Publishing by Degica?

Discussion in 'Commercial Games Discussion' started by MechScapeZH, Jun 25, 2019.

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  1. MechScapeZH

    MechScapeZH Veteran Veteran

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  2. MushroomCake28

    MushroomCake28 KAMO Studio Veteran

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    Sorry I don't know the answer, but I'll be following this thread since it's an interesting topic.

    On another note, it's important to know the terms if Degica publishes your game in your stead. For commercial games, the subject of price and commission is especially important. Steam already takes 30% (lower commission if you sell for over 10$M and 50$M respectively), and Degica might take a portion as well. That doesn't leave the dev with much (I already think the 30% from Steam is overkill, but I guess it's worth it for the number of users. That's another topic though).
     
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  3. MechScapeZH

    MechScapeZH Veteran Veteran

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    I didn't know that- that's a big percentage. ...Wow.

    But it's worth it because of how many users they have, right...? I'll have to think.

    That's why I was asking- there doesn't seem to be any public documentation of their terms. I looked on their website, and I didn't find anything there. I'm aware that I could email them, but- and no offense to them, they are a business- they would definitely tell me "you should absolutely be published by us!" and frame the information in such a way that would make me want to choose them- I wanted to get the information from members here, who should be more unbiased.
     
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  4. NeoFantasy

    NeoFantasy Building Worlds Veteran

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    You don’t only have to publish on steamthough. . There is the Epic game store and I think Big Fish games takes RPG maker gamed as well (though I don’t know how big the audience for games is there).

    So you may take a big hit income wise, but it may be worth it for word of mouth.
     
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  5. Heirukichi

    Heirukichi Veteran Veteran

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    @MechScapeZH They do, but the percentage they take is disclosed under a(n) NDA so I hardly doubt anyone can post that here (especially since it is Degica's official forum). Theoretically, you should not disclose how much Steam takes as well, but looking on the internet, that information is easy to get (because somebody broke the NDA before). Even so, Valve always states that prices should only be discussed in private.
     
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  6. MushroomCake28

    MushroomCake28 KAMO Studio Veteran

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    @Heirukichi Steam's commission is now public knowledge officially. All big stores from my knowledge disclose publicly their cut in sales. Steam is 30%, Epic Store is 12%, itch.io is to the dev's choice, etc. It would be stupid not to disclose it publicly, because why would devs want to do business with someone that doesn't say how much he'll take (before becoming partner). Stores try to market their cut% to try to attract devs to become partner.

    As for Degica, I would find it stupid if the % cut isn't public. It's like the most important information before starting any discussion about partnership.
     
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  7. MechScapeZH

    MechScapeZH Veteran Veteran

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    Ah, all right. I didn't know about those two- I'll keep them in mind. Thank you. :)

    Something else I didn't know- that makes sense, now that I think about it. ...I feel a bit silly now. :oops: Thank you! :)

    Well, I suppose it's their decision whether to make the information public or not. Thank you. :)

    Now, having all this information, my question becomes- has anyone here done a publishing deal, and if so, did being published by Degica increase sales of the published game?

    Thanks to everyone for their help.
     
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  8. Heirukichi

    Heirukichi Veteran Veteran

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    If my memory does not fail me, it took them more than 10 years to make it officially public though. Provided that I agree with you and companies should share that information (after all it is the first thing developers are going to ask), I am not surprised if somebody else does not want to let the public know about it.

    @MechScapeZH I am not sure about that to be honest. What I know for sure is that a lot of people only buy from Steam because there is an annoying way of thinking nowadays that is "if your game is not on Steam, it is not a real game". If I am not wrong, however, Skyborn was published by Degica and, as far as I know, it had a fair amount of success. On top of it, your game could be sold in Degica humble bundle once a year, which should boost your sales a little bit.

    You might want to contact them and ask for more information. I am quite sure they can provide you more details than any other forum user could.
     
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  9. MushroomCake28

    MushroomCake28 KAMO Studio Veteran

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    @Heirukichi Yeah it used to be a secret, but they also had no competitor. Anyways it's a contractual matter, and it's pretty much up to the company to decide to make it public or not. But personally, I would always strongly prefer to become partner AFTER knowing what the commission fee is.
     
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  10. Andar

    Andar Veteran Veteran

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    not really, 30% is LOW.
    On average any merchant has to DOUBLE the price for every ware he sells in order to be able to survive after his own costs, after paying his employees and rents and taxes and so on. Ask every merchant in every shop around your home town - what they pay for their wares is usually about half of what they charge their customers.

    Some minor online shops might be able to get their costs down to get away with a lot less than 50% (although a lot of those shops fail exactly because they sell too cheap), but a big corporation?
    As I said, 30% is LOW. Just for comparison, in case of books most bookshops expect to keep 60% of the book price, the wholesaler halves it again and then there is the printing house - an author who mass-sells his books physically usually gets 10%-20% of the regular cover price.
     
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  11. TheoAllen

    TheoAllen Self-proclaimed jack of all trades Veteran

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    From what I've heard, Epic Store does not accept "low-effort" games and/or anime-themed game, whichever is true.
    Anyway, sorry for derailing the topic.
     
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  12. Kes

    Kes Global Moderators Global Mod

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    Just to point out, of course you would know the fee before becoming a partner. By definition it would be in any contract you signed, which I assume you would read before signing. But realistically, no publisher is going to wait until that stage to mention what it would be. My guess (because I don't use Degica as a publisher) is that before discussing details like that, they would want to look at your game to see if it is something they want to publish (QA, genre etc.) and only if satisfied would they then would move into contractual details.
     
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  13. MechScapeZH

    MechScapeZH Veteran Veteran

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    Ah, I didn't know about the bundle. That's cool... It'll definitely impact my decision. Again, as I said before, I certainly do plan to contact them- I just wanted to get the opinions/information of members here before doing so.

    This is also news to me- so it's a good commission. I have never done anything like this before, so I know nothing. But looking at typical indie games on Steam, especially those made with RPG Maker, their price almost never exceeds $10, so 30% would eat up a significant portion of their profits, right...? Considering that their price is so low to begin with.

    My game is neither of those, so it wouldn't affect me... That's pretty stupid if it's true, though. Just for being "anime-themed?" Lots of Western stuff is anime-inspired now, so where do they draw the line? Also, this excludes a whole genre of games from their store. "Low-effort" I can understand, but "anime-themed?" Weird.

    This is great to hear and makes a lot of sense. Thank you @Kes .


    To be honest- the main reason I'm considering Degica is that they will (presumably) allow me to skip a lot of the hassles that come with self-publishing. I don't want to pursue game development as a career... I just want my work to be "seen" by the world. From what I've been reading, self-publishing is complicated, at least for publishing on Steam, and I really just want my game released. The only reason I'm even considering selling my game at all is that I've spent so many years developing this idea that I would be happy if at least a little money comes out of it- not entirely "for profit," but more so that I know what I've done is successful and that people like it enough to pay for it. ...I don't know if that's dumb, but that's it. That's my motive. :)

    Thanks to everyone for responding. I'll keep looking into it.

    Thanks to everyone for responding. I'll keep looking into it.
     
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  14. MushroomCake28

    MushroomCake28 KAMO Studio Veteran

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    Actually this is false because you're confusing publisher and distributor (I'm talking about the publisher entity, not the act of publishing). Publisher have editorial work, are responsible for management, advertising the product, marketing, legal stuff, etc. So authors for example, publishers usually take care of all that marketing stuff and sales stuff and the author only has to write the book and transfer the intellectual property. In that case 30% commission is extremely low, and usually royalties for the author is only 5%, or 10-15% if they're really good.

    Distributors are very different: they simply take your product and publish it or make it available for sale over a wide network. There are 2 main differences with publishers:
    1. The author/creator does not transfer his/her product's intellectual property over.
    2. The distributor is only an intermediary for your sales. He does not do any advertisement, marketing, editing, legal stuff, management for you whatsoever. The author/creator is responsible for all those aspects.
    In the case of distributors, 30% is extremely high. Commissions for intermediaries in various domain is usually something around 10%, and I've even seen 5%. Real estate agents get even lower commissions, like 1-2% depending on the price of the house/building/property.

    In the case of steam, it can call itself a publisher and all, but steam is a distributor. It's a platform (like Facebook... it's a publisher even if Zuckerberg said that in congress). You are responsible for the marketing, for the legal aspect of your game, for editing, updating, etc. 30% is extremely high. (@MechScapeZH might want to read that, 30% commission for a distributor is extremely high). Just check the Epic Stores's 12% commission in contrast, which is a lot more reasonable (and if a creator uses UE4, the 5% is including inside the 12%, meaning selling an UE4 game in the Epic store will only cost the dev 12% in commissions, whereas it would be 35% in the steam store).

    Yeah I understand that, but it would be still be better for us and Degica if they had a thread with crucial details for publishing with them. They could for example say "commission fees usually vary between 5% to 15% depending on the game". What they decide to disclose or not is their choice, but they should at least advertise that option more on this forum. We're asking questions like OP because of the lack of information in general.

    Yeah it doesn't accept indie games much for now, since it's new and they haven't perfected their game screening process (I think it's done manually, so it takes a lot of time per game). They're only accepting big games currently, but I think they said they'd be open to accept all kind of games in the future. I know they have a bad reputation currently, but man their 12% commission instead of 30% is appealing. At the end of the day it's just a question of how much you'll sell on steam vs how much you'll sell on the epic store, and if the 12% saves you enough money to offset the lost of sales.
     
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  15. bgillisp

    bgillisp Global Moderators Global Mod

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    I 2nd that Steam's 30% is kinda high as Steam does no major work for your game. If they helped advertise it and promote it then the 30% might be worth it, and maybe even on the low side, but for the amount of 'work' Steam does these days, they don't deserve 30% anymore in my opinion.

    For comparison my publisher takes 27.5% for my book, and most of that covers printing the book. And that info is available publicly on the website (its based on the size of the book and how much you charge, but you can enter in the numbers on the public site and get the numbers for any book of theirs). So yes, Steam shouldn't get 30% in comparison as my publisher is really doing work by printing up the book as ordered for their 27.5%, which is way more work that Steam just listing it for sale and storing the info anywhere (which is also the same work my publisher has to do too).
     
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  16. TheoAllen

    TheoAllen Self-proclaimed jack of all trades Veteran

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    If your game is made in RPG Maker, it's considered as "Low-Effort", yes, we all are affected. We all know the stigma around it.
     
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  17. Aoi Ninami

    Aoi Ninami Veteran Veteran

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    And here I thought it was just an RPG trope.
     
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  18. Prescott

    Prescott argggghhh Veteran

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    Okay this is kind of getting derailed but you gotta' remember that Steam does pay to keep their servers up, which I would imagine is not a small amount.

    You actually need to pay Steam $100 to get your game on there, so you'd better hope you can make that money back if you're trying to put it there yourself (I'll be getting everyone on my team to help pitch in thankfully). Itch.io is THE PLACE for indie games so you can definitely throw it up there (which is free) and get most if not all of your money whenever someone buys it. Degica doesn't directly do any sort of advertising or anything like that, so you'd just have to hope people were searching around on Steam and happened upon it. If you really want to get your game out there, put it on Itch.io and rpgmaker.net (where you can link to your itch.io page if you're selling it).
    If you are deadset on going for Steam though, and don't care about making too much money worst case, Degica is certainly a good bet. I don't know if they would let you publish on itch.io though, so you gotta' weight that out for yourself.
     
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  19. MushroomCake28

    MushroomCake28 KAMO Studio Veteran

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    So is there no one who published with Degica yet? (and who's still active on this forum). All we had is discussions about speculative contract terms and commission mostly, but no case of someone actually publishing with them.
     
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  20. Andar

    Andar Veteran Veteran

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    @MushroomCake28
    the problem you're always forgetting is that this is an official forum under corporate law, and that all people who distribute through Degica have contractual agreements not to make certain things public for a lot of reasons (none of which bad).

    If you go to steam and filter for publisher Degica, you'll see a lot of games published through them.
    And if you checked the original topic about shop submissions you would have learned that Degica has a quality control BEFORE they talk about contracts.

    Yes, that does mean that not everybody can get published by them - which is good because it means that buyers can expect at least some quality on any game sold by them. Because that is the problem with "free" sites like itch.io where anyone can put up even low quality wannabe games.
    If you have something decent finished then there is no problem asking them, if they're interested you'll get their terms before any commitment.
     
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