Permanent Trigger Events

Discussion in 'Game Mechanics Design' started by Baggie, Oct 26, 2019.

  1. Baggie

    Baggie Someone Veteran

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    I have a few "permanent triggers" in this game I'm working on and I'm curious as to what other people think of this?

    Pretty much, using Hime's Sync Save Data plugin with another "Save Data Relocater" plugin, you create a scenario in your game that will have a permanent effect on the game itself that the player shouldn't be able to have easy access to.

    EDIT:
    Let's say you're at a point where you can choose to either battle an enemy or have them join your party.

    If you battle with them and essentially kill them, they'll no longer exist in the game.
    The permanent trigger would be that enemy no longer existing regardless, if you completely restart your game or not.
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2019
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  2. Milennin

    Milennin "With a bang and a boom!" Veteran

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    You're first going to need to give me a reason to help. Going into a game with someone asking me to do something for them without giving a reason isn't enough of a motivation. Declining to help should let me find out what's happening before making a more informed decision later on.
     
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  3. bgillisp

    bgillisp Global Moderators Global Mod

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    Those are also called artificial choices by players. If I can't continue the game without agreeing to help, why make it a choice in the first place? There's no reason then, as any other choice is moot.
     
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  4. Baggie

    Baggie Someone Veteran

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    Ah, I see. I definitely also I give a poor example, like a SUPER poor example. I'm sorry for that.


    Let's say you're at a point where you can choose to either battle an enemy or have them join your party.

    If you battle with them and essentially kill them, they'll no longer exist in the game.
    The permanent trigger would be that enemy no longer existing regardless, if you completely restart your game or not.


    Does that concept sit well with you or does it seem too game breaking?
     
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  5. Milennin

    Milennin "With a bang and a boom!" Veteran

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    That would be fine, as long as either outcome is viable to completing the game. But I think most people are going to stick with their choice, unless you make one choice obviously the wrong one to make, then it would only punish the player for choosing the wrong choice without a way of getting back, which would not be ideal.
     
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  6. Tiamat-86

    Tiamat-86 old jrpg gamer Veteran

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    that sounds horrible.
    scenario : brother playing game > makes choice > permanent trigger
    > i play game > doesnt even get a choice, never did, never will > builds animosity towards brother for dumb reason

    branch path choices are used as ways to give a game more replay value. this is removing the replay value of branch choices entirely and i would hate any game doing this to me.

    as for @bgillisp comment about artificial choices, FF6 "will u join the returners" yes = gauntlet (crap) no x3 = genji glove (epic)
    artificial choices with no rewards and choices which roadblock until u say yes are horrible i agree. but when the artifical choice comes with hidden rewards it just adds to replay value which is nice
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2019
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  7. Wavelength

    Wavelength Pre-Merge Boot Moderator

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    @Rockenberg You may want to edit your first post to include the second example so that people who only read the first post and then reply don't get fixated on the "false choice" of starting a new game or not.

    Honestly, I really like this kind of thing in general - it boosts the immersion and intensity of your game, because the player will get the point that it's not about "oh you made the wrong choice, just do it again" - but rather now it's about "you have agency over this world and this story - use it wisely!" Anything you can do to further that end makes the experience more compelling.

    At the same time, it also takes away from the player's ability to control their own experience, in that they can't "play the way they like it" if they make a decision they're not happy with. For this reason, be careful about making the consequences of your actions too obscure. If the player has to save one character vs., save the other (letting the one they don't save die), the player knows what they're doing. If the player's decision is to check the attic vs. check the basement and each one eventually leads to one character or the other dying, the player may end up being very unhappy with the result and feeling like the choice wasn't really in their hands. Yes, real life often goes like this, but the point of video games isn't to imitate real life. The point of video games is to be enjoyable and compelling.

    BTW, I don't even mind false choices like the one you mentioned for "Start a New Game" as long as they're backed up by this mechanic. If something is there to remind me I chose not to help them 4 times, I think that's reason enough to allow the choice, even if I'm eventually forced to make the other decision.
     
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