Replacement for MAT & MDF

Discussion in 'Game Mechanics Design' started by MRD256, Aug 11, 2019.

  1. MRD256

    MRD256 Veteran Veteran

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    I'm trying to make a realistic-style game without Magic (in RPG Maker MV)

    I was wondering if anyone had any ideas on what I could replace MAT & MDF with (in other words, what to rename them to and what else to use them for).

    I wanted to try an omit them from the project, but it's hard since I'm using Yanfly's Victory Aftermath plugin and I can't remove it from displaying without it looking buggy, same thing with the status screen and everything else.

    So again, anyone have any ideas on what to replace them with?
     
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  2. Mystic_Enigma

    Mystic_Enigma Feeling Mousey Veteran

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    That kind of depends on the setting/theme of your game. To use myself as an example, i've also made it so magic pretty much is non-existent, so i've decided that MAT is "Focus" and MDF is "Will"

    Other examples could be Intellect and Wit respectively, or Channeling and Buffering, Psynergy and Warding Power...
     
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  3. MRD256

    MRD256 Veteran Veteran

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    It's a sort of Post Apocalyptic setting. I like your idea of Focus and Will, though I'm not sure how I would use them in say, Formulas.
     
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  4. TheoAllen

    TheoAllen Self-proclaimed jack of all trades Veteran

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    Maybe you should design what kind of game you want to make first instead of focusing on how to replace the stat. And the question for Yanfly Victory Aftermath and the other thing, that belongs to support forum. I believe people will help you.

    RPG Maker has 6 stats at your disposal. By default, they are ATK, DEF, MAT, MDF, AGI, and LUK. These are just a label, with the first 4 is absolutely useless unless you use them somewhere. And it is not necessary to use them all for the sake of using them.

    For example, here is in my game. I use TP mechanic and so MP is completely useless. And I use Free turn battle so AGI is completely useless. I use default ATK and DEF. I repurpose MP as an Armor HP, and MAT as armor damage (the stat to damage armor). I completely kick MDF, AGI, and LUK because they have no place in my game. If you're curious how I do it in my game, well here ...
    Screenshot_1204.jpg
    Note that for my design purpose, DEF has a constant value, so if the character has DEF 10 then for the entire of the game, they will have DEF 10, hence why.
     
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  5. Doktor_Q

    Doktor_Q I'm not a real doktor, but I am a real Q Veteran

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    It's pretty easy to make use of a generalized "Intelligence" trait, so you could have it control how effective your healing is, or maybe your tools or non-weapon items.

    You could also separate "physical melee attack (strength, etc)" from "ranged firearm attack (dexterity, aim, etc)."
     
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  6. MRD256

    MRD256 Veteran Veteran

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    hmmm, that's an idea. In the game, I only have 4 party members and 2 of them strictly use Ranged attacks (one uses a Bow, the other uses Guns).

    As for Theo, I know what kind of game I want to do, and I wasn't asking how to make Yanfly's script work how I want, I was just stating my problem.

    I like these ideas. I think I'll consider them. MAT can be how strong they are with ranged attacks and MDF... I'm still not sure...
     
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  7. Aesica

    Aesica undefined Veteran

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    This is exactly what I was going to suggest. It does make sense that a different set of skills are needed for ranged vs melee attacks. In an upcoming sci-fi game (what I'm making after my current project) there won't be any magic either, and I plan on repurposing MAT as the ranged weapon attack skill and MDF as resistance to energy-based attacks (lasers, radiation, etc) Also, I like to uncouple LUK from status ailments and other things and repurpose that into the healing stat (affects both incoming and outgoing heal strength)
     
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  8. empresskiova

    empresskiova Untitled Project1 Veteran

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    I used Charisma and Intelligence for MDF and MAT, respectively.

    But, I’ve got a use for both.
    Charisma is good for standard chatting, influences prices for services, influences the Intimidate and Bribery skills, and affects the amount of damage Cigarettes do to you (which in turn generate a bunch of TP).

    Intelligence mostly affects repairing firearms and crafting recipes (there’s very few in the game... things like Molotovs and Supressors made from Oil Filters). It also has an impact in a few battles (my battles are all gonna be one-time onlies), such as a turret becoming damaged enough for it’s wiring to become exposed. You can hotwire the wires to your Lasergun (which is normally battery powered) to recharge it. But you take a bit of HP damage, but less so if you have a bunch of intelligence.
     
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  9. TheoAllen

    TheoAllen Self-proclaimed jack of all trades Veteran

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    What I see is you want to omit them but you can't because you have no idea how, so you're forced to use them.

    But if you still want an additional stat for that reason and you want the realism:
    Perception/Accuracy = counter to Agility. For this purpose, agility contributes to armor rating or whatever that reduce the damage, and the one to counter them is the perception/accuracy stat.
    Charisma = The non-battle purpose. Affect the persuasion success rate, if you're building an RPG for this.

    I don't exactly agree with ranged/melee concept in turn-based battle. When there is a little to none to distinguish between the two in the concept of turn-based battle. But if you're using grid battle system (or anything to represent range) so that you can move into the melee or ranged attack range, that serves it purpose. If not, they're just an extra mini-management, at least that is my opinion.
     
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  10. MRD256

    MRD256 Veteran Veteran

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    I think I'm good on omitting them now, I don't need to. I like @Aesica 's idea. Where MAT can be R.ATK (Ranged Attack) and regular ATK will be changed to P.ATK (Physical ATK), and MDF will be come E.DEF (Energy Defense) against lasers, radiation, etc. and normal DEF will become P.DEF (Physical Defense). I like all these.

    Thanks for your help guys.

    Personally, I see the LUK stat as useless, if anyone has a way to re-purpose it to something better, I'm all ears.
     
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  11. gstv87

    gstv87 Veteran Veteran

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    you can edit the naming, the values, and the core calculation itself, to various degrees of complexity.
    so, it's really a matter of whether they're relevant or not for you, and what you want to make them.
    they can be whatever you want them/they need to be.
     
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  12. Restart

    Restart Veteran Veteran

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    If it's post-apocalyptic, elevating a setting detail to having a full core stat would help emphasize how important that trait is is.

    For instance, if you want players to know that the post-apocalyptic wasteland is highly radioactive, having your character's radiation resistance be a stat that keeps popping up will keep that fresh in their minds.

    Or if it's super cyberpunk, make it the 'hacking' stat, and players will know being a good hacker is just as important as being able to punch good

    Or make it a 'toxin' stat which reduces your maximum hp, and have characters get weaker the more of the polluted postapocalyptic wasteland they get exposed to...
     
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  13. Aesica

    Aesica undefined Veteran

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    I think LUK might be the most repurposed stat. As I mentioned above, I turned it into the healing stat, called Spirit (SPR). Specifically, healing skills used by a player with high SPR heal for more, and if the target also has a high SPR rating, they'll gain more. The typical formula for most of my healing skills is something like this:

    (a.luk * 0.7 + b.luk * 0.3) * skillModifier + flatBonusIfAny

    In my sci-fi game, I'll probably use it the exact same way, but instead of calling it spirit, maybe I'll call it something like Recovery.

    The only thing about LUK is that you'll need to go out of your way to decouple it from states and whatever other nonsense it does (I forget). Thankfully, one of Yanfly's plugins will let you edit the LUK formula to remove it from that role.
     
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  14. Wavelength

    Wavelength Pre-Merge Boot Moderator

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    I'm pretty much with @TheoAllen here. The first question you need to figure out, before you figure out what to repurpose (or rename) MAT and MDF as, is why you want two separate attack stats and two separate defense stats in the first place.

    There are certainly valid reasons for doing this (for example where the battle design needs it to be viable to split the party's target priortization, or where the player can clearly discern, and strongly react to, the type of damage coming in). But in 90% of games, it's really not necessary, and all it does is add extra complexity to the mix, make it harder to balance stats, and obscure why a character is taking a certain amount of damage.

    So with that said, if you can't articulate a reason why you want two attack stats and two defense stats, then my suggestion would be to simply drop the MAT/MDF stats (don't use them anywhere, and remove them from your menus - it's not hard), and enjoy the fact that your simpler, cleaner stat system now lines up with your game's theme where all damage is physical in some sense anyway. Or, if you have a reason why you want two attack stats and two defense stats, let us know what that reasoning is and I can give you more specific advice on how you might tailor these stats to your game.
     
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  15. Black Pagan

    Black Pagan Veteran Veteran

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    In my Game, its the same, I don't use MATK or MDEF.

    -> MDEF = "RES" (Resistance Stat).
    This gives the Player resistance towards State Afflictions. I prefer to use this as a Rare Stat on some Unique Gear.
    Example : +5 RES (5 RES is 25% Chance to Resist States Afflictions)

    -> MATK = "PWR" (Power)
    This is basically a Damage Add-On for your Attack from Damaging Skills and Normal Attacks. I prefer to use this as a Rare Stat on some Hard-to-obtain Gear.
    Example : +150 PWR (Skill Damage Formula : PWR + a.atk * 4 - b.def * 2, Meaning your Skills now deals Bonus 150 Damage )

    Honestly, You can use these 2 Stats However you wish, Just make sure to let the Player know what they mean in the beginning of the Game.
     
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  16. jonthefox

    jonthefox Veteran Veteran

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    Idea #1: you can use "magic" stats for "ranged" attack and defense. Warrior/Knight classes would have low ranged defense since they are scrappy melee fighters that are too busy in the thick of it to notice arrows coming at them from far away. Archer/Ranger/Hunter classes would obviously be good at ranged attack. Rogues would have high ranged defense since stay hidden from sight until they have an opportunity to strike a vulnerable target.

    Idea #2: You can separate attacks and damage into strength-based, dexterity-based, etc.
     
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