impression that the game's dialogue will have inconsistencies or at least be written in an odd way.

    -I didn't watch the trailer (I skipped over it, as do most Steam users from what I've read), but if it's true that it's 5 minutes long, that's definitely too long. Make it short, sweet and to the point.

    -The huge number of pictures on your store page and flavor text on them give me the impression that the game's style is more like a free-with-advertisements mobile game. Having that impression and seeing this game priced at $8.99 almost gives me a case of sticker shock, as if I'd browsed the Google Play Store and found Angry Birds (a free game with ads, I believe) priced at $4.99 or something.

    Lastly, the use of RPGMaker's default RPG graphics will, in my opinion, drastically reduce your sales numbers despite the quality of your game or your store page.

    There's definitely some improvements to be made, but one thing I've noticed about Steam is that the first two weeks are the most crucial in determining whether your game will keep selling or not. If you've already passed the two-week point, my honest advice would be this: make improvements if you want, but don't expect too much. I'd get to work on your next game if I were you, and implement all the good advice you've received here on that instead. Good luck!
     
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  13. thalesgal

    thalesgal Veteran Veteran

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    Hello @Musashi thank you so much for answering!

    Yes, I sure can't afford a custom tileset haha xD
    I got what you mean... you're right, a lot of people care a lot about the graphics. But changing that for now would be a lot of work, maybe as much as the game's development hahah!! So for now, it is not in my plans such a drastic change, but thank you very much for the tip, if the game somehow has more relevance in sales, I will bring updates and surely the graphic will be one of them!

    Yes that´s exactly what the game is haha!! Thank you for the tip, I will make new videos with more action and flashy!

    I like very much this ''real time combat'' word. You are right! I will change this on the descriptions!
    I really liked the idea of a gameplay as a way of marketing for the game! I'm going to look for some streamers that might agree to do something like this! Excelent idea!

    About the price I'm a little undecided about the price for now. I think I will first make all the changes you have told me to do, find a better form of merchandising, and then if there is no improvement in sales, I will review the price.

    Thank you very very much for all these tips! It´s very importante to me :D
    I will also PM you with a key as a thank you. This is the only way I can thank xD
    I would be very happy if one day you can play a little bit haha

    @bgillisp hello thank you so much for reply!!!
    That's exactly what I feel about the price! I will keep this price longer, and try to make sales by improving the marketing and the game's store presentation!

    Thank you very much for the tips!! I will change the pictures and try to show better parts of the game!
    Oh it´s nice to know that are some people that do this. I will look for these two too hahaha xD

    Hello @jkweath thank you very much for reply!

    That's true. My english is not very good haha XDD
    I don't want to bother you at all, but I would like to ask you to give some tips to change some words in the game store! To make it more professional. Pleeeease? XD

    The game itself does not have many dialogs. So I believe it wouldn't have grammatical errors or oddsh phrases in game... I... think.. xD
    but when it comes to long texts like in the store page for example, then surely it will have lot of grammar errors hahahaha

    This was definitely my Achilles heel. Tomorrow I will work on better videos. I am thinking of making 3, or 4 videos for better presentation of the game. All between 30 and 60 seconds.

    Hhahaha!!!! xDDD I swear there's no in-game purchase hahaha!!
    But I got your point. I think I saw so much advertising on the social networks of these games that I ended up using it as a parameter to create my advertising ahha xD
    About this I don't know what to do. For now I'll leave it as it is and see if anyone else will notice that too. I personally like to put pictures and stuff.


    About steam this is true. I read about that too. But steam gives 6 more chances to revive the game! After making an update you can launch a ''visibility round'' that will boost the views again. Before leaving the project. I will make a lot of more attempts to make it work, But I got what you said!!
    Thank you very very much for all the tips. The trailer and the english text I will review for sure!
    I also sent you a key! I hope someday you can play a little bit! Whether for fun or to give a feedback later. Thanks in advance!!

    Thank you guys for all these information!! It is being very good for me to learn, and for the improvement of the game!
    I'm realizing that creating the game is just the beginning haha XDD
     
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  14. Shaz

    Shaz Veteran Veteran

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    I would not do this.

    You have some good suggestions on improvements to make. Do those first and see what results. If you lower your price to 4.99, some people will say it's too expensive, that they won't buy anything over 1.99. So you lower your price to 1.99, and people will still complain it's expensive and they won't buy anything over 0.99, so you lower your price to 0.99 ... The price you have is pretty close to what BFG charges for a "standard edition" casual game that's over in 3-4 hours max. They used to charge twice that amount. Dropping the price by half did not result in a large increase in sales.
     
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  15. bgillisp

    bgillisp Global Moderators Global Mod

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    Shaz summed it up well. In my experience no matter what the price is (unless it is free) someone will complain it is too expensive. What most don't realize is games and prices have not kept pace with inflation which is why most AAA games are shoving in microtransactions and DLC because if they were to just charge the fair inflated market price of $84.99 (based on what games cost me in 1994 or so, and assuming 3% inflation per year) for a game everyone would complain. So instead you get an AAA game for $59.99 with $30 in season passes which oddly enough...costs you $89.99 if you want everything. More if you buy microtransactions too.

    Plus there is zero evidence that lowering the price will result in better long term profit (not sales, profit). If you cut your price in half you usually need more than 2 sales to break even as usually you got a fixed cost that is still there no matter what you charge. Now with digital distribution the fixed cost is probably not present, but for other things that is still there, and is often something people forget.
     
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  16. Wavelength

    Wavelength Pre-Merge Boot Moderator

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    I agree with Shaz in saying "don't do this" (unless your game is very short) - but for a different reason. Dropping the price of a game can also drop its perceived quality - without knowing anything about a game or its brand name in advance, most people will get a sense of a game's value (how much content it has and how well-made it is) from its price. If the game shows itself (in screenshots, trailers, reviews, etc.) to be less well-made than its price, that often leads to not buying, but otherwise that's the assumption that I believe people make. An RPG Maker game with default assets can absolutely be worth the $10 if it's really fun and offers more than a few hours of gameplay.

    Price sensitivity is a real issue, but rather than lower your price, just have your item go on sale once in a while. When a $10 game is being sold for $2.49, most people will think "wow! 75% off this $10 game, what a great deal!" rather than "oh, I guess the game is actually only worth $2". It encourages people to make the decision to buy it soon, while also allowing price-sensitive players to get in on your game at some point.

    By the way, I looked at your game a week or two ago, and considered buying it, but ultimately chose not to. It was a close call (and it had nothing to do with the price). I got the sense that the game was a little bit mean-spirited, destructive for its own sake - and (while some people do enjoy that) I felt I would be turned off by that, and probably wouldn't like the character(s) as a result. However, if there were a free demo, I would have tried it out to see whether maybe I'm wrong about that call, because the gameplay does look fun and creative.
     
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  17. thalesgal

    thalesgal Veteran Veteran

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    @Shaz hello!! Thank you so much for answering this thread!

    Thank you very much for giving your opinion! It is very important for me to make the right decision!
    I agree with you. I'll make the changes and the advertising first, then I will think about the price.

    I'm giving some keys. I'll send you one as a thank you for helping me!!
    It would be an honor if you could play a little bit hahaha!! But I don't want to bother, I'll send the key just for thanks!

    @bgillisp hi!!!
    Yes I totally agree! It is true that there is no fixed cost, but there was a lot of time spent! Hahha XDD
    I liked you said, it´s math, half the price would take more than 2 times to break even (considering the taxes).

    Thanks so much for helping me, you are such a nice guy!! I'll hold the price for a while!

    Hello @Wavelength thank you so much for answering!! :D

    My game has a good gameplay! If you are going to play until the end, on Easy mode, you will probably have about 6-8 hours of play!
    But if you like to do the full game, on normal mode (you will need to farm good weapons, good PETs.. etc), and collecting all the stars, and doing all the quests, you will have 30 hours of play for sure.

    Got it!

    Thank you so much for the feedback! I will improve the presentation of the game to eliminate this issue!

    So, to try to convince you that the game has a good story, I will show here a big spoiler about the game. I didn't show it in any trailer, anywhere, so the player got a nice surprise. But I would like to know your opinion if I should show this spoiler in the game presentation right away (Like in the store description and the game screenshots), to improve people's interest in buying the game.


    Here we go:

    At one point in the game the main character makes a chilling Discovery!
    spoiler 1.jpg

    She is actually dreaming inside a research tube in a secret lab, so the whole thing about the game changes. And now she has to beat her subconscious to wake up.

    From there the player will understand why some things are happening. Some maps for example have nonsense things, some characters do nonsense things as well... that's because it's all in her head!

    The main game screen also changes:
    spoiler 2.jpg

    I will also leave here a short video of the gameplay at the moment she discovers the whole thing:




    Please I would like you (or who are viewing this) to give me an opinion on this. Whether I should show or not, what did you think about this turnaround, and so on.

    Thank you so much for all the tips, and thank you so much in advance for reading this!!! It´s helping me a lot!

    I will give you a key as a thank you for helping me!! It's the only way I can thank xD
    If you could play it someday I would be very happy!! :D
     
    #17
  18. Bex

    Bex Veteran Veteran

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    10 000 Visits who realy clicked his page. less than 5 Sales.
    The presentation and shown Quality did not make them pay, the price for this kind of game is to high, its not a to the moon which is ok for 10€ and its also ok
    that game like to the moon try to sell themself for 20 to 30 at the first half year or so.

    The quality shown in the presentation and at the start of the game, and how the gameplay feels at the beginning is more a 1 to 3 € Game, 5 is a nice try, everything above, will make that he doesnt sell this, except it gets 80 to 90% in steam sales. But i did not sell games yet, so maybe listen to the others, or maybe make up your own mind, often there are different ways.
     
    #18
    thalesgal likes this.
  19. bgillisp

    bgillisp Global Moderators Global Mod

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    @Bex : the problem is we don't have data to know if that is normal or not. AAA companies don't release their data, but it could be 100,000,000 views and 4,675,900 sales for them, which is percentage wise, worse than what you posted.

    Also you used a logical falacy that is common in business, and that is you assume that everyone who looks at the product can afford to buy it or plans to buy it today (this is also common in retail for some reason too). The reality is, people can't always buy your product at that point in time. For some reason that idea keeps floating in business that everyone should always be able to buy your product if they see it and want it, but the hard reality is people have other obligations to spend money on like rent, food, gas, etc. Maybe they want it but can't afford it, or need to wait until payday as they have $2 in the bank account for now? To give you an example last year I had a medical bill of 6K I had to pay off, and until that was done I bought 0 games. All games went on my wishlist until that bill was wiped out. So unless we know the situation of every person who comes in we need to not assume that everyone who comes CAN afford to buy the game.
     
    #19
  20. Indinera

    Indinera Indie Dev Veteran

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    8 sure isn't a lot, has it picked up a bit by now?
    One thing that is important is wishlist count, how many of these have you got?
    Soon there'll be discounts, I'd try something like 40 or 50% off to see if that shakes up things a bit.
     
    #20
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