Let's talk about game intros.

[Neok]

Let's talk about game intros. First, a quote I've said on another RM site:

 

The biggest problem I have with a lot of games that has you sitting through an intro before any gameplay starts is that, I have no reason to 'care' yet about the characters or setting. Of course, this isn't always the case (say the intro starts out with a bang or a really interesting development, that's a good way to catch my focus). But frequently I'm finding I just want to get going with the game, and only after I've gotten a feel for how it plays/ how the characters respond/ developed an attachment to them, do I maybe want to hear about their situation.

 

Anyone else like this? Typically, most intros will establish a setting, introduce the main character and his/her situation, then maybe drop you into a tutorial or two before finally letting you take proper control and explore the game. Am I alone in thinking this is the absolute worst way to hook your players? Usually when I play a game, I want to do just that: play it. Not sit through a lecture on what some evil kingdom is up to or what this dude had for lunch last week. Of course there's cases where a game opens with an interesting development which then makes me want to pay attention to what else the intro has to say. But personally, I find that to be a rather rare thing indeed.

 

Thoughts?

 

[Archeia]

Coincidentally, I talked about this with my friends and we usually follow this guideline. It kinda covers what you're thinking I believe.

 

[Sausage_Boi]

For me, it really depends on the length of the intro, more than maybe 3 minutes and I start getting antsy, ready to play. I also don't usually read the manual until well after I am involved with the game and the only thing it really offers is some backstory. But I have noticed manuals with backstorys are increasingly a thing of the past...

Wow, reading Archeia's link, and I see "You have less than 3 minutes to get the user hooked, or at least interested."

 

[kerbonklin]

Whoever says that's the worst is acting like a bunch of spoiled brats who ignore a whole purpose of video games and also ignoring the designer's (developer's) vision/world. The RPG genre is not for them, or even most games in general. Almost every game takes time to introduce your character and the setting, because if the player doesn't care about them, then the developer has failed. (unless the player is an ignore ass who just wants to shoot people/zombies)

But anyways, intros shouldn't be too long and skipping cut-scenes should be an option if the engine potentially allows for it. (and in the case of RM, there are scripts for that) Character and setting/plot development is also something that can be done as the game progresses, so no need to stress it in the beginning.

 

[Dark_Metamorphosis]

Funny thing is that most of the succesful RPG Games start off with an intro and a bit of backstory before gameplay, Its all about preference. I love having to sit down and watch an intro scene to get some hint on what the game is about before I dive into the first gameplay, maybe that's just me though.

 

[c0n]

Actually, you make a good point.

NaughtyDog has been killing it with the way it tells stories (Uncharted series and The Last of Us)... The introductions are pretty immersive in that you're playing as you're being exposed (this was done EXTREMELY well in TLoU). I think game designers are starting to realize their responsibility as story tellers to tell a good story. Unfortunately, many RPGs suffer from some very... antiquated formulas. People aren't playing games to watch a movie, they actually want to play. And, honestly, I don't think intros should be used to expose the player to the overall story. I'm pretty guilty of this and so are most games, but I think the story is better served to start off by introducing the main character and, like you said, make the player care about him/her first. 

Great topic. 

 

[Oddball]

what if the intro is two sentences long, and immedeatly introduces what the player is supposed to do? As well as attempt to evoke empathy?

 

[Dymdez]

A good game intro will 'knock em dead.' There are, I think, some general principles, but remember, you can radically deviate from any general principle if your style and creativity allow for it. I think the best intro will be around 2 minutes and give enough context to start the game mentally situated.

 

[Sausage_Boi]

5 or 6 minutes seems to be a good length for RPG intros, and most of my favorites are between 3-6 minutes, one notable exception is FFVI at about 8 minutes for an intro. If I am playing any other game, 3 minutes is about as long as I want to wait, unless I am doing something more proactive than "push 'a' to advance text". 

 

[c0n]

what if the intro is two sentences long, and immedeatly introduces what the player is supposed to do? As well as attempt to evoke empathy?

That could work. As long as the atmosphere is motivating. Evoking empathy is one way. So is a sense of curiosity, or urgency.

 

[Chaos Avian]

Hmmm, this topic is quite interesting. If we go by that logic why were the Persona games (3 and 4) so much of a big hit? Their intros are at least 15-25 minutes long before you even get to save, let alone run about or battle.

 

[Neok]

Hmmm, this topic is quite interesting. If we go by that logic why were the Persona games (3 and 4) so much of a big hit? Their intros are at least 15-25 minutes long before you even get to save, let alone run about or battle.

Well I've definitely had a buddy ragequit the game because he couldn't get to do anything at all for the first half hour. Can't say I'm much a fan of it either!

Still, Persona 3/4 does have going for it the fact that its story is unique while also still being relate-able. Almost everybody was a highschool student at one point. Not to mention it's set in modern times, which is despair-inducingly rare for RPG's. Then the main character shoots himself in the head to summon a demon to fight a weird slime shadow thing that's carrying a mask and a bunch of knives and is out to get you after everyone in town suddenly became coffins.

Dunno 'bout you guys, but I'm willing to put up with a long-ass half hour intro to find out what the deal is with that!

 

[c0n]

Hmmm, this topic is quite interesting. If we go by that logic why were the Persona games (3 and 4) so much of a big hit? Their intros are at least 15-25 minutes long before you even get to save, let alone run about or battle.

I think it always depends, but casual gamers usually don't have the patience for that sort of thing. Kinda reminds me of the xenosagas which were basically movies with occasional gameplay. I used to be able to sit through this but I'm starting to be a lot more selective with what I'll give my energy to. 

 

[Sausage_Boi]

Kinda reminds me of the xenosagas which were basically movies with occasional gameplay. I used to be able to sit through this but I'm starting to be a lot more selective with what I'll give my energy to. 

I am with you on this. I just don't want to sit down to play a game and instead contend with a barely interactive movie.

 

[Diretooth]

Generally speaking, when I make an intro, I give some basis for the story, a few bits of easily skipped text, a short cutscene, maybe a battle or two.

For instance, I'll use two games I'm making.

Nevermore starts with the Earth dying, and how there's a way off, which then cuts to the Main Character leading a group of men to this way off, upon which he is betrayed.

Without explaining too much, but giving a fairly decent basis for character motivation, the game begins.

Black Wing, the other one, directly starts with the main character, Ormin, getting attacked by a headhunter while at a bar, A battle ensues with a basic tutorial, and he wins. He then walks over to a map, takes a mission, setting up the fact that he's a mercenary, walks back to the defeated headhunter, tells him that if he hopes to kill him, he should get stronger, and that he should come with him on the mission, then recruiting two other mercenaries to accompany him. (Which sets up some basic characterization and reveals to the player that you can hire other mercenaries to help you with missions.)

This is a fairly linear game, and an open world game respectively.

EDIT:

In regards to the link toward the beginning of the topic, I find I disagree with some of what it says. Personally, I wouldn't care if my game had 'replay value', so long as I got to tell a good story. I try to make a game like I write a book. I make it as entertaining as possible while giving them something new to experience. A reader will read a good book multiple times, and a bad book only once.

While my current examples with my aforementioned games are not fully in tune with that ideal, I'm still learning, and much like learning to write a halfway decent story, learning to make a halfway decent game takes just as much, maybe even more, learning and attention.

 

[Matseb2611]

I too am of the opinion that intros shouldn't be too long and should give the player control as soon as possible. The problem with many intros in games is that they tell rather than show. They start telling you the backstory one way or another, which to be honest, we still don't care about. Yes, for RPGs, introducing the story is important, but it is up to the developer to introduce it properly and in good time so to successfully hook the audience. Doing the info dump in the first 10 minutes is not the way to do it. Even in books that is a bad way to introduce the story. In the game that's even worse, because a game is an interactive medium. The only things you really need to experience in the first 10 minutes is the start of the conflict and what the main character is like. Leave elaborate backstories for later. It will be a lot more interesting to introduce them gradually and to keep the player guessing.

 

[Archeia]

Hmmm, this topic is quite interesting. If we go by that logic why were the Persona games (3 and 4) so much of a big hit? Their intros are at least 15-25 minutes long before you even get to save, let alone run about or battle.

Persona 4's long intro turns off a lot of players and some, who already finished it, from replaying. It's not something I would recommend. Persona 3's intro on the other hand had a unique intro that makes you want to know more what's up with the Dark Hour. It might be slow but at least they added a catch immediately. And seeing a girl with a gun about to shoot you and other things is just suspicious as hell.

 

[whitesphere]

When I look at my 2 favorite RPGs --- Final Fantasy IV and Chrono Trigger --- they handle game intros very differently.

FFIV has a fairly brief intro, showing Cecil is the Captain of the Red Wings, and they took a Crystal from Mysidia, then you're dropped into a battle, return to the Castle for a few more cutscenes, then eventually leave Baron with your friend Kain.  Only then can you save, but it doesn't feel too boring.

Chrono Trigger, in contrast, starts you waking up in the morning, shows a celebration going on, and your mother says to get out of bed.  After that, she prompts you for your name and your friend (Lucca)'s name.  Then you're free to go.  So there's very little intro.

I favor Chrono Trigger's approach better in my own games.  I try to give the player control right away, with maybe some brief text explaining what s/he has to do.  Any backstory or whatever, I reveal by in-game books or NPCs as the player explores the world.

Personally, if I were interested in a game that had a half-hour intro, I'd just quit playing before the intro completed.  If I wanted to watch a movie, I'd watch a movie.  I expect games to be interactive, fairly early on.

 

[Oddball]

What if the long intro was a little bit into the game or they intersperse game play into it yet didn't make it feel like a tutorial?

What if it was a long intro... yet the player controlled how the intro went? like what characters said and what happened next, as well as it immediately introducing a hook?

 

[Sausage_Boi]

@Oddball I would certainly say that is more fun than watching an episode of Game X instead of playing it. As for controlling the intro... With a lot of work, that would be a fun game. If you could keep on shaping the story as you play, depending on what you do or don't do, what you say, where you go... End up with a different character at the end because of it...

hmm...

You working on any projects right now, Oddball?