should i change to MZ?

NotEmilio

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hello i've bought myself rpg maker a few years ago and haven't used it much i want to get back into making games and idk if i should keep using mv or get mz?
 

fizzly

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Depends. If you have MV, then I would not buy MZ again honestly. If you worked on older, then definitely YES, buy MZ.
 

Kes

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This gets asked a lot. What most people find helpful is to get the free trial of the engine they are thinking of changing to and try it out for a couple of weeks, see how you like it.

EDIT
You might find this video helpful in answering.
 

Andar

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there are three big differences between MV and MZ, everything else is just convenience.
you need to decide if those three differences are enough to pay for MZ if you already have MV.

1) MZ uses particle animations, MV uses picture animations.
particle animations look better, but are more difficult to create. Do you consider making your own animations?

2) MZ can switch between manual layer control and automatic layer control, MV has only automatic layer control.
Manual layer control gives much more options for mapping and has been missing and asked for ever since VX.

3) MZ is actively supported, MV is legacy without further updates
 

Aesica

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If you're just casual about using RPGMaker, MV is more than fine. More/better plugin selection, MV's animation system is way easier to make stuff with compared to MZ's effekseer, both port easily to multiple target platforms (executable, web/mobile), and MV has been tested and passed those tests for years now. Only reason I use MZ for newer/jam projects over MV is because I was dumb enough to buy it around release.

Now if you really get into using it, then MZ might be worth a look in a few years when better plugin options show up and the engine itself gets better sale prices, but I'd hold off for now.
 

watermark

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Thanks to the jam, I got to really know MZ cause I put 30+ hours into my entry Isekai Champions, which you can search for and it's worth 20 mins of playtime. Not one of my best I say. My past entries usually take 100+ hours with a team. By the way, letting us try MZ for free is a great idea! I might just buy it...when there's a sale. :p

So my thoughts:

1. Being a MV veteran, it took me no more than 15 minutes to figure out how to use almost all of MZ. It's got a few differences, but the 2 systems are very similar. I do like how MZ does the plugin commands now. It's much easier.

2. Great looking animations! But like people said here, it's harder to make. Also, sometimes I use the animation system in MV to create some custom scene animations using charsets, which I can't do in MZ. This is a minus. I think there is an add-on that adds back MV's animations but haven't had time to look into it.

3. SRDude's HUD Maker Ultra. This makes MZ like 100% better! Incredible add-on, highly recommended. Actually this would be one of my major reasons for buying MZ.

4. @Restart 's FOSSIL system allows you to use a lot of MV plugins in MZ with little hassle. It's very cool!

5. Lots of other great plug-ins as well. The Visustella stuff is basically Yanfly's library. I didn't like how it's all put in massive Cores now though because the core may make other plug-ins not work, and I only needed like one function in a Core. I understand why they did it to make it more efficient, but I guess I preferred the old Yanfly way.

6. MZ is prettier looking than MV. All the art and the new custom generator is quite nice. The tilesets are mostly the same.

7. I haven't had time to look too deeply into the new battle systems that came with MZ. Will check them out some other time. So no comment there.

Well that's my two cents. :)
 
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TheGentlemanLoser

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If you can afford Visustella (or for some reason don't have access to Yanfly Engine Plugin library for MV and would for some reason have to pay a comparable amount for access to that) I'd recommend MZ, otherwise, MV there are just so many more plugins readily available for it making it a much more versatile modular platform/game engine. If FOSSIL doesn't exist this would probably be more strongly worded, but it does so that tempers this point significantly. People have mentioned a lot of the important differences/pros and cons.

The actual MZ engine runs much faster and lighter than MV, I find, I don't know why it just feels like it's more efficient/is requiring less effort of my machine to run the games. The load time to test play is much shorter and the MZ 'player' (the engine qua engine, if you will) feels lightweight and springy compared to MV.

As a tradeoff to that (because it wouldn't be the RPG Maker franchise if it wasn't two steps forward, one step back), you lose the ability to easily edit animations w/o messing around with Effekseer because MZ rather surprisingly drops 2D sprite-and-cell based animations in favor of 3D particle effects (oooo fancy).

MZ has some cool quality of life improvements, too. I like the way it handles plugin commands (you don't need to type in codes that can be quite random and arbitrary in terms of syntax coming from different plugin developers, it's a drop down) and the at-long-last edition of a "preview" option when using the Set Movement Route event command is *chef kiss* just pure awesome!

2) MZ can switch between manual layer control and automatic layer control, MV has only automatic layer control.
Manual layer control gives much more options for mapping and has been missing and asked for ever since VX.

I literally did not even notice this was a thing and I've been using MZ exclusively and heavily for the last month thanks to Touch The Stars Jam. I want to say this means it's not that important and that might be true to a degree but then again

a) I am very, very used to not having this capability and thus didn't even think to look for it
b) compared to most devs in this scene/culture I don't really give a **** about mapping lol, like it's a chore I have to do to make games in this engine but it's generally something I'm trying to get away with doing as little of as possible as opposed to doing it as *well* as possible
 

Frostorm

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MZ's layering system is pretty much the only feature I find MV to be lacking. Everything else in MZ is either "meh" or can be achieved in MV. For example, MZ's performance/efficiency improvements can largely be had in MV by upgrading pixi.js to a newer version (here's another link). Another downside to MZ is that a lot of its plugins, such as VisuStella's suite of plugins, are obfuscated, making it harder to customize stuff to your needs. However, there is one plugin for MZ I really wish MV had, which is the PrimeParallax plugin, made possible due to MZ's superior layering system.

Look at those reflections...*drool*


Also, for beginners, MZ has these tutorials that'll help people get started, which I found cool, but not really something I need. If on the off chance that FOSSIL will make LeTBS compatible w/ MZ, then and only then, will I consider upgrading to MZ.
 
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I decided to switch over from MV to MZ (currently saving up for Visustella plugins) because I'm making a large game, and MZ apparently is more stable for making large games and is able to deploy large games with more stability. I want players to be able to finish playing the game without having the annoying lag and memory issues that have been complained about for large games made using MV.
 

rue669

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I have mz but I’m sticking with mv. Too much time invested and I’m not making very big games so it runs fine.
At the end of the day, the engine doesn’t really matter. It’s a tool. If the tool does what you want, then it’s a good tool.
 

Wavelength

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I think that MZ is almost strictly better than MV, and would always recommend using MZ over MV for people who are starting a new project. However, if you already have a large part of your project built in MV, there's probably nothing in MZ that will prove so vital to you that you need to use it instead.
 

Ami

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for the start,you must choose MZ,'cause it still fresh in the shelves until now.

Visustella's Plugin Tier 0 had a job done in some aspects (like advanced skill cost,categorized items & more),the rest is up to you what you have to do in your work
 

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Yes, you should.

-MIA
 

jonthefox

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I would recommend using MZ but with the MV tiles. MZ tiles have so many weird graphical bugs and inconsistencies. Edits from the community have helped a lot, but I still find myself so frustrated with the MZ RTP. MZ engine is SO much better than MV though, I feel. The layers alone make it worth the upgrade.
 

Aesica

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Well if you do choose MZ, know that (as others have pointed out) FOSSIL (an MV compatibility plugin) exists and will let you use any yanfly/etc plugins you had in MV over in MZ. No sense buying the same thing twice (or even once if you got the yanfly stuff when it was free) after all.

Personally I use MZ over MV for newer things, but that's because I've been working on my own plugin suite with similar functionality to Yanfly and VS, although it's not quite ready for public use yet. I realize this is very much not the typical reason someone would choose one engine over another though.
 

lesbrarians

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I've been wondering the same thing, but I've decided not to for a few reasons.
1. I already own MV and from what I've seen, the difference between MZ and MV isn't worth the current price tag. There's not enough new features for me to justify spending an additional $80 to upgrade.

2. I make my own art, including animations, and the learning curve for creating particle animations is too steep for me. I'd rather stick with what I know and make picture-based animations.

3. I came across this bit of information when comparing negative vs. positive Steam reviews: "An exported project can be as big as way more than 200MB in RMMZ, while similar projects in RMMV would've been just around 50MB." No idea if this is true since I haven't tested it myself, but it's something to consider.

The biggest draw for me would be the layer option for mapping, but honestly, the layers in Yanfly's doodads plugin satisfy that itch for more layers. Most of MZ's new features can already be satisfied for me in MV with plugins.

Just my perspective; what works for me may not work for you! Ultimately, it's a personal decision. I think it's easy to get swept up in Fear of Missing Out -- that was my big hangup in "should I switch to MZ," feeling like I Had To upgrade to the latest version, or else I would be Missing Out. If you can accomplish what you want in MV, then don't feel like you have to purchase something new and port everything over to MZ.
 

slimmmeiske2

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3. I came across this bit of information when comparing negative vs. positive Steam reviews: "An exported project can be as big as way more than 200MB in RMMZ, while similar projects in RMMV would've been just around 50MB." No idea if this is true since I haven't tested it myself, but it's something to consider.
What? It's the complete opposite. If I include unused assets in MZ, it will be a lot lighter (around 50 MB ) than if I do the same in MV (around 350 MB ). MZ is very much more optimized with its resources in that way.


Anyway, I would personally always suggest upgrading if you have the money. It has so many tiny QoL additions that makes it just so much more nicer to work with than MV and of course the manual layer system for maps is finally back!
 
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2. I make my own art, including animations, and the learning curve for creating particle animations is too steep for me. I'd rather stick with what I know and make picture-based animations.

There's a plugin for importing MV animations to MZ.

Here's a tutorial by Driftwood Gaming.

 

Aesica

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What? It's the complete opposite. If I include unused assets in MZ, it will be a lot lighter (around 50 MB ) than if I do the same in MV (around 350 MB ). MZ is very much more optimized with its resources in that way.


Anyway, I would personally always suggest upgrading if you have the money. It has so many tiny QoL additions that makes it just so much more nicer to work with than MV and of course the manual layer system for maps is finally back!
They might be referring to the nwjs components specifically, which are a lot larger in MZ than in MV. MZ's RTP is more compacted though, and omitting the redundant m4a files really cuts back on the bloat. If you're not using any RTP though, that aspect is irrelevant since you can compress your pngs for either engine, and if I recall, you only need the m4as in MV if exporting to ios.
 

Restart

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They might be referring to the nwjs components specifically, which are a lot larger in MZ than in MV. MZ's RTP is more compacted though, and omitting the redundant m4a files really cuts back on the bloat. If you're not using any RTP though, that aspect is irrelevant since you can compress your pngs for either engine, and if I recall, you only need the m4as in MV if exporting to ios.


MZ's got better compression on their RTP by doing things using indexed pngs. It works great if you leave them as is - no data loss for smaller file size. It is a bit of an issue when trying to edit them, however, because a lot of image editors (like photoshop) can't handle indexed pngs and mess them up - that means you just need to take an extra step to convert them into a normal png with imagemagick or something like that, it's no big deal if you know what to expect.


My recommendation would be to wait until MZ is on a good sale through the degica store, then buy it there - the mapping is definitely more convenient, but it isn't a huge game changer, and the degica store gives you a version that can be used without the steam client running (as well as a free bonus steam key).
 

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