Options menus, accessibility and content warnings

marbeltoast

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Howdy folks!


I've been busy cracking away with the yanfly options core plugin and building a more comprehensive options menu.

I'm here because of accessibility options. Now, we all know about colourblind modes and epilepsy friendly modes, but for one woman bands like mine, knowing what sorts of other options to include can be tricky.

Addtionally, I'm including a content warnings option, to cover the breadth of subject matter (body horror, depictions of real world issues such as racism) that a player may not feel comfortable with having in their gameplay experience. Second verse, same as the first: I don't automatically know what sorts of things player may want to censor from their screens.

I come to you, the great multitude of lived human experience that is the interwebs, to ask what accessibility options and content warnings you think a game should have!


Some background: my project is a rogue-like psychological horror, with a complex story that twists and turns as the player progresses. It takes place in a fantasy setting, wherein the dominant human race is subjugating an amphibious fish race in a manner remniscant to colonialism, which includes the ransacking of artwork to be held in museums for years to come. At some points, the player will need to solve puzzles (of a fashion; we aren't really thinking "sliding blocks" here) in order to make tangible story progress.


If you have any suggestions, don't hesitate! I'll take anything under consideration!
If you want more context on the game than what I have provided here, let me know!

Thanks for reading and have youself a great day!
 

TheoAllen

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colourblind modes
This probably essential when you're making a color matching game like Match 3 or something that requires the player to know the color.

epilepsy friendly modes
I don't know about this one, never seen it in any game I play.
But if you mean to reduce the excessive flashing, well, having an excessive flashing on itself is a bad idea in my opinion.

Addtionally, I'm including a content warnings option, to cover the breadth of subject matter (body horror, depictions of real world issues such as racism) that a player may not feel comfortable with having in their gameplay experience. Second verse, same as the first: I don't automatically know what sorts of things player may want to censor from their screens.
Having an option to censor violence (blood, gore, limb detachment, etc) would be appreciated regardless of whatever game you are making if you care about accessibility. It is a universal sensor option that most people would agree with.
 

marbeltoast

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Hhm. I don't really disagree with what you're saying here, but I was more hoping that people who have specific needs could come forwards and describe ways that games could better cater to them.

Let's go point by point:

This probably essential when you're making a color matching game like Match 3 or something that requires the player to know the color.

In my context, it might not be essential, per se, but if it makes life easier, I feel that it's still a worthy addition.

I don't know about this one, never seen it in any game I play.
But if you mean to reduce the excessive flashing, well, having an excessive flashing on itself is a bad idea in my opinion.

Define "excessive". Is any flashing at all excessive? This is the sort of thing I'm thinking about when I'm in this design space; that turning on these options would let you adjust the game to your level of comfort.

Having an option to censor violence (blood, gore, limb detachment, etc) would be appreciated regardless of whatever game you are making if you care about accessibility. It is a universal sensor option that most people would agree with.

Violence is one potential avenue I'm considering, but there's a fair bit of other content that might be worth thinking about as well. As for the "most people would agree with" part, that's not really what this is about.

If "most people" need to change one of the options in the menu, then it should be changed by default. These options are for those people who fall outside of the bell curve in some way, who might not be accomodated for with the game experience as is.
 

ATT_Turan

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Now, we all know about colourblind modes and epilepsy friendly modes
We don't...I have never seen either of those things in a game I've played ;)
Addtionally, I'm including a content warnings option, to cover the breadth of subject matter (body horror, depictions of real world issues such as racism) that a player may not feel comfortable with having in their gameplay experience.
What does this mean/how could it work? Are you going to have your players toggle the option and then...all scenes with that material in your game get skipped? They're given a vague summary of what was said and done and continue with the next part? Are you entirely rewriting portions of your game depending on this option?

This sounds to me like something that should be stated in the product page for your game before people choose to buy it, not something you're trying to accommodate during play.

My personal opinion is that you're doing too much to try to cater to the extreme or the outlier with your game, when it's not really your responsibility to do so - make the game you want, make clear in your presentation and advertising what expectations people should have for the content, and then they'll deal accordingly.
 

marbeltoast

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We don't...I have never seen either of those things in a game I've played ;)

Clearly you and I have played very few of the same games.

What does this mean/how could it work? Are you going to have your players toggle the option and then...all scenes with that material in your game get skipped? They're given a vague summary of what was said and done and continue with the next part? Are you entirely rewriting portions of your game depending on this option?

In the menu, there will be a list of multiple options, with one option separate from the others; at the top. They are all on/off toggles.

All of the options which are grouped at the bottom will pertain to a specific aspect of content that the player may feel uncomfortable with; blood, gore, racism, etc. Any options here which are toggled on will come with a warning before the content is displayed on screen (see the game "Ikenfell")

The option at the top will allow the player to go one step further; outright disabling any content which has toggled on below in some way. Context will determine whether this means a summation of what just happened in a text box after a cut to black, or a severely less violent version of the same event (see the game "fallout 2" and it's violence settings). The story will not be rewritten in any way (again, see the game "Ikenfell")

This way, the player has full control.
 

ATT_Turan

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I play primarily professional games, and I don't recall ever seeing either of those options in a menu - I used to see the legally-standard epilepsy warning, but I don't really see that anymore. A quick poke at the Internet shows that only has actually affected some 3 percent of epileptics who are prone to seizures - so those people are probably quite used to taking what preventive measures they need to, but you're certainly welcome to provide the option if you want to go through the effort.

I don't recall ever seeing a colorblind mode, because it's become pretty standard design to simply make your overall UI friendly to it in terms of what contrasting colors and symbols are used.

As for the rest - you've clearly thought out how you want to do it, and intend to do so. That's fine. Your question in your original post was for people to tell you what options they think you ought to include, so I did.

You then specified in another post that you're specifically looking for more niche opinions of how to further restrict specific aspects of your game, which is fine if that's something you have a reason to want to do.

Good luck with your project!
 

TheoAllen

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In my context, it might not be essential, per se, but if it makes life easier, I feel that it's still a worthy addition.
Define "life easier".
What part makes it easier? we don't know anything about your game.
I mean, why not just design a game that is already colorblind-friendly?

A given example:
- Damage popup for HP and MP uses a different color (not colorblind friendly)
- Damage popup has an "HP/MP" label to indicate the damage (colorblind-friendly)

Define "excessive". Is any flashing at all excessive? This is the sort of thing I'm thinking about when I'm in this design space; that turning on these options would let you adjust the game to your level of comfort.
The definition of excessive is when your player started to complain about it.
I personally wouldn't add the option until that point. Either fix it by adding an option if you don't want to let it go for some reason or adjust it.

Clearly you and I have played very few of the same games.
Include me in this group. I haven't seen any.

If "most people" need to change one of the options in the menu, then it should be changed by default. These options are for those people who fall outside of the bell curve in some way, who might not be accomodated for with the game experience as is.
I honestly don't want to discuss the point about "most people" means being the default config. Rather, a censor to violence is an addition that people would not mind. And at some games, (normie games) that probably would be preferable, still depends on the game.

Obviously, the entire charm of DOOM is about violence and gore, and having a toggle for it would be weird. But for a game like Skyrim/Fallout and other "normal" games, an option to disable limb detachment would be appreciated.

P.S:
If you start arguing "but in my game", then it is probably better to report your post and ask it to move to the game ideas and prototype.
 

marbeltoast

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The definition of excessive is when your player started to complain about it.
I personally wouldn't add the option until that point. Either fix it by adding an option if you don't want to let it go for some reason or adjust it.

How do I know when my players start to complain? The obvious answer is playtest, playtest, playtest, but even that isn't going to catch everything. You've only got one chance at a first impression, and many players don't come back to see if a game they tried once and didn't like has improved.

At any rate, thanks for the feedback.

A quick poke at the Internet shows that only has actually affected some 3 percent of epileptics who are prone to seizures - so those people are probably quite used to taking what preventive measures they need to

See, I hear that and I think "why should they have to be on lookout all the time?" Leisure activities such as gaming should be a place where you come to relax.

Addtionally, there's the curb cut effect, where features designed for one group end up benefitting multiple groups. I dislike bright flashing lights because it's annoying, not because I'm going to have a seizure.


Good luck with your project!

Thank you, and thanks for the feedback!
 

ATT_Turan

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See, I hear that and I think "why should they have to be on lookout all the time?" Leisure activities such as gaming should be a place where you come to relax.
Because it's a part of them having their condition. It's unfortunate, but it's not your job to try to cater to different tiny percentages of the population who may never see your product. You clearly want to, so, like, just don't have flashing lights? I don't understand why you keep going back and forth on this point - you care about inducing seizures, you say you don't like flashing lights yourself, so just don't choose to write them into your game. Why is it even something in your options at that point?

How do I know when my players start to complain? The obvious answer is playtest, playtest, playtest, but even that isn't going to catch everything. You've only got one chance at a first impression, and many players don't come back to see if a game they tried once and didn't like has improved.
Playtesting can be difficult, especially on an amateur product. The best thing is to try to get some number of people to commit to it, understanding that there will be things they'll suggest to change that may get implemented. But, again, when you get into such tiny niche details, you won't catch "everything" that anyone could possibly have an opinion about. You physically can't. And if you tried, you'd get contradicting things.
 

yeetMyDudes

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If you're concerned about "what point is acceptable" for flashing lights, I suggest researching guidelines and such which are often applied to other forms of media - I've found that the UK implements the "Harding Test" for TV broadcast, which is intended to find content which isn't suitable for viewers with epilepsy (this is going off minimal information here, but you get the picture). Maybe that's a point to start looking at, but honestly just having a few friends view your animations/cutscenes in order to get an honest second opinion about whether it feels too intense will likely be enough. If it's uncomfortable or annoying to look at, then that may be a good place to start changing things.
As for content warnings, even if you struggle to implement a full filter, I think a notice at the beginning of the game would be appreciated by many.
 

marbeltoast

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Because it's a part of them having their condition. It's unfortunate, but it's not your job to try to cater to different tiny percentages of the population who may never see your product. You clearly want to, so, like, just don't have flashing lights? I don't understand why you keep going back and forth on this point - you care about inducing seizures, you say you don't like flashing lights yourself, so just don't choose to write them into your game. Why is it even something in your options at that point?

Okay, I'll be honest with you: I pulled epilepsy out of thin air as a generic example of the sort of thing I went in to this thread looking for: specific issues that people who aren't me have with media. I did not expect it to become a major talking point. I never planned to even have flashing lights because I find them annoying. It was only ever meant to serve as an example. I argued the point for a while but it's clearly not making sense to keep that up anymore.


But, again, when you get into such tiny niche details, you won't catch "everything" that anyone could possibly have an opinion about. You physically can't. And if you tried, you'd get contradicting things.

I know I'll never catch everything. But I can catch something, if I try. I can help somebody have more media that they can enjoy. If even one person gets another game that "they can play too" out of this, it's worth it. I choose to bear that burden.

As for content warnings, even if you struggle to implement a full filter, I think a notice at the beginning of the game would be appreciated by many.

I am currently planning on having a warning on whatever website the game gets too when that day finally comes.

Thanks for the feedback!
 

HawkZombie

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I just wanna talk on the toggles for censorship of certain elements from the game.

Personally, I can understand light ones, such as the color of the blood (this was usually done to get around censorship laws in different countries, for example, and not to deal with any triggers or other triggering elements players might encounter while playing). However, if you're offering toggles for most of the things you're portraying in your game, my question to you is:

What kind of story are you trying to tell? If those elements are unnecessary and able to be turned off so easily, what import do they have to your story and narrative? Do they actually matter, or is their inclusion simply to be able to say 'I added an option to turn them off! Look how accessible this is now!'

If they're key elements to your story and game, then don't put them in with a toggle. All games with questionable imagery and themes usually have disclaimers on the game pages (first thing) and a splash page right when you start up the game. I personally think those are adequate enough.
 

marbeltoast

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What kind of story are you trying to tell? If those elements are unnecessary and able to be turned off so easily, what import do they have to your story and narrative? Do they actually matter, or is their inclusion simply to be able to say 'I added an option to turn them off! Look how accessible this is now!'

If they're key elements to your story and game, then don't put them in with a toggle. All games with questionable imagery and themes usually have disclaimers on the game pages (first thing) and a splash page right when you start up the game. I personally think those are adequate enough.

I certainly understand the logic of your argument, but riddle me this: what is the difference between this argument and the argument for the exclusion of an easy mode in a hard video game? Some would argue that difficulty is part of the story of, say, "Celeste", as it is thematically a game about struggling against adversity, and yet the devs included assist mode to allow anyone to complete the game, with no penalties whatsoever to achievements or what-have-you.

Some people deal with racism on a day to day basis. Real, painful depictions of this in what is supposed to be a leisure activity might ruin for them what would otherwise be a fun game from a mechanical perspective.

I'm not completely convinced in the argument I've just presented, but I've yet to hear some retort that really settles the question. What do you think?
 

TheoAllen

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what is the difference between this argument and the argument for the exclusion of an easy mode in a hard video game? Some would argue that difficulty is part of the story of, say, "Celeste", as it is thematically a game about struggling against adversity, and yet the devs included assist mode to allow anyone to complete the game, with no penalties whatsoever to achievements or what-have-you.
You asked about a difficulty setting. Let me flip the question for you.

What is the difference between an easy mode and hard mode difficulty setting with "a challenge in each round for S rank achievement with only bragging's right as a reward"?

Your argument about difficulty setting is that there is an easy mode for accessibility for people who could not play well so that they could enjoy the game. The argument that the game is made in hard mode then the dev nerf the game and create a normal and easy difficulty setting. This probably is what exactly happened and your argument is not wrong. Considering the difficulty label went like this:
- Easy
- Normal
- Hard

But have you considered if the difficulty label went like this? (These are just label)
- Normal
- Hard
- Brutal

Does that imply accessibility?
Have you considered if the difficulty setting means an extra challenge for those who want more?
Does your censorship toggle have the same goal as "I want more explicit content because I'm masochist"?
 

marbeltoast

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But have you considered if the difficulty label went like this? (These are just label)
- Normal
- Hard
- Brutal

Does that imply accessibility?
Have you considered if the difficulty setting means an extra challenge for those who want more?
Does your censorship toggle have the same goal as "I want more explicit content because I'm masochist"?

I think I understand what you are saying, but I don't think it really applies. The trouble with this is that it assumes the aforementioned "assist mode" feature was like an ordinary easy, medium, hard difficulty slider.

"Assist mode", in Celeste (the game that I am basing a lot of my difficulty related options on), was a boolean option. Either it was on, or it was off. When it is on, it gives several options, such as extra jump dashes (Celeste is a platformer), slower time to make timing jumps easier and invincibility, which the player can adjust to meet their own needs. When it came time to adding more difficulty for the people who wanted it, that wasn't handled with an option in the menu; it was dealt with through extra levels and bonus dlc's that really ratcheted up the challenge.

This is where the comparisons between "easy/hard" and "racism/non-racism" start to break down. The content in my game is already as vile as I am comfortable with depicting, and players will be told what to expect before they start, while also being told that there is an option to tone it down a little if that would really kill their enjoyment because it hits too close to home. It's a boolean, not a sliding scale.
 

ATT_Turan

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Okay, so here's the thing. Role-playing games, as a genre, are defined by being more about telling a story than other genres. You've made it clear that you've put a lot of thought and planning into your story with some of the details you've provided.

So what is the point in being able to selectively censor parts of that story? When your story is a psychological horror about humans enslaving fishmen, and one of your players decides any mention of slavery is offensive to them and toggles that option...well, what the heck is your story about now?

How do you even change it? Do you just omit certain words so now the humans talk about their BestBud fish instead of their slave fish? Do you skip entire conversations and give some kind of summary? If so, does that take away the knowledge from the player that this setting has fish slaves? Are they going to see it in the description of the game before they buy it then somehow turn off the option and forget it exists?

If someone decides they get triggered by the concept of slavery, they're not gonna buy your darned game, even if you tell them they can toggle off all mentions of it, because it's a part of your story.

You need to figure out what you are trying to create. If you're creating an RPG, you're telling a story, and that story has the content you wrote - you can warn people about it if you feel it necessary, but once you start changing it, you're no longer telling the story you conceived of. If your more important goal is to create a product to guarantee that 'even one person gets another game that "they can play too,"' then make a platformer or puzzle game that has no story. Or make a super inoffensive story with kitty-people catching fireflies...but it just seems bizarre to see you talking about wanting to tell a story with adult, dark, serious themes, but you want people to be able to somehow experience that story with none of those elements.
 

marbeltoast

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If you're creating an RPG, you're telling a story, and that story has the content you wrote - you can warn people about it if you feel it necessary, but once you start changing it, you're no longer telling the story you conceived of. If your more important goal is to create a product to guarantee that 'even one person gets another game that "they can play too,"' then make a platformer or puzzle game that has no story.

Okay, this part was my fault for putting both the content warnings AND accessibility features in the same thread. They are different issues and are being dealt with in different ways, and the "they can play too" part is really more about physical or mental impairments that prevent a player from interacting with game mechanics in a meaningful way, than it is about choosing what subject matter you want to experience. My bad, should have made the distinction clearer.

If someone decides they get triggered by the concept of slavery, they're not gonna buy your darned game, even if you tell them they can toggle off all mentions of it, because it's a part of your story.

What can I say except "How can you be sure?" It might sound contradictory on paper, but we don't actually know until somebody tries.

How do you even change it? Do you just omit certain words so now the humans talk about their BestBud fish instead of their slave fish? Do you skip entire conversations and give some kind of summary? If so, does that take away the knowledge from the player that this setting has fish slaves? Are they going to see it in the description of the game before they buy it then somehow turn off the option and forget it exists?

As I described previously, the system would work twofold: The player chooses which content they want to tag, and, if they do nothing more, then a warning will appear on screen before the content of those tagged types appears, so they know ahead of time. The content would remain as previously designed.

They also have the option of disabling any content which has been tagged, in which case, context would determine how that content is disabled. Conversations would be summarised, animations would be made less gratiutous, but the important thing is that the fundamental story would remain the same. All of this will be made clear in the section of the game description which covers content settings, which would be found alongside a synopsis of the story, an overview of the mechanics and so on.



The fundamental point of disagreement we seem to have here is thus: I don't actually think it's a bad thing for a player to play a game where they have removed the story elements that they dislike.

Like, who really suffers as a result of that?

The player in question has more fun and gets to interact with the mechanics.
Nobody else is affected unless they specifically opt in, which they would only do if they wanted to.

It's a bit like cheat codes in single player games. You could say that "The game's difficulty is how you designed it! Nobody would buy a game they don't have the skill to overcome, even if they knew they could remove that difficulty!" ...but years of data says otherwise. Who cares if some random player doesn't want to interact with the story? More power to them.
 

TheoAllen

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What can I say except "How can you be sure?" It might sound contradictory on paper, but we don't actually know until somebody tries.
This applies to everything though. You can't be sure until you try. If someone is not sure and waiting for someone to confirm or verify, they won't be taking a risk of exploring the unknown and then tell the experience to someone.

The fundamental point of disagreement we seem to have here is thus: I don't actually think it's a bad thing for a player to play a game where they have removed the story elements that they dislike.

Like, who really suffers as a result of that?
It is not fundamentally bad. If you put a censorship toggle or whatever toggle you decide to put, I won't stop you. But let's talk about the consequence, which could be good or bad depending on how you view it.

The time you've put various toggles in your game, you are accepting that everyone will experience a different game. If a game presents a difficult boss, there will be a guide on how to beat the boss if people play the "same" game. And people would appreciate the guide made by the fellow players. If the game offers a tuned down of the difficulty setting, people would play a "different" game and a conversation around the boss probably won't be as deep as it can go.

Replace the "boss" and its mechanic with the story. I think that would not be much different depends on how much you decide to censor it. If you're fine with this. Then go for it.

I believe the reason why most people telling you to keep the element of your game was so that you are delivering the same experience to the players. And because they share the same experience, people could build a community around it.
 

marbeltoast

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I think our disagreements have reached a natural stopping point.

It is, indeed, a trade-off, between having deep player connectivity, or having a broader range of potential players who have more seperate experiences. It is a trade-off that I think is worthwhile; after all, I can't know for certain that I'm going to have ANY fans, much less enough to justify worrying about the "broader fan community". That, to me, is like buying one lottery ticket and immediatly wondering about how you'll spend the money. Like, cross that bridge when you get there, you know?

Still, I thank you for your correspondance. It's always worth debating our ideas, even if we come away still believing the same things we did when we entered.

Best of luck with your own work!
 

BK-tdm

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Its all good for accesibility and being considerate with people who are colorblind or have epilepsy or any other disability, that i agree and encourage.

Now turning off parts of the content to cater to "some" i dont agree with, its like turning off gore in doom or diablo, it would cripple the experience and change the game dramatically, theres a line between "tweaking my game so it doesnt hurt you physically" to "tweaking my game so it doesnt hurt your feelings", author wants to show racism is bad then you cant turn off racism from the story...

Adjust so your game is more accesible but dont try to cater to everyone, because on todays internets you will offend someone by not having a flat world map.
 

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