Thoughts on episodic/arc game gradual releases?

[MushroomCake28]

I've traditionally only played games that were fully released all at once, except for once but the game was in alpha. I was thinking about making my next project into an episodic/arc release, like an on-going manga or anime, but you release the whole arc every time instead of 1 episode per week.

So let's say there's a game where the full story is done over 10 arcs. It's a long game, and every arc cover one chapter of the story (so it's not just 1 mission). What do you think if the game releases 1 arc every month, or every 2 months, or something like that? Everything would be inside the same project, so there would only need to be one download, and launchers like steam can push updates to release new arcs every time there's a release.

I'm just wondering if the waiting delay between arcs would excite people, making them eager to play the next part? Or is it a disadvantage?

In a gamedev perspective, it's a great way of working since:

• it allows more time to work on the project;
• it makes people test your game and reporting bug early in the process;
• it disciplines the gamedev into working constantly on the game to fulfill the updates.

What are your thoughts?

 

[Mrs_Allykat]

Capcom tried this with a triple A title on the Dreamcast, I believe El Derado or something. It was met with some success, but was a little too late in the life-cycle of the console to be a good title to judge with.

As far as us makers/indie devs go, it might be okay - but some players would expect that it wouldn't get finished, so wouldn't bother. I think it would help to have a following before starting such a project.

 

[GoodSelf]

I If you're trying to do something like this in RPG Maker, it's a pretty daunting task. I may not be 100% correct, somebody correct me if needed, but you would have to have the database and everything set up so that it's the same in every game, that is if you wanted to transfer progress over.

Another option is to use a passcode system - at the end of each game you'll get a passcode based on some decisions you've made that can be input into the second Arc to change the story.

Another idea is to just have game be its own entity from start to finish, which means let's say you play as John in the first game , second game and fifth game, John will likely not carry the same abilities level or weapons that they picked up in the other games.
Your scope is going to determine its viability.

 

[TheoAllen]

I have a tendency of making every game different. So if episodic games are released, I just couldn't bring myself to use the same mechanic as the previous one. And some of the design is just better to be used in longer gameplay. Some others are for shorter.

Personal aside. There are a few drawbacks I could think of

1. Your player will constantly ask "Do I need to play the previous one?"
2. Depends on your execution, they probably don't. But they wouldn't understand the whole context without playing the previous one.
3. If the episodic releases mean a direct continuation to see what's next, if they got bored mid-way, they probably won't play the next episode.

 

[MushroomCake28]

Capcom tried this with a triple A title on the Dreamcast, I believe El Derado or something. It was met with some success, but was a little too late in the life-cycle of the console to be a good title to judge with.

I see. I know it's not something new, but it's certainly starting to be more frequent in the world of video games (like Final Fantasy 7 remake).

As far as us makers/indie devs go, it might be okay - but some players would expect that it wouldn't get finished, so wouldn't bother. I think it would help to have a following before starting such a project.

Would it help if every arc is a full story by itself, and all the arcs combined is part of a bigger story? It would resemble what a season of a tv show is: each episode is a full story, but all the episodes combined follow a bigger story.

I If you're trying to do something like this in RPG Maker, it's a pretty daunting task. I may not be 100% correct, somebody correct me if needed, but you would have to have the database and everything set up so that it's the same in every game, that is if you wanted to transfer progress over.

That is correct in most cases. The first arc released will take longer to make since you have to make all the game's architecture (battles, items, menus, etc.). But since it's not released yet, there's no pressure to release it compared to subsequent arc because people are waiting.

Another idea is to just have game be its own entity from start to finish, which means let's say you play as John in the first game , second game and fifth game, John will likely not carry the same abilities level or weapons that they picked up in the other games.
Your scope is going to determine its viability.

That sounds more like different games that are sequels/prequels. I was talking more the approach to a single title, but dividend into arcs, like in shounen mangas or tv shows.

I have a tendency of making every game different. So if episodic games are released, I just couldn't bring myself to use the same mechanic as the previous one. And some of the design is just better to be used in longer gameplay. Some others are for shorter.

Personal aside. There are a few drawbacks I could think of

1. Your player will constantly ask "Do I need to play the previous one?"
2. Depends on your execution, they probably don't. But they wouldn't understand the whole context without playing the previous one.
3. If the episodic releases mean a direct continuation to see what's next, if they got bored mid-way, they probably won't play the next episode.

Perhaps I didn't expressed myself clearly. I'm not talking about different games, I'm talking about a single game that is divided into arcs, like mangas/animes. Imagine you release 1 season every 1-2 month. By itself, the season tells a full story (introduction, plot, conclusion), but that story is part of a bigger story.

Yes, there's the danger of people getting bored for sure. That's also true for full stories though, we just don't talk much about it because 1 sale is 1 sale regardless of if the player completes the game or not.

 

[TheoAllen]

Perhaps I didn't expressed myself clearly. I'm not talking about different games, I'm talking about a single game that is divided into arcs, like mangas/animes. Imagine you release 1 season every 1-2 month. By itself, the season tells a full story (introduction, plot, conclusion), but that story is part of a bigger story.

This sounds like a mobile game in which the story is updated every few months.

Yes, there's the danger of people getting bored for sure. That's also true for full stories though, we just don't talk much about it because 1 sale is 1 sale regardless of if the player completes the game or not.

Now, I'm confused. You said a "single game" and 1 sale. Which means you're treating it as, DLC? pay more to know the continuation of this story in this single game(?), not as in a different instance of a game.

 

[MushroomCake28]

Now, I'm confused. You said a "single game" and 1 sale. Which means you're treating it as, DLC? pay more to know the continuation of this story in this single game(?), not as in a different instance of a game.

I'm not talking a commercial game. Price is not important, and anyways I intend to make it free.

Imagine a manga. There's one chapter every week, right? Now imagine instead of 1 chapter every week, it's 5 chapters that are by themselves a complete arc, but every month.

 

[TheoAllen]

Imagine a manga. There's one chapter every week, right? Now imagine instead of 1 chapter every week, it's 5 chapters that are by themselves a complete arc, but every month.

I get what you're saying. I don't get the practical way you want to deliver this.
If it's a single game, it is basically just like a demo, but updated regularly. What makes it different than a demo? Or if it's multiple instances of a game that you have to download (and install) separately for each episode?

 

[MushroomCake28]

I get what you're saying. I don't get the practical way you want to deliver this.
If it's a single game, it is basically just like a demo, but updated regularly. What makes it different than a demo? Or if it's multiple instances of a game that you have to download (and install) separately for each episode?

Practically there would only be a single download. It's a single title, and updates would be pushed automatically. Probably using Steam for that.

 

[gstv87]

we've seen it at work with Valve's releases.
if you don't have a long-term plan for development, it'll never come out.

works for both Half-Life and Team Fortress 2.
TF2 has been updated over the years, and now it's a mess of code, patches, fixes, expansion space, and custom content that nobody understands.
Fortnite is going the same way.
I think Minecraft Story Mode was also planned as episodic release, and you can see how the writing goes all over the place with it.

AOE2 was going the same way, until they decided "Ok, let's unify it all, and call it done."
and they released the definitive edition.
there are no plans to update it, and it'll last as long as it lasts.
it is no AOE3, because AOE3 has different gameplay altogether, the same way AOE2 has different gameplay to AOE1.
there's a line to be drawn between "do we update this?" and "do we make a new game altogether?"

Imagine a manga. There's one chapter every week, right? Now imagine instead of 1 chapter every week, it's 5 chapters that are by themselves a complete arc, but every month.

that's the same thing with TV series.
it used to be that the producers would shoot and cut one or two episodes per week in advance, over the course of a year.
but that presented problems with the cast, the locations, the TV schedule, etc.
now, most TV productions are shot entirely in advance, and then released over the course of a year.
so, you can have a production crew working first on the finale and then in the rest of the episodes, out of order, aiming for a deadline of August or September, to air between September and March of the next year, to wait for a renewal, to begin production again in April, to release again in September.

Bleach had a huge problem with being produced according to the manga, because the author was still writing the manga at the same time the series aired, and seeing the series on air caused him to go and rewrite a lot of things, and that delayed the production.

if you aim for an episodic release, you have to have the writing of that story defined by the time you make that decision.
and if that story doesn't hit hard enough, or flops catastrophically, you're left with a lot of undeveloped earnings, a lot of production work, and nobody to sell it to.

let it be noted that "updates" are not the same as "episodic content".
updates are fixes to errors, maintenance of the whole system, and additions to the content unrelated to the main story/theme/mechanics of the game.
episodic content is material that expands the universe of the production.

 

[MushroomCake28]

@gstv87 I get your point. So episodic releases can work well if the story and everything else is planned all ahead. In other words, it still saves the dev times to work the details and execute them between episodes as long as the story is all set beforehand. For example, even with a full script it takes time to animate stuff and set events correctly in the editor. So the script would need to be done beforehand, but the execution can be done between episodes?

As for updates, I was talking about the method of pushing new content automatically using Steam or any other launcher that has auto-updates.

 

[CraneSoft]

Your case is less of an episodic and more like a "chapter" or "update" thing released monthly which is common practice in any crowd-funded projects for bug-testing and feedback gathering during development. I use the term chapter because episodic is the term more often used for separate projects where each episode is it's own game. And a lot of(successful) finished projects continue to add updates monthly for additional content.

Now my thoughts on episodic games (for example the TRAILS series):
People are eager to play the next part if your game/story is good enough for one reason - because they are given an INCOMPLETE story to begin with. Now you can ask yourself - would any human being like the "being forced to wait soonTM amount of time" aspect? Instead of, you know, just get to play the whole story in one go?

I've played several (top-tier) indie games that seems to be made with the intention of being episodic, ending with cliffhangers. And the result? 5 years later, none of them had continuation, with the developers either quit gamedev completely, gone MIA or simply moved on to other projects. This is purely biased opinion, but I generally avoid games that actively advertise themselves as Part I - especially by an indiedev.

 

[TheoAllen]

And the result? 5 years later, none of them had continuation, with the developers either quit gamedev completely, gone MIA or simply moved on to other projects.

I played a certain RM game in 2010 made by the same dev who developed To The Moon. And up to this year, I'm still waiting for the continuation of it. Apparently, since the success of their other game, this project is hiatus indefinitely. Might as well as be considered abandoned. Granted, the project is free and it's completely understandable if they decide to abandon it.

EDIT:
@MushroomCake28 If you'd go that way, you might as well as mark it as "Early Access" because technically it isn't finished.

 

[MushroomCake28]

@TheoAllen Hmm, I see your points. Perhaps I should reconsider it then, go with an early access version, then the full game all at once. I'm truly conflicted and don't have any preferences, just trying to see what fits best.

 

[gstv87]

So the script would need to be done beforehand, but the execution can be done between episodes?

yes.
it can be something as simple as "this guy ends his journey at this location"
if you define somewhere else that he'll have this, that, and that other tool at his disposal, and nothing more, there's only so many combinations you can allow with those, before having to forcibly put that character in a situation where he will end unfailingly at his final destination.

the more detailed the script, the better, because you get a better idea of just how long it'll take to produce.
if you estimate a "when it's done" deadline, and it is done and done according to the script, it doesn't matter how long it takes to produce.
if you estimate a "when it's done", but you have no idea where or how the story ends, you'll be producing forever.

it doesn't take much to take a line from the script and move it a couple paragraphs up or down, in a text processor.
writing-101 establishes that all scripts be written in present tense, so if it is correctly structured you can take all the sentences that make up a chapter (or narrative unit) group them under a time setting, and alter the whole of the setting by calling the time reference once, at the beginning.
if it says "this happens ten years in the past", then the whole section remains ten years in the past, independent of how you ultimately release that material when it's done.
it can be a flashback, a prequel, a passing comment, a separate work altogether, etc.

 

[Andar]

A lot of it will depend on your reputation at the moment you release the first part.
You already have a negative by using an RM-Engine (that is not as big a negative as it was years ago, but there are still a lot of players who automatically reject everything on reading "RPG-Maker"), and now you're considering using another negative.

Big companies often get away with doing trilogies or series because the players can reasonable expect them to stay around to finish the series. If you are an unknown who never released a game before, then a lot of players will wonder if you can finish the story - and no one likes to start a story they never get to finish.

So if you already have a number of games out and a following for a few years, you might be able to get away with a series. If it is your first game, forget any idea to make it a multi-part one.

That said, if you try it you'll have to balance a very critical number of points:
The release of follow-on parts needs to be fast enough to keep interest. That works for mangas because they can be created with a few pages a week - it is much more difficult for a game.
Each part of the game needs to have its own story flow - which means enough of a climax to get the interest and giving the player a "finished" feeling with enough of a cliffhanger to keep them coming back, but not an eternal sereies of cliffhangers without ever accomplishing anything because that will turn players away. This is also a reason why a trilogy works better than a 10-parter in games.
And the price needs to fit the amount of game to buy - the smaller the parts are (which is neccessary to keep the story continuing quickly every other month or every quarter of the year), the smaller the price needs to be. But dividing the game into multiple payments will increase your overhead compared to a single game, which means the return is even less.

So basically - unless you are extremely experienced with game development and story planning as well as marketing, don't expect your first try into multi-parter give you even half the advantages you assume it will give you.

 

[Wavelength]

Personally, I hate it - whenever I buy a game, I always like to feel like there's a full, satisfying adventure waiting for me, that I can savor or gobble at my own pace.

There are some upsides of having a game (or a single story) span multiple releases, and it's probably enjoyable for some people to be forced into the enjoyable anticipation of "when's the next one coming" (I can remember the excitement when a Harry Potter book was about to be released!). But I want to get my opinion on the record, that I would much rather have everything at my fingertips the moment I buy the game.

 

[bgillisp]

I prefer it to be finished before I play it myself. I waited until all 5 episodes of Life is Strange were out before I even bought it or played it. That way I knew it was completed and not going to be aborted mid-way.

One thing you'll need to do is decide what to do if part 1 or 2 doesn't go over well at all. There have been many TV shows that were going to do a long story over several seasons that got canceled after season 1 or 2 just because it wasn't going over well, and as a result the story is unfinished.

As it is, I would suggest at least making each part a full story to a degree. My game world always had 3 stories in mind, but I made each of them full stories by themselves, just in case something happens and I'm unable to finish the others.

 

[Kupotepo]

I prefer a game is functional. A bug is not fun. I support you continue a story into DLC if you would like to. It is keep a game fresh and live. Every month or two months, that is going to be challenge, but I support you try it.

 

[Former_Sky]

I'm always wary of episodic games even in commercial games, for the simple reason that I'd be stuck with an interesting story that is now going nowhere because somewhere between episode 1 and 2, something went wrong and the project is cancelled.