Selling out your own kind

[Tai_MT]

I have a silly question...  How could you be making broad generalizations about all Indie Devs and about all Steam Games...  And then claim you're talking about only a single Indie Developer?

Seriously, I'm confused.  Someone explain that to me.

 

[Euphoria]

I will of course try and respond to all of you but first this guy.

You didn't read my point on this it seems. I said day 1 DLC! Or on disc DLC, you can go back and read it, it's there trust me And if you spend 4 months on it well you just proved my point cause its not what I am talking about at all, I would actually say that was more of a expansion? But after 4 moths I don't care as long as the core game worked.

But if those 4 months were before the release of his game, then he's the devil? Right? Am I learning correctly?

 

[Diretooth]

Perhaps we should spend our time brainstorming ideas in regards to better making games for gamers?

 

[Shelby]

I have a silly question...  How could you be making broad generalizations about all Indie Devs and about all Steam Games...  And then claim you're talking about only a single Indie Developer?

Seriously, I'm confused.  Someone explain that to me.

Never said ALL devs or all Steam game, then again with Steam you never know because they don't check their games, so YOU don't know either lol.

 

[Shelby]

Perhaps we should spend our time brainstorming ideas in regards to better making games for gamers?

A beautiful idea   So let's just move aside all those bad practices and get back to games for GAMERS!

 

[Euphoria]

Never said ALL devs or all Steam game, then again with Steam you never know because they don't check their games, so YOU don't know either lol.

DO RESEARCH ON A PRODUCT BEFORE YOU BUY IT - it's in caps I hope you understand it this time around. 

Do you go to the store with a blindfold on and just grab at random ****? No. You look at the product, examine it, and find out information on it. What makes games any different?

 

[Nathanial]

Never said ALL devs or all Steam game, then again with Steam you never know because they don't check their games, so YOU don't know either lol.

But not to be redundant, but you never really gave me any sort of retort here...

Why should it be Valve's job, as a distributor, to QA other companies titles? That's not their job. It's the developers. If the developer is lazy and releases a broken game and they don't fix it... Valve will intervene (hi WarZ). But they don't have the resources to QA every single title (of the thousands released on Steam). If a company wants outsourced QA, there's companies for that. One of my best friends (and pretty active member here on the forums) works for one. 

 

[Bloodmorphed]

So if I turn around and reinvest $6,000 into my title and spend 4 more months of work on it, I shouldn't see anything else for it? Because people already paid for my base game, a separate product?

I'm all for free DLC for the smaller things where it wasn't so much a financial drain, as it was just a matter of "I needed to get the game out and didn't have the time to do this, so here you go guys!" 

But if it's a matter of risk (due to time AND money) then yeah.. I see it as a separate product, I took the risks and quarter of the year to do it...  and I should be compensated for it.

Are you resorting to calling me a hipster because I have more business sense in this industry than you, some ideologist gamer?

Yeah broken games suck. Avoid those companies. They're a plague. But not all of them are scummy. And Valve shouldn't have to baby each company releasing a title.

Sorry let me make myself more clear.

1. If you already were planning it, it should have been in your base game anyway, budget bothering? Okay, fine. I understand that, however, unless it has a drastic change to the game, for example creating a whole "semi-expansion" for lack of a better term, then yes, charge that by any means, thats a lot of freakin work.

But for a game company to make a weapon, or even a 5 weapon pack, and charge 5 bucks for that? Hell no, that should be free, period.

 

[Tai_MT]

I wish I could quote...  Or link stuff...

Seriously, I'd quote your initial post as rebuttal and then link to you the Day One DLC episode of Extra Credits so you could understand why it exists.

Also...  No, the DLC for Mass Effect 3 was not vital in any way, shape, or form.  I had the content and it really wasn't vital at all to the overall game.  You know what it added?  Minor snippets you could learn about at certain locations.  Most of it was Javek simply telling Shepard and the rest of his crew how utterly stupid and braindead they were.  It was paid content for a character to freely insult everyone in your party and then lament about being "the only one left alive".  I think he had like 7 total lines in which he talked about the Reaper War or previous times and that was it.  Oh, and I guess he had some amusing jokes too.

The Day One DLC was not important in the least for Mass Effect 3.  In fact, after playing through the game while having it (and taking Javek with this worthless powers everywhere to hear his dialogue), I feel like it was maybe just there to add some variety to the game and nothing more.

 

[Diretooth]

I wish I could quote...  Or link stuff...

Seriously, I'd quote your initial post as rebuttal and then link to you the Day One DLC episode of Extra Credits so you could understand why it exists.

Also...  No, the DLC for Mass Effect 3 was not vital in any way, shape, or form.  I had the content and it really wasn't vital at all to the overall game.  You know what it added?  Minor snippets you could learn about at certain locations.  Most of it was Javek simply telling Shepard and the rest of his crew how utterly stupid and braindead they were.  It was paid content for a character to freely insult everyone in your party and then lament about being "the only one left alive".  I think he had like 7 total lines in which he talked about the Reaper War or previous times and that was it.  Oh, and I guess he had some amusing jokes too.

The Day One DLC was not important in the least for Mass Effect 3.  In fact, after playing through the game while having it (and taking Javek with this worthless powers everywhere to hear his dialogue), I feel like it was maybe just there to add some variety to the game and nothing more.

You can quote, it's at the lower right of each idividual post.

 

[Shelby]

But not to be redundant, but you never really gave me any sort of retort here...

Why should it be Valve's job, as a distributor, to QA other companies titles? That's not their job. It's the developers. If the developer is lazy and releases a broken game and they don't fix it... Valve will intervene (hi WarZ). But they don't have the resources to QA every single title (of the thousands released on Steam). If a company wants outsourced QA, there's companies for that. One of my best friends (and pretty active member here on the forums) works for one. 

I am trying to get to everyone I promise

When Valve takes a part of the money they take a part of the responsibility. And what does it say about them if they are taking games from lazy developers? Doesn't the apple store actually check their content being sold?? Hmmm.

And to that other guy, how are you supposed to check out a pre order game...it's not even out! And what little info is from the game company, you really think they gonna tell you their game doesn't even work!? Think on that.

 

[Galenmereth]

Only gamers that pre-order games are to blame for that whole issue. Personally I refuse to preorder games from anyone but a select few franchises from Nintendo (Pokèmon, Smash Bros and Mario Kart). Everything else I don't trust until I've read several reviews by people with different tastes.

On-disc DLC is scum-of-the-earth practice and is 100% thievery if your game is a $60 game. There's no excuse: I won't buy your games. For example, I don't buy or play any EA games. None. Zero. They've fooled me a few too many times, and I go elsewhere for my gaming fix.

Day-one DLC is... Well, it's much more individual in nature.

Vendor specific, exclusive ingame pre-order bonuses are also something I personally hate with a passion. What, do they want me to buy five different versions of the game to get all the hats and wizard robes? No, I say. Shooo. I will not do it. I will buy none of them!

 

[Bloodmorphed]

I am trying to get to everyone I promise

When Valve takes a part of the money they take a part of the responsibility. And what does it say about them if they are taking games from lazy developers? Doesn't the apple store actually check their content being sold?? Hmmm.

And to that other guy, how are you supposed to check out a pre order game...it's not even out! And what little info is from the game company, you really think they gonna tell you their game doesn't even work!? Think on that.

I'm only commenting on the last line. More times then not, especially if it is a big company, you can check out the game WAY before it comes out, beta, etc etc. You don;t need to play it, watch someone else play it.

 

[Nathanial]

I am trying to get to everyone I promise

When Valve takes a part of the money they take a part of the responsibility. And what does it say about them if they are taking games from lazy developers? Doesn't the apple store actually check their content being sold?? Hmmm.

And to that other guy, how are you supposed to check out a pre order game...it's not even out! And what little info is from the game company, you really think they gonna tell you their game doesn't even work!? Think on that.

I'm seeing a lot of game ideology (and in the perfect world, I would agree with you) but nothing that's financially practical from a business stand point. Valve has shown in the past if a developer releases broken titles that leave the players with nothing to play, they'll intervene. Expecting them to test every title? Not practical at all.

 

[Shelby]

I'm only commenting on the last line. More times then not, especially if it is a big company, you can check out the game WAY before it comes out, beta, etc etc. You don;t need to play it, watch someone else play it.

Great point!!! So I will add something to that, betas of course subject to change, but that is not what really is the worst, a gameplay video of ROME 2 showed how smart a enemy general was in battle fighting you, yet how come on releases he can't or won't even engage you?

If your game is coming out for Xbox why is it being shown on PC?? Maybe because you know your game doesn't look so good and you hope the gamers won't notice? Ouch that hurts

 

[Indinera]

BFG wanted (wants) to QA everything and as a result they stopped publishing any RM games (even those which have been sold everywhere else!!)

Sometimes it's better not to be too controlling.

 

[Tai_MT]

Nah, I can't quote.  Function doesn't work on this browser or something.  They updated the forums a while back and it broke pretty much all of the functions in the posting boxes for me.  I suspect that if I switched to Firefox or something the stuff would work.  It just doesn't work, so I don't use it.  When I try to post a link, the box just freezes and doesn't allow me to do anything else on the page.

Nature of the beast.

The more replies I see, the more I think we're simply arguing with a naïve child who really doesn't know anything about the industry at all and can't be bothered to do any research him/herself.  It's kind of a lost cause at this point...  Might be easier to simply lock the topic as it seems more and more likely that the original topic was created just to troll.

 

[Euphoria]

Well this was probably just aimed at causing distress in the forums, so I've made my points/counter arguments/cries for you to have common sense, I'm out. 

and certainly don't want to happen on another post by you. "" at the fact you've caused such a fuss and called out a specific person who probably knows who they are.

 

[Galenmereth]

If your game is coming out for Xbox why is it being shown on PC?? Maybe because you know your game doesn't look so good and you hope the gamers won't notice? Ouch that hurts

Pretty much this is why:

 

[??????]

Ahhh... I knew this topic was going to to be full of heated debate. Personally, I would have closed it instantly just because of the fact its aimed at a specific person. And really, its not hard to work out who you mean.

Again, I think taking up your concerns with the person(s) directly would be a much better approach than wasting time complaining in a thread where no one is able to change that developers decision.