Resources for Commercial Projects

[Sketcy-Sketch]

Hello everyone! Thanks for your time.

I just was curious about something that has greatly dealt a blow in the release date of my game project and game demo, which had been set to be released last spring, 2013. It has to do with commercial games, resources, and the terms of use that people on forums are required to know and acknowledge prior to download.

My long, semi-unneeded anecdote put inside a quote box:

I started creating my game in VX four years ago around Dec / Jan 2010.  I was always careful to read the terms of use. I had a huge folder of resources (because I needed a lot for my parallax maps) arranged by website and by the names of each creator so that I didn't get confused as to who I needed to credit and from where.  I was just about to create a game topic and release the demo when I suddenly came across some of the resources I had used in the game--only the terms of use had changed so that they could not be used for commercial games anymore.  Some of the graphics I had downloaded no longer existed. And others said that they could be used in a commercial game so long as you paid them. The creators made the graphics, so I knew that this wasn't an unreasonable thing for them to ask.  But I didn't know which ones I could use or not use anymore, and some of the resources were so integrated into the mapping that it was hard to find each individual one and pull it out. I became paranoid that I was going to accidentally use a resource that I no longer had the rights to use.  So, I stopped game production and, after a few months, made the excruciatingly painful decision to *clutches heart painfully* scrap my parallax maps all together.   (...I guess what doesn't kill your project is supposed to make it stronger...Maybe...) 

 ​

"Goodnight, sweet Prince! Maps!" --Shakespeare​

(onion-induced tears)​

Silliness aside, now I'm trying to find people to make exclusive graphics for my project so as to be sure that there is no confusion about the terms of use--now or in the future.  It's rather expensive, and now I'm not sure when I will have a demo available because I'm not as well funded or equipped as I once was. I still plan to post the project topic in the next month or so, though.

I'm not mad, mind you. So please don't think I am. I think that this will make my game possibly look even better.  But I have to say that it makes me a little scared to use publicly offered resources such as scripts, tiles, etc, from forums.  How does one making a commercial game protect themselves from terms of service changing somewhere down the road?  I guess making completely exclusive, original graphics is the only way?

Just wanted to hear from other commercial game developers on the matter.  Have you crossed problems like this in your development?  Any suggestions?  Thanks for your time. I greatly appreciate it. :

 

[Shaz]

That's a horrible thing to have happen - especially since you're parallaxing and it's not just a matter of replacing some things in some tilesets, which would be annoying, but not difficult. I dread reading one day that we're no longer allowed to use Mack's resources for commercial games.


I think you're on the right track though - you know you can use anything in the RTP or its edits. You can also use anything that you purchase from the store, or that's released in Member+. Some of the ReStaff resources can be used commercially. Other than that, the only way you're guaranteed of being able to use it commercially is to pay for someone to make it.


Maybe you could contact some of these people and see if they can relax their terms in your case, since you started making the game when their resources WERE allowed for commercial use.

 

[amerk]

By reading the terms of each and every resource you use. Everything sold in the store can be used in commercial games for RM, as long as you provide credit. Everything else, you need to follow the terms. If they say no commercial, that means no commercial. If they request payment, then you need to contact them and arrange for it before you sell the game. Best to contact them ahead of time to see if you can pay it or not, in case you need to go with other resources.

If they have no terms, then you need to contact them and find out. If you can't get ahold of them, or you are not sure who to contact, best to look elsewhere until you can find out who they are and get ahold of them.

 

[Loke]

If you're having trouble finding people to make resources for your game for cheap, I might be able to help out. I can do many things, but I believe I excel at character graphics (such as busts) if that's of any use to you. I can also do various kinds of other things, but I won't bore you with the details. You can just PM me if you need anything, or want to know more

 

[Shaz]

but amerk, she's saying when she obtained the resources, they WERE allowed for commercial use. The terms of use changed during development of the game.

 

[Sketcy-Sketch]

I dread reading one day that we're no longer allowed to use Mack's resources for commercial games.

That would be horrible! D:

As for the store, I have been looking through there and thinking of purchasing some. They really are great! And, in many ways, much easier than hiring someone to make each individual tile. That way I can save for the bigger, area-specific tiles. I have also tried fiddling around with making my own RTP edits before, but I think I need more practice.

  I did forget about member+. I think they were talking about setting it up back when I was part of the resource staff. I might check that out as well. ^^

@ Loke: Thanks so much.

Luckily, my portraits were all custom, so I can still use the ones I had.  I'm hoping to still make a game project topic sometime in the next couple of months, but it may not have very many mapping examples. Still excited, though.

 

[amerk]

but amerk, she's saying when she obtained the resources, they WERE allowed for commercial use. The terms of use changed during development of the game.

Got it. My brain didn't register it the first time around. Yeah, that sucks. I've wondered about that myself, what happens when terms change down the road. I guess it's up the primary owner, and each one may act differently.

I've had similar experiences with resources for non-commercial projects, where the original owner changed the terms so there was a limit of what can be used at any given time. I simply contacted them, and they were okay if I received the resources before the term changes to use as many of the resources at once without heed to limits. Contacting them is really the only option (as Shaz suggested). Unless there was a sort of contract given based on the original terms (whether money paid or some other agreement), they are allowed to change their terms at any given time.

So contact them and find out. Maybe they'll say yes, maybe no, but it's better than just ignoring it and facing harder consequences later on, and even an unfavorable response will set you on a more clear path of what you will need to do.

 

[Sketcy-Sketch]

I'll try and contact as many as I can.  Thanks so much everyone for your input! I really appreciate the help.

 

[Lunarea]

If the terms allowed commercial use and you contacted the authors and obtained their permission (i.e. have it in writing), I'm fairly certain you can use them commercially regardless of what the current TOS is. Your agreement was for the TOS as they were when you obtained the resources. I don't think it's possible to make terms of service apply in retrograde.

If you don't have the author's permission, then you definitely want to contact them and explain your case. A lot of people aren't ok with masses of users making profit from their work, but they're okay with letting a few people have a special license (it helps when the project is awesome).

I second checking out our store. The resource packs are pretty cheap, but they're high quality and buying them supports our community artists and musicians.

 

[Napoleon]

The reason why I have a special credits section in my possible commercial project(s) that also list where I got the credits from as well as their license. Example:

- Eve sprite (CC3-SA)  [www.sample.com] [screenshot01.png]

- other stuff here.

Note that some licenses may be changed but their changes may not apply to you (depends per license), If you got... let's say my busts script (CC3 license) and I would change the license to "all rights reserved" or "free for non commercial only" just before you release the project then the CC still applies to you and you can still use (and even redistribute!) it freely. At least for that specific version that is.

But it's best to take a screenshot of the website with the terms and date to proof that you can use it for free.

This is also one of the reasons why proper licenses are important. Just stating "free for commercial use" can still be changed I believe. So be careful with those. They may even be changed AFTER you released your game forcing you to update your released game. But I'm not sure about this. Probably depends per country (and license, some licenses state explicitly that the terms can be changed at any time and etc.).

In worst case you have to hire an artist to remake the resources you can no longer trace back in a different style (without directly copying it).

 

[Lunarea]

Just a screenshot isn't enough proof, though. It's pretty easy to doctor a screenshot. You really want to contact the author directly and have their permission in writing.

 

[Sketcy-Sketch]

@ Napoleon:  I was thinking of something similar to a screenshot as well, but I think Luna is right. It's probably best to always speak with the artist directly over terms. That way there is no confusion between the artist and game maker, and no conflict later on.

I probably should have just done this from the start.  Oh well, live and learn.    I have been thinking about hiring artists to help recreate similar resources for the ones I can no longer use.  I think that having more original and exclusive resources will make the game project more unique anyway, but the resource store on the site is going to be very helpful as well. ^^

 

[Napoleon]

Lunarea is right, that is the best way. But... Some people might not bother handing something like that to you. At least I probably wouldn't (just being honest). I'd just refer you to my current license. But asking won't hurt .

 

[Zalerinian]

if you need to find the terms of a resource who's website no longer exists, try checking the link on the Wayback Machine. That thing is amazing, it has webpages and sometimes entire websites cached, all saved in snapshots of the past. If it no longer exists but there it s snapshot in the Wayback Machine, you can still view it as it was in the snapshot.

It even caches files you can download, it's pretty amazing, try using that for the websites you mentioned. You can even list the wayback machine as proof of the terms, since it'll be keeping that copy of the site for all of eternity. Though I would keep a copy just in case

 

[Leonardo Myst]

Thanks for sharing, Sketchy-Sketch.

After reading your experience, I've concreted my decision to only use commercial-friendly resources (ie: the RTP, purchased resources and stuff I create personally) in everything I do.

I'm afraid that I'll create a game that after I get 3/4 done with it, I'll think would be good enough to convert to a commercial project and would have to start all over again.

I think it's probably for the best, for myself anyway, to stick with them just to be safe.

The only downside is that it'll take a bit longer to create some of the resources for myself, but in the end I think it would be worth it.

 

[Mouser]

Email and snail mail are your friends.

You verify that the copy of the assets you acquire are licensed for commercial use - or that you've worked out a license with the creator.

If the license changes after that - you still have your permissions and the 'paper trail' to prove it.

Incidentally: if something doesn't come with a license of some sort, legally you can't use it at all (unless it's demonstrably in the public domain: stuff created before 1923 or with a written 'release') - whether for a free project or a commercial one because copyright prevents you from legally obtaining a copy in the first place.