Quicker (auto)save times to prevent exploit

[bishiba]

Hey!

I am curious about what can be done to improve save times. My game autosaves every time the player enters a new region and that works good. However, it is taking a bit of time, probably due to the scope of the game. Even though I am fine with it there is another thing I would like to do with the autosave, I would like the game to autosave every time the player gains an item. This is due to a highly randomized loot system that I would like not to be exploited. So is there any way to optimize the way saving works.

If I knew how the saving worked in the game I could fix it. But I was thinking that it might be possible to trigger separate saves, say you open a chest. Then the game just saves the fact that the chest was opened and the new item gained but not anything else. Is this something that could be doable without too much messing around?

If this doesn't work a player could technically go and open the same gold chest over and over until they got the best item which in my opinion ruins the experience I am going for.

I thought about seeding the game but that seems like it might be a lot of work and before delving into such a thing I would like to know if there is any way to save specific changes or if it's bound to save everything in the game every time it saves?

Best regards,
Bishiba

 

[Cormorant42]

What you're looking for is a "Global variables / switches" plugin that makes it so some variables and switches retain their set value regardless of save files. That way, chests that use global switches to determine whether or not they are open will *always* be open, even if the player reloads a save file.

 

[ShadowDragon]

there are some autosave plugin with a plugin/scriptcall to call teh autosave feature.
which you can place under the event of the chest, when the chest is looted, it autosaves
it so it cant be looted again.

here is 1 simple autosave feature
which use plugin command: SaveGame

there are ups and downs if you do so though. so use it wisely.

 

[bishiba]

there are some autosave plugin with a plugin/scriptcall to call teh autosave feature.
which you can place under the event of the chest, when the chest is looted, it autosaves
it so it cant be looted again.

here is 1 simple autosave feature
which use plugin command: SaveGame

there are ups and downs if you do so though. so use it wisely.

Isn't this just an autosave feature? I made an autosave already, what I need is something that makes it faster or just saves the state of an event and/or the new item gained by the player.

Does this plugin do that?

Best,
Bishiba

 

[bishiba]

What you're looking for is a "Global variables / switches" plugin that makes it so some variables and switches retain their set value regardless of save files. That way, chests that use global switches to determine whether or not they are open will *always* be open, even if the player reloads a save file.

Hi, this does sound very accurate to what could work if it made the save faster. I'd like it to save about as fast as say a modern game. But as it's not really possible with the engine, I just want to prevent an exploit that is so easy to accomplish.

I feel that it would be a good "punishment" to the player that purposely tries to trick the game by trying to reopen the same chest over and over again. However it's a worse punishment for a player who just got a great item, gets a blue screen of death, starts it up again just to see an open chest and to have lost the item.

But do you know of anything that could accomplish this? And if so, would it work with item saving as well?

Best regards,

 

[Shaz]

A global variables plugin wouldn't do this. That means if you have two people playing on the same computer but using different save files, if the first person opened a chest in their game, the second person wouldn't be able to open that chest at all!

I guess you could rig a system that would have a save file for all the major stuff, but then create a corresponding save file for just the items, or just the switches / self switches without all the extra data (probably from plugins) that is bulking up your save file size and time.

However, why stop the player from doing that if that's what they want to do? If they want to spend half an hour replaying the same section just to get a better item, I say let them. If they really want that in order to enjoy the game and you prevent them, are you making the game less enjoyable for them?

 

[bishiba]

A global variables plugin wouldn't do this. That means if you have two people playing on the same computer but using different save files, if the first person opened a chest in their game, the second person wouldn't be able to open that chest at all!

I guess you could rig a system that would have a save file for all the major stuff, but then create a corresponding save file for just the items, or just the switches / self switches without all the extra data (probably from plugins) that is bulking up your save file size and time.

However, why stop the player from doing that if that's what they want to do? If they want to spend half an hour replaying the same section just to get a better item, I say let them. If they really want that in order to enjoy the game and you prevent them, are you making the game less enjoyable for them?

Hey Shaz.

Yes that issue did occur for me as well, but I was wondering if he knew of a way to do it and if so I could read the plugin to find out if it was a feature already that connected this universal save to a specific save file as well, similar to what you suggest in the second paragraph. Edit: I might treat the game more like rogue-like regardless. In which case I would only allow for one save file. A new game would result in clearing this universal event save.

Concerning your third paragraph, it is the last option. Considering Game theory people will almost always use a dominant strategy. I have found that when I did this in my younger days, and conversing with others who did they same. We wouldn't always do it. just when we had to.

This did unfortunately ruin the experience for us even though we chose to do it. Some say it even caused them to feel the game was broken due to them being too powerful, not truly considering they did it to themselves due to being rather young. Others that it took them out of the world and that they felt it ruined the experience of the game.

I personally experienced the latter. Just a few days ago I did it a game, I lost a battle due to messing up a mechanic. I then closed the applications and restarted it which placed me just before the encounter started. But this game was a roguelike and the mistakes are supposed to make you grow. After winning the battle on the second attempt I promptly restarted the game and pressed "new game" since I felt I cheated.

So I guess the feature is to protect the gamer from this situation where they make the game simpler without thinking about the implications down the line. So I would love to prevent this to a large degree.



TLR.
Regarding your suggestion, do you have an idea of how this could be done?

Best regards,
Bishiba

 

[ShadowDragon]

why not just the scriptcall or plugin command to save the game, its way easier while
its saves on the same slot the player access it. so they cant cheat at all.
(unless they re-start a new game over and over),

but what shaz says, if they spend 30-90 min to get the best item, its their waste of time.
I just play the game without restart for the game.

another way if you dont want them to cheat, make save points, if they spend 20min
to reach the next one, they need to do all those things again.

but that is up to you though =)

 

[Cormorant42]

A global variables plugin wouldn't do this. That means if you have two people playing on the same computer but using different save files, if the first person opened a chest in their game, the second person wouldn't be able to open that chest at all!

It would work if the global variable was an array of all save files that had opened the chest, that way when a new save file opens it it just gets added to the array and that save file can no longer open it. Wham bam alacazam, problem solved.

 

[Tsukihime]

You probably can look into the way your savefiles work.
By default it dumps ALL data, so if you have huge amounts of data to dump, that can quickly add up. Imagine if you had a database of 2 million items, and everytime you changed one item, you decided to re-save all 2 million items. Doesn't make sense right?

Instead, if you had a way to split up a save file into different parts (eg: inventory data, actor data, map data, etc), then you choose to which data you want to save instead of having to a "full save".

However I think this is mostly a design issue.

This is due to a highly randomized loot system that I would like not to be exploited

If you can just design it so that it doesn't matter if they save scum or not, then that should address the problem.