Revisiting a Town

[Matseb2611]

This is something I got thinking about today and I am not sure if this topic has been done before, but here goes.

When playing an RPG and you have to return to/revisit a town that you've been in already earlier in the game, how much of it do you prefer would change by the time you've revisited it? Do you like it when a lot of changes happen in that same town, perhaps only a few important ones, or maybe you don't care and just prefer for everything to remain the same? For example would you prefer the same NPCs to walk the streets or is it much better to have entirely new NPCs the second time round or the same ones but in the different spots this time and saying different things? What about gaining access to a different part of town the second time round? What did you do in your game(s)?

 

[Alkorri]

I can only talk from a gamer's perspective. I like seeing new (brief!) cutscenes, or new characters walking around or to talk to, each time I enter the town or achieve a milestone. Homework Salesman did this very well I thought.

But I personally think you don't need to go all out. Just a few touches - new flowers planted, someone moved a bench, a new person at a fountain to talk to - just the little things to give illusion of a dynamic world, you know? Players would be encouraged to explore your lovingly crafted maps.

The bad side is if you have these changes, expectations of the game developer become higher and players would expect quality and want to have these things all the way throughout the game. Coz we be greedy bastards that way

I personally love the idea of new areas opening up.

 

[Scythuz]

Voted for option 2, unless a story specific event happens the only things that should change are minor things like dialogue and npc locations.

It should feel like the same town after all.

 

[Dalph]

Unless you want that time progresses for your characters and stops for all the other people in that town (but that's silly at best if there isn't a good reason for doing that), you have always to change something, also to give the time illusion to the player.

 

[gcook725]

I like to see every character say something new. My favorite example for this was in Grandia 3. Sure the game's story kinda reeked and were filled with all kinds of plot holes, but the NPCs were very well written and in one major town you visited a lot they would always have something new to say. Might not be relevant to your story, but it is to theirs. Often the NPC would have its own little story that unfolded over the course of the game, and if I remember right at least one gave you a side quest if you kept talking to them over the course of the game.

 

[cabfe]

NPCs texts changing is the best thing in my opinion.

Unless there has been a very long time between visits, towns don't change that much.

And I doubt people (the players) will notice that a bench was added or a plant withered. Not worth that effort.

 

[Kes]

if something significant has happened, or a considerable time is supposed to have elapsed, I would expect NPC dialogues to change and reflect that fact.  Maybe because of events elsewhere new side quests become available.  However, I agree with cabfe, a relocated bench or a change of flowers is not worth the effort.

 

[Zoltor]

Only certain key aspects. The good thing about revisiting a town, is knowing we have been there already, but if everything is changed, It's like a totally different town, just sharing the old town's name.

 

[Bluetoes]

Im planning on having both major and minor changes to some towns in my game. Minor changes are new dialogue options and npc interaction. A number of towns will get partially destroyed due to plot points and you can still visit these destroyed areas. However, post-game you will be able to help rebuild towns by donating money and helping out, allowing you to see the town rebuild a little more each time. This means there are 3 versions of those towns, with the last version continuing to rebuild. 

Major changes are usually in relation to the story, while minor changes help show how time progresses.

 

[Matseb2611]

Thank you all for your answers. I kind of half-expected most of the things mentioned here, but it was still interesting to get all the different views on this. It seems most of us want to see some sort of change upon revisiting a town though not too grand a change (unless it's related to the story).

That's also a good point there, Alkorri, about making sure to apply the change uniformly in every revisited town and not just 1-2.

How often do people revisit older towns? For example if during the game you found out that a new sidequest has become available in one of the previous towns, would you go back to that town to do the sidequest?   

 

[Scythuz]

How often do people revisit older towns? For example if during the game you found out that a new sidequest has become available in one of the previous towns, would you go back to that town to do the sidequest?   

Probably yeah, if I found out that there was a new side-quest available in a town I'd already been to then I would probably go back there to do it.

 

[Candacis]

I love to see changes made in towns, when I revisit them. It not only gives a sense of time progression, but also helps to immerse the player in the world. NPCs saying something different and other little changes can help a lot to create the feeling that the world "lives". This is especially important, if the player did some quests in the town, maybe helped NPCs (or chose not to help them). Now on return the player can see what consequenzes his actions had. This is great to give the player a sense of accomplishment.

Making previous unreachable areas in town become reachable with progression in the main story is also a good way to get the player to even return to a town. The game Ni No Kuni did a great job with that. There were some chests in town that you could only open with a better magical wand. So if you tried to open them, the game told you that your lock spell wasn't powerful enough and you just knew, as soon, as you got that upgrade, now I can return and open the chests. Zelda Games have done that, too, with the new tools you get as you progress, that gives you the ability to reach certain areas, like the hookshot etc.

However I wouldn't go overboard with the changes, because this tends to get chaotic real fast for players who want to discover everything. If something big (and new) happens in a town, your player should be somehow notified about it (maybe with a letter or a traveling NPC). Revisiting towns is also a loooot more convenient, if your game has some sort of fast transportation/teleportation system.

 

[Engr. Adiktuzmiko]

I voted for the last option. To me it really depends on the game. Especially on events that happened after I left the town. Like if after I leave, I then received a news that a monster have been rampaging around the area, I expect the town to be a bit in a turmoil

 

[mlogan]

To me it should be mostly plot or sidequest driven. As Shana said, if you are revisiting a town because a monster reappeared, you wouldn't expect an NPC to still be saying "lovely weather we're having", but "did you see the monster?!?"


Also, as far as changing things like flowers and benches, I think that could get tricky because you would need to explain why. Say you were there in the winter and came back in the spring, new flowers would make sense. But to just show and there's new flowers there - either the player won't notice or will think you made a mapping mistake. So imo, you would need to have an NPC standing there saying something like, "Aren't my new flowers lovely?" or whatever.


To sum up my opinion, change is not bad, if there is a purpose for it.

 

[Engr. Adiktuzmiko]

One thing I don't like is when I go back, the item shops suddenly sell more or better items, when there isn't really any economic change to the town. It simply doesn't make sense

 

[CWells]

When playing an RPG and you have to return to/revisit a town that you've been in already earlier in the game, how much of it do you prefer would change by the time you've revisited it?

That depends on what happens in the story for me. If nothing in the story suggests anything happening to well known members of a town, or some environmental change because of drastic events, then I don't mind either way if things change or not.

Do you like it when a lot of changes happen in that same town, perhaps only a few important ones, o

r maybe you don't care and just prefer for everything to remain the same?

I love it when things change a lot in towns. It makes me feel like something is happening in that place. That there might be some opportunity to discover new things about my characters or the characters in the town or maybe even snatch up secret skills/gear from hanging out and "living" in the area for a bit like some sort of confused tourist bedazzled by Manhattan skyscrapers.

 

[Julien Brightside]

In the game I am working on, the main character start off with a tent, and as the party recruit people the tent is upgraded to an inn, and from there to a castle.

It is always fun to see NPCs in the various towns have something interesting to say if there's a long time between the visit.

 

[Silver Bullet]

    Well, this is an RPG style town we're talking about, so obviously, it's very small. People would notice that you were gone. There are probably only like, ten places to work anyway, so when your boss or your friend sends the police to your house to look for you, and they don't find anyone, they'll assume that you were kidnapped or something. When somebody sees you walking through the gate a month later, you'll probably get a surprised reaction. Things would definitely change.

 

[arekpowalan]

Choice 2. I do like some dialogues changes or extra events added to make the towns dynamic as you proceed though the game, though overdoing it or forcing the player to revisit towns after every major event to get every knick-knack and secret are not really a good idea.

 

[GammaVector]

Assuming the same number of hours of gameplay...In a game with fewer towns, I would want more to change between visits than in a game with more towns. More towns = I'm not going to be as interested in them, nor I'm a going to revisit them as much. If you've only got three towns, those three towns should be very dynamic and interesting. If you've got sixteen, you can afford to be a little lazy with them.