Suggestions for the next RPG Maker

[Tai_MT]

Hey, I would seriously pay an extra $10 for the program if it came with a comprehensive Help File instead of the minimalistic barely useful one we've got now.  Throw some tutorials and demos in that sucker, go in depth with how your program works, and maybe even include a link to the forums as a "for using features in advanced ways" link.  That, my friends, would be glorious and worth my hard-earned money.

 

[Zoltor]

Hey, I would seriously pay an extra $10 for the program if it came with a comprehensive Help File instead of the minimalistic barely useful one we've got now.  Throw some tutorials and demos in that sucker, go in depth with how your program works, and maybe even include a link to the forums as a "for using features in advanced ways" link.  That, my friends, would be glorious and worth my hard-earned money.

Yea I'm all for that, this help file is utterly useless, as is you basically have to literally figure everything out yourself or ask on the forum.

Hell for the most part, the help file doesn't even have the most basic technical info(lmao like how tilesets are formatted, nor how each one works, for crying out loud, some help file). Good thing you can export resources, because you sure wont get the info you need from that useless help file.

I think It's a given, that this must be the utility program with the worst help file/paperwork in the history of utility programs. Usually Utility Programs come with amazing help files/paperwork(more like books lol).

 

[Engr. Adiktuzmiko]

the help file doesn't even have the most basic technical info like how tilesets are formatted, nor how each one works

Those are actually on the help file... maybe not in a very good explanation but the help file does have information on how each tilesheet is formatted... so saying that it doesn't have that is wrong.

 

[Caustic]

Yea I'm all for that, this help file is utterly useless, as is you basically have to literally figure everything out yourself or ask on the forum.

Hell for the most part, the help file doesn't even have the most basic technical info(lmao like how tilesets are formatted, nor how each one works, for crying out loud, some help file). Good thing you can export resources, because you sure wont get the info you need from that useless help file.

I think It's a given, this must be the utility program with the worst help file/paperwork in the history of utility programs. Usually Utility Programs come with amazing help files/paperwork(more like books lol).

I think the worst part is that, if you ask for help with any scripting beyond basic commands (or script requests), half of everyone says "Go memorize the help file / commands from other people's scripts". Which is NOT how one learns programming or a different language. .__.

@Shana: Like you said, it's not well explained. Nor is it very helpful in what it does explain.

 

[Yato]

@Zoltor: There's an entire subsection of resource standards dedicated to how the tiles are set up, with a heavy focus on A1-A5 since B-E are all very basic.

Spoiler

But I'm the type of person who only uses the help menu for hidden class documentation and occasionally resource standards, so I don't really have a problem with it.


@Caustic: Really? I can't say I've ever seen anyone recommending straight memorization. The documentation exists to be referenced, not memorized. I've always given the advice of start with the basics of object-orientated languages. Don't focus on RGSS so much until you know at least the basics.

 

[Engr. Adiktuzmiko]

@Caustic - I learned programming from just reading help files + looking at the internet + other people's scripts, basically self-education... How in the world would people who cannot get formal education learn otherwise?


@Racheal - me too, I only open it when I'm looking for some script info. The help is at the very least, a lot helpful on that case.

 

[Zoltor]

Those are actually on the help file... maybe not in a very good explanation but the help file does have information on how each tilesheet is formatted...

Really, I couldn't find pixel sizes or even how each A is suppose to be used.

Basically all it says is A tilesets are autotiles, and it states some useless babble of how the system "behind the scenes" classifies the tilesets. Seeing how we don't have access to the engine code anyway, I fail to see how such is useful information.

Who gives a crap about how the system categorizes a feature behind the scenes.  The help file gives you all the info you don't need, but basic things, like what "each" A does, and what size pixels(in some cases) the tile needs to be for X tileset format, good luck finding that info. If the info is there at all, It's buried really deep.

The same goes for every aspect you lookup in the help file,

To Caustic: Yea reading help files for any code, is the utmost worst way to learn coding(It's not just with Ruby either, It's this way for any code/engine with help files), because in help files, everything is a fragmented mess of who the bloody hell actually thought this would offer any help.

Every single keyworld or whatnot(everything in general is described separately) is described on its own page, so It's pretty much impossible to learn that way.

You're better off watching/reading tutorials+working with already finished code, so you can easily learn how it all ties together, and you get a full picture of what each aspect of the code is for, It's not a million, and one keywords each on its own stand alone page.

 

[Engr. Adiktuzmiko]

I never said it was SUPER HELPFUL, what I was indicating is only that saying that it doesn't have info for that matter is wrong.

The same goes for every aspect you lookup in the help file

The scripts part looks totally useful to me, I learned a hell lot from that...


What are you looking for exactly? A Help file that SPOON-FEEDS you?

 

[Yato]

Group 3


These auto tiles are mainly used for building facades. This group has a size of 512 × 256, and it is comprised only by group patterns of auto tiles that are eight wide and four long.

That looks like describing what this A tile is intended to do and the size it needs to be to me?
Sure, it's written in a way that expects you to be familiar with the program, but most people aren't going to make custom tiles for a first game.


And if the help file isn't enough, you can also study the default tiles that come with the program. It's pretty easy to highlight a selection and see what size it is with most graphic editing programs that I've ever used.

 

[Engr. Adiktuzmiko]

yeah, most times you simply need to use your mind a little bit... seriously, if making something in the maker is as easy as simply following what the help file says, then game development using RM will be a task that is so easy, that nobody will pay attention to it anymore

Every single keyworld or whatnot(everything in general is described separately) is described on its own page, so It's pretty much impossible to learn that way.

Last time I heard from my friends that take CS and from my own experience (I had 1 programming subject, visual basic only though), you are first taught on how each method/parameter/attribute/whatever is used. Since you need to learn first how each one is used before you move on to working on combining them. And really, in any other field, you always start with studying the basic building blocks. Like in Chemistry, you study elements first before compounds. In math you start with basic arithmetic before going into things like algebra. so in prog, you start first with learning how each individual functions of that language works before you go on into mixing them all up.


Sure you can go and start with mix-ups, but if something goes wrong on the individual parts, you'd have a hard time debugging since you don't know how each individual block exactly works... that's why it's important to learn the basics of the language first.

 

[Zoltor]

That looks like describing what this A tile is intended to do and the size it needs to be to me?

Sure, it's written in a way that expects you to be familiar with the program, but most people aren't going to make custom tiles for a first game.

And if the help file isn't enough, you can also study the default tiles that come with the program. It's pretty easy to highlight a selection and see what size it is with most graphic editing programs that I've ever used.

Those size numbers are useless, that's like the size limit of the entire tileset, what people really need, is the size of individual tiles for X type tileset. It is seriously like pulling teeth, to get any useful info about whatever you are looking up.

Also, a one word description might as well be no description at all. In that example, if that's all it did, why does the tileset format require a tile format the size of like 8 tiles(or whatever), to do something as simple as that(If memory serves me right, it would only require 3 32x32 tiles to do everything this screwed up formatted tileset does)?

 

[Sharm]

The help file explaining how resources work is missing a few things. Like for example, the A tiles sometimes can be used on top of other A tiles and some can't, and there's no information about which spaces do that and which don't. Or where the character is drawn from if it's more than one tile big so that it can be positioned correctly when mapping an animation. It would be nice if it was a bit more thorough.

 

[Engr. Adiktuzmiko]

@Sharm - from the help file

Special Specifications for Lower-Layer Tiles


The A2 tiles in the tileset under the tile palette's A tab (rows three through six) are divided into base tiles (columns one through four from the left) and embellishment tiles (columns five through eight from the left). Embellishment tiles can be placed on top of base tiles.


However, with tilesets where Mode in the tileset dialog box is set to Field type, placing embellishment tiles over base tiles selected from columns two or four transforms them into column-one or three base tiles.

 

[Tai_MT]

And now my brain hurts.  Thanks guys!

 

[Sharm]

Thank you. I've read through that help file so many times and missed that link every time.

 

[GammaVector]

For the love of god, please fix the script call box. It is very tiny, and while I don't mind that so much, the fact that it's auto-linebreaks break scripts just kills me. It's tiny! There's no room for anything complicated at all! And you know what? If I'm using a script call, it's because what I want to do can't be accomplished in the editor. So it's going to be complicated by default.


Even if it's difficult to change, having us use semicolons for linebreaks like in the damage formula box would be a huge improvement. Although, overall, I'd like a script call box that was more like the comment box. But the big one is those linebreaks.

 

[Engr. Adiktuzmiko]

I think they really meant for it to just be used to call methods that are on scripts, not to handle long things and full methods on themselves


Plus you can always just put your long methods into scripts, then call them via the script call command instead of trying to type them out on the box itself

 

[GammaVector]

I know that's what they meant it for. But still. There's no reason it couldn't be a little more convenient. For goodness sake, the damage calculation formula box is more flexible!

 

[Engr. Adiktuzmiko]

it's not flexible, I can't bend it. Lolz...

 

[GammaVector]

Haha, no I can't either.


But you know what I mean. When the formula box handles linebreaks better than the script call box, I think it's a problem. If the devs agree with me, maybe it'll get fixed. If not, oh well. Sux 2 b me. (Lol, not really.)