Undertale Battle System?

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So, My Question Is "How To Make An Undertale Battle System In RPG Maker VX Ace?"

I've Seached All Over The Web And The Ones I Found Didn't Really Work For Me.

Is There Even Any Way To Make A Bullet Hell Inside A Battle?

If Someone Could Answer ASAP, That Would Be Fantastic.
 

Shaz

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I've moved this thread to RGSS3 Script Requests. Please be sure to post your threads in the correct forum next time. Thank you.


You may need to explain what "an undertale battle system" is - for those of us who haven't played the game.
 

DustyZiroto

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There's no scripts for an Undertale battle system, but I've seen Undertale battle systems done through events in XP, so it's possible to be done on your own.

Here's a video on it:





You may need to explain what "an undertale battle system" is - for those of us who haven't played the game.
Best example I could find, Shaz:

https://youtu.be/9EvnJ5IkP5U?t=1m57s
 

MeowFace

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Seems to be the same question asked so i'll simply paste the link to the answer

http://forums.rpgmakerweb.com/index.php?/topic/54530-looking-for-a-pacifistic-battle-system/

the battle system is 100% the same as what we already have, it's just a matter of perspective and how you name the skill and lure the player to "think" it's something different. and like i explained in that post, QTE can turn out bad for your game's vote ranking if you implement it wrongly. It's not something that will give a game 100% positive feedbacks.
 

Sixth

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It's not something that will give a game 100% positive feedbacks.
Nothing will make any game get 100% positive feedback. Just saying.
 

_Shadow_

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You said VX Ace.

I suggest MV.

Why? Well first things first. Undertale was coded,not evented.

So you got two alternatives.

1] Find a script or make yourself good code in Ruby, that will handle all these. In this case you need a good and maybe paid to use anti lag script, to make the game work well.

2] Find a script or make yourself code in Javascript, using good practices.

Undertale's system is fantastic and innovative. It is also half of what Undertale is. It gives a lot to the whole atmosphere of the game. The battle system, the graphics, the sound fx, everything, had a concept behind it. Why do you want such a system? Look it's not my business asking such questions, but it is you who has to ask yourself that question.  Do you REALLY-NEED-THIS kind of system?

If so, I got an idea with eventing.  But it needs to learn how to use some RGSS3 commands.The only thing that might be different are the commands from Ace to MV (MV uses Javascript) So it can apply to both scenarios as a hybrid solution, mostly oriented on eventing.

Here is the idea:

Disable battles. You have to use an 8 direction script to make things move at any direction. Ummm.... how about an action battle system that helps you use items to recover? So you can use Khas ABS for that, doing soome modifications so you can not attack.

Using some commands you can make events move from a place to another, like tears, like lines, like whatever you want really. When it comes to big sprites though, an event is only one tile. You will have collision issues, so you should consider use multiple tiles and keep them occupying somehow the whole square.

Except if you wanna use the collision detection of Khas ABS script (I know there is one because how else can you kill a monster?) to do that... hmmm...

Here is the trick:

You can use a full-screen-map, the battle map as a square that action is going on.

Your sprite must become a heart or something like the original, beofre teleporting it there.

Things happen on the screen (like tiles appear, change place, get destroyed...)

Then you use Event to Show Choice...

Attack

Item

Act

Flee

After the battle ends, (you heavily event the whole battle thing iin the battle map), you make your sprite from heart to transparent, fade out screen, go back on the normal map (having xpostistion and yposition memorized before the battle) and put the character back there, then change the graphics to the normal sprite and fade in.

In other words, you make your own evented battle system.

As for how to do stuff using the Event Command Script....

you can thank the community for being so awesome!!!

Here are two links:

http://forums.rpgmakerweb.com/index.php?/topic/25759-script-call-collection-for-vxace/

http://forums.rpgmakerweb.com/index.php?/topic/42819-script-call-equivalents-of-events-doc/?hl=%2Bscript+%2Bcall+%2Bequivalents

I think that answers your question on:

"How To Make An Undertale Battle System In RPG Maker VX Ace?"

Now, you got an idea HOW to make it. ;)

I hope you like this idea, it was the best and most simple thing that I could imagine.

Next thing to suggest is a script of course.
 
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Sixth

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It is impossible to event something like that.


The whole point of that "Bullet Hell" is to avoid different shaped sprites.


With eventing, you can not make pixel collision effectively (if at all), you will need to use scripts for that.


If you want to avoid using strictly square looking sprites while your actor is a big square itself, I would advise against trying to event it.


It would look pretty weird if a, lets say, small oval bullet triggers a hit when the player's sprite is a dozens pixels away.


But if that doesn't bother you, go for it.


Scripting it is possible for sure. If you do it well, it will even be on a playable FPS level.


Doubt that you will need more bullets than this:

That is made in Ace too. Recording it dropped the FPS a bit thou. >.>


Ohh, and doing it on the map is generally a bad idea. That is the least optimized scene. Add in tons of "bullets" and your FPS will be killed there for sure.


You should do it in a new scene which doesn't get polluted with the default scripts.


Actually, you could probably use the script from the video for this (if you don't mind "complicated" scripts, that is).


It is already completed, I'm just too lazy to make the full documentation for it. >.>
 
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MeowFace

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In other words, you make your own evented battle system.
I doubt it will be easy, even using my event triggers event script + pixel movement script will still not be able to reproduce a shooter game in its 100% fun and power. It's the "dodge" and the thrill to be able to "dodge" bullets that makes a shooter game thrilling. But with the current character's tile movement process, there's limit. And events, unlike the shooter game enemies(where they only exist on screen), exist outside of the screen, making processing heavier.

Even when we do it 100% in script to create a shooter game, there's the limit since the older RM series has trouble dealing with moving objects(graphics) on screen.

You said VX Ace.

I suggest MV.
I agree on this, mainly because old RM series doesn't support GPU.

There's a huge limit on moving graphic processing when it comes to it.

So even making a shooter game using script (with animated enemies, effect included projectiles), there's a limit of how many can appear on the screen before it starts to lag. eg, a good smoke trail or a good particle system that generate over 100 graphic per second can easily use up the needed resources for the game.exe to process them smoothly. So in the end we will have to either use a limiter to limit the bullet counts/enemy counts/particle count/effect count on screen to avoid lag. Or simply build a simple simple simple shooter game with no animations and AI (graphic types used doesn't really matter, there are more than a way to use tons of graphics on screen in the least processing power so that's not a huge problem).

So... that means you will have to give up on a lot of goodies in a shooter game just to make it work-able in RM environment. Which, is a good waste of a good RPG engine.

"But i don't want the default battle!"

"I don't even want the default graphic style in VXA! Not even the VX or XP graphic style suit my taste!"

"I don't want to make a JRPG in RM!"

"I want to change the menu to what-ever i like, how-ever i like without begging for script!"

Well... RM isn't your tool to make your ideal game.

You should try GG Maker where it gives you a wysiwyg GUI builder, you don't have to beg for a script to make your ideal GUI/Menu/Whaterver game system you need to get your game going. You don't have to learn a full script language to do scripts there too. ("Scripting" in GG Maker is the same as "eventing" in RM but a lot more flexible and not limited to jrpg only)

http://www.rpgmakerweb.com/products/programs/gg-maker




RM is on a fixed "format" to do JRPG style games, and is fine tuned to make such games run smooth and easy to build, thus you won't find it flexible in menus/battle or even process power outside of this format. Adding scripts allow you to do a lot of stuffs, even making 3D games using the game.exe, but there's the processing limit, and you can easily end up running 2 engines at the same time to get what you really want. So you can imagine why it's lagging.

But if what you want is a simple novel-like story telling or adventure/quest game.. then yes, it's within the game default engine's scope so you can easily make one in RM (with the exception of menu flexibility) and simply ignore the battle system once and for all.
 
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_Shadow_

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"The whole point of that "Bullet Hell" is to avoid different shaped sprites.
With eventing, you can not make pixel collision effectively (if at all), you will need to use scripts for that."


@Sixth you do not follow me. I suggested to also use Khas ABS that has some kind of collision detection didn't I?

Actually any 8 direction and collision detection script can be used. I don't remember if modernalgebra made something like that. Maybe there are more.

"Ohh, and doing it on the map is generally a bad idea. That is the least optimized scene. Add in tons of "bullets" and your FPS will be killed there for sure.
You should do it in a new scene which doesn't get polluted with the default scripts."


Ever heard of Effectus? Also talked about using an anti lag script didn't I?

Anyway that's not the point. Of course you are right. It is very complicated and I wish good luck to that person if eventing will be the way.

A script can of course make things really easier. But until someone makes one, the person is stuck right?

@Meowface i never said it would be easy. :p

As for events existing outside the screen, I think  there is a way to destroy an instance. Or not?

GG maker is a tool that can also make games like what is asked I suppose.

I am glad you agree on MV. Actually there are more possibilities to get a script that does what is needed in JS than in Ruby.

I mean the trend is to support the best engine of the series, correct me if I am wrong. ;)
 
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MeowFace

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@Meowface i never said it would be easy. :p

As for events existing outside the screen, I think  there is a way to destroy an instance. Or not?

GG maker is a tool that can also make games like what is asked I suppose.

I am glad you agree on MV. Actually there are more possibilities to get a script that does what is needed in JS than in Ruby.

I mean the trend is to support the best engine of the series, correct me if I am wrong. ;)
Nope the way the engine loads a map, events are preloaded into the map via the map files, then they find their way to the self-switch class from there. For a shooter game we decide when the "objects" (events) show up on the screen via time-line. the object is programmed to auto kill themselves when out of screen (not effecting scores and such of course).

Yes, GG Maker isn't restricted to one game style. So it's up to the imagination of the developer using it. It will be a lot of work to build a whole turn base battle there tho. Do-able, just need to work on the logic. ;)

Well, to be honest, i've choosen Unity over MV here myself, so i can't say i am supporting MV over other RM series. At least not until MV has solve that RTP issue they are having. The only thing i like about the RM series is the RTP actually, that make doujin games and shared gaming experience a lot easier for both gamers and developers. If i have to pack everything into a game without sharing contents outside of the package, then RM has lost its attraction on me with all those limited process and buggy structures. Unity provide a more... umm.. lets just say.. freedom, when you need to build your game from scratch. While MV or any other RM series on the other hand give you a feel you are tied to a pre-made system that's not very flexible. ;)

So, to just compare the internal languages use in the RM series...

The main point of using JS over Ruby is the portability to iOS and web-based games.

Ruby is just a sum-up short cuts for C while RGSS is just adding more shortcuts to Ruby. The possibility over game building is actually no big difference from JS. Just that JS is being an easier language to learn and basically most web based programmer has JS background up to some standard, doesn't mean it's more popular over ruby when it comes to gaming. JS is just more widely used in other territory while Ruby is used majorly in software/game building. Ruby is also used in most of the major game software we are using. Especially the consoles and portable devices. So.. they both have their goodies and baddies and there's no end to it if you try to debate which one's better.

and oh, didn't notice "the rabbit" was here. Problem with ignore list is you don't get notice when that someone's in it. ;)

Did he upset someone again? Different shaped sprites? That has nothing to do with lag, just memory consuming before the sprite is fully disposed. Having a bunch of same sprites moving on the screen in the old game.exe can still cause lag. The only way to prevent that is like what i said in my last post. You need a limiter placed on the exact lag line before it starts to lag. Well.. not going to join any troll fight so that's all i am going to say. ;)
 

Sixth

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Dude, I don't know what's your problem, but you can leave me out of your thrashtalk.

If you are not agreeing with someone in some topics, that someone is a "troll" for you? Duhh...

You completely missed my point with that.

There is no way to make an effective pixel based collision system with events only. You know, to check if two images collide or not.

And without a pixel collision, you can only check their positions, which is far from being an effective check for real collisions.

The images used will trigger collision even if one or both images got only transparent pixels at the "collision point". And that looks ugly, not to mention the many WTFruit moments the player will get when they are hit from miles away.

I never wrote that different shapes got something to do with lag. It is a major thing for making a functional collision system.

This is not Unity, no built-in image/model collision here, it needs to be made (or use some existing pixel based image collision dlls and scripts for that).

As far as I know, no ABS got real pixel based collisions, but I didn't mess around much with Khas', so no idea if that one got it or not.

You can use Effectus with all possible anti-lags and such, the map scene will still get a massive FPS drop with tons of events/sprites. Unless you play it on a PC with i7 CPU (3-4 GHz), in which case there is barely anything that can drop your FPS anyway.
 

_Shadow_

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Whoa, both of you! I don't know what has happened between you two, I imagine not every person gets along with everyone else here, but personally I have no problem with neither you @Sixth or you @MeowFace. So can I please stay out of this? :rswt:

@Sixth, you told me: "There is no way to make an effective pixel based collision system with events only. And without a pixel collision, you can only check their positions, which is far from being an effective check for real collisions."

Well... when did I said anything different than that? :)

As you noticed, what I suggested, was a hybrid solution, BASED on eventing, including though some script commands for sure and the whole KHAS ABS. ;)

We do not disgagree on anything.

Effectus doesn't drop FPS even when you use 10000+ events.

It is what you put int that event that makes the game heavy.

Parallell Proccesses for instance are the heaviest ones.

Anyway something about Unity, mentioned by @MeowFace. Well of course, Unity can do that. Unity can do collision detection using the mesh of a 3D object too. Not to mention that it can be very precise (but will cost a lot of proccessing power to achieve that) but what is the point bringing Unity to the table really? With Unity you can do ANYTHING. But I see no point using Unity for Undertale. I mean, if we refer to no Degica engines, then why not mention the engine used to create Undertale? Game Maker. But what is the point of this in an RPG Maker forum? :)

I mean @mrlavender9999 wants a solution for Vx Ace really. So I see no point mentioning other engines really.

What I tried was to think something on the fly, and make a suggestion. Might not been the best of course, but I believe that such a system is possible, even with a clumsy way.

GG Maker is a good idea! Maybe the best approach, maybe not. I am between this and MV really if it isn't on Ace.

So, @mrlavender9999 do you own MV or GG Maker? Are you planning to buy any of these? Or shall we stick with the Ace scenarios? I mean, it would be good to hear from you too, so we can focus on the best options you might have available.
 
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Sixth

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I got no problem with MeowFace, but apparently it seems that he does hold a grudge against me for whatever reason.
This is not the first time when he called me a "troll" for no reason, and while I am very tolerant in most cases, I do not like to be called on names when I do not deserve it.


Anyway...
Yes, Effectus does help, but even that got limits. Slower PCs will still get an FPS drop (below ~i5 CPUs), and any FPS drop for a game like this is bad.


I mean, we are talking about a lot of bullets (that is what "Bullet Hell" is about, right?) moving around and doing stuffs.


I did not test this (certainly not in the mood to event something like this :D ), so I can't know for sure, but adding in a pixel movement and an ABS script will impact performance even with Effectus.


I only has v1.2.0 of Effectus for testing (I do not own it, I just worked on some projects using it a long time ago) and comparison, so maybe they did enhance it some more in later versions.


I can't reach a stable 60 FPS with an i3 CPU (1.9 GHz) on that 999 event test map in that version of the demo (the FPS hops up and down from 30 to 42).


Doing it the way you wrote is possible, I never doubted that. It just that it will look bad and clumsy (like you wrote), in my opinion. That is all I wanted to say.


I also agree that MV/GG offers more processing power by far than Ace, but still, it can be done even in Ace and with real collisions if it is done right. My mini-game uses real pixel collision, and it stays on 60 FPS most of the time, for example. That is if I use the stand-alone scene version. If I use the on-map version, the FPS caps at around 40, which is why I wrote that a stand-alone scene would be the best solution (at least for a real collision based system).
 

MeowFace

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Whoa, both of you! I don't know what has happened between you two, I imagine not every person gets along with everyone else here, but personally I have no problem with neither you @Sixth or you @MeowFace. So can I please stay out of this? :rswt:
lol, no worries about that, the main reason for the ignore list is he's been trying to pick a fight with flaming speeches everywhere he goes. when i don't like it, i simply ignore it. ignore list remove his post completely from my view so.. yeah, i don't even know what he post. no where i am going to join the fight. lol!

I am not sure why he thinks pixel collision is the solution to a shooter game.

Pixel based collision cost a lot more in processing power than hit box collision (which most shooter game uses). it's almost the same suggestion as your put 20 events on the screen to create a certain "collision point". so a picture taking up say.. 200 pixels will end up with 200 calculation process. So using that in VXA that doesn't support GPU only reduce the processing power more and not helping at all. Even outline based collision is far better than pixel based.

I am not sure what KHAS is doing with his ABS, but normal "collision" for a tile based movement is actually precisely on the centre of the character that moves on the +-32 pixel basis. That's why i said there's limit building a shooter game using the tile movement. Even when you change that to pixel movement on 1 pixel based, the collision without a hit box means the bullet will only collide when the centre of the bullet collide with the centre of the character. Making a character extremely hard to get hit. (imaging 1x1 pixel bullet trying to hit a 1x1 pixel character on the screen ;) )

A hit box however allow you to make "area" collision that you can adjust so as long as the hit box is smaller than the graphic itself, it should work fine. Having a hit box larger than the graphic will mean the "hit area" can be somewhere outside of the graphic, making it a bad collision when it comes to "dodging" bullets.

Yup, Unity can do just about anything depending on the scripts you use(i am using it for shape recognition and motion tracing). But same goes to the rgss player actually. Like i said before, you can actually build 3D games inside RM ;) but the processing power limit simply makes it a lag system. Do able, just laggy. :p Remember, rgss player is ruby based, anything ruby can do rgss player can reproduce it on the screen. ;) And not restricted to gaming, you can even turn it into a rss feed reader to view news/videos online. :p Well.. too bad on the process limit, but it's a lot more powerful if we ditch the basic system and rewrote a full new engine to it.

But for someone who's dependant on custom script, they don't and will not know how to remove the old engine and replace it with a new one unless they actually learn the whole rgss thing. So when they want something outside of the default scope, they will have to ADD to it without actually removing the old system that they no longer need. Sometimes ended up running 2 or more "engines" in a single game. That's why ABS system is still relying on the event on screen and not a full overwrite to add time-line based enemies. User friendliness and resource re-usability is another limit on the custom scripts. That helps reduce lag. But for a script writer that doesn't plan far ahead before making a script, he/she will be writing you a full new engine running outside of the default one. So yup, double processing. ;)

But we are the developers, it's our job to manipulate the players to look at where we want them to and build up a restricted perspective point to prevent them from wandering out of the frame. The difference between Shepherd and Sheeple ;)

What Undertale is doing is a good example. It's actually not using any new mechanics, not even using any good new style graphics. But it gets the attention of its player and find a way to make them spread the words. In the old games, we have something like "Charm", "Cause Fear". And the enemy will run away (escape) from battle when inflicted by one of those skill. In Undertale, they change that to act/diplomatic skill. Doing the same stuffs, just on a different point of perspective view. An end user without game dev experiences will think it's a new system, and when a human found "something" new, he/she can't wait to tell the world about it. So.. manipulation success! :p (Remember, if someone really invented a new game system outside of the existing ones, they are entitled for the nobel prize reward ;) )

So... If you have a marketing team as good as that, then it really doesn't matter about the quality or even contents of the game. Crowd manipulating is the key to success. This "game" below is in the list of the "Legendary" games back in the age of NEC98(floppy disks games):




Looking at it now makes you wonder why right? lol! But back then, it's something "new". ;)

Then there are dev teams who want to give their player their best shot. Putting tons of love into the games they made. Those games last till nowadays. So it's really up to a dev team to decide what they want and how they want it. There are still teams making games outside of the 2 years contract budget frame, rare but still exist. But most only look forward for a 2 year sales because that what most publisher wants and how they sign their contracts. Making something outside this puts the company at high risk of lost. So unless there's a lot of love, they will not go for such option.

Not only the published type games you know? Good examples of successful doujin games will be: (both ain't RM based though)

[1] Aquaria (2 man + 1 hired voice actress dev team, IGF award 2007)

[2] Recettear (Doujin circle, 1st Japanese Doujin game that made it into Stream, and the main reason for western publisher to start noticing the possibility of doujin games which pushes the doujin game boom to its peak)
 
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_Shadow_

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"but adding in a pixel movement and an ABS script will impact performance even with Effectus."

Yes. That is actually correct. It is possible to have fps drops even with Effectus sometimes.

That is why the dev should be careful. It is always possible to drop the frames.

Yes the way I suggested IS clumsy. If the user wants to make something in an elegant way, ruby scripts is the only way for Ace.

If you can share with the OP how to make it work right and where to get some scripts to make things work, that would be nice.

@Meow Face, @Sixth is right on that one. I mean Undertale has bullets, tears, muscle hands, swords that move around and you have for instance to avoid them. Imagine a frame 128x32. Now imagine a sword in the middle of it. Imagine now a user avoiding the sword, but being hit by the "air" around the sword. That would be a BAD game! I mean AVGN always rant about bad collision detection and it is fundamental on an Undertale game. :p

Well Ace is in C++ I suppose and it runs Ruby inside it. No wonder why it is SO slow.

Undertale's game system IS new. It is made with the same ingredients other games are made all right, but its a new recipie. It is really an innovation.

As for that game, I had no idea it exists. I suddenly wanna see Full Metal Alchemist's Armstrong's funny scenes. Again!

And now I will flex so hard I will get out of the fourum.
 

Sixth

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lol, no worries about that, the main reason for the ignore list is he's been trying to pick a fight with flaming speeches everywhere he goes. when i don't like it, i simply ignore it. ignore list remove his post completely from my view so.. yeah, i don't even know what he post. no where i am going to join the fight. lol!
Yeah, right. Please direct me to just one of these supposedly "flaming speeches" I wrote. I am curious...
And if you want to ignore me, fine, do it. But don't just tell that you ignore me, while in reality, you don't.


You spread your bull about me everywhere we "meet" (which shows that you did NOT ignore me) without ever telling me what's your problem with me. Very mature.


I am not the one calling others "trolls" and other names. And I am certainly NOT the one who started this conversation here. Facts.

I am not sure why he thinks pixel collision is the solution to a shooter game.


Pixel based collision cost a lot more in processing power than hit box collision (which most shooter game uses). it's almost the same suggestion as your put 20 events on the screen to create a certain "collision point". so a picture taking up say.. 200 pixels will end up with 200 calculation process. So using that in VXA that doesn't support GPU only reduce the processing power more and not helping at all. Even outline based collision is far better than pixel based.
And yet you did NOT try it in Ace. Ever. Or if you did, how about showing it?
I am not sure what that perfect collision system does which I use (Cidiomar made it, it uses a dll, and I never checked that one), but it works, and it works in a very accurate way (seemingly pixel based) without destroying the game's performance (60 FPS on my laptop which is far from being "good" compared to the trend nowadays).


Try to use a hitbox system you mentioned with a rotating sword image, see if it works or not...


Does it matter how we call it? Pixel based, outline based, etc... The point is, "Bullet Hell" requires very accurate collisions, unless you want to get a bunch of complaining players on your back.


And I am NOT writing these to pick a fight. I am pointing out some things I think I need to point out.
 

Shaz

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This is not the place to have an argument. Back to topic, or stay out of the thread. Everyone.
 

MeowFace

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This is not the place to have an argument. Back to topic, or stay out of the thread. Everyone.
It's actually on the topic of the OP's question about:

Is There Even Any Way To Make A Bullet Hell Inside A Battle?
or are we off topic explaining the gimmick of a shooter game and why it's not wise to use one?

Imagine a frame 128x32. Now imagine a sword in the middle of it. Imagine now a user avoiding the sword, but being hit by the "air" around the sword. That would be a BAD game! I mean AVGN always rant about bad collision detection and it is fundamental on an Undertale game. :p
Yup, bad collision on a shooter game = the death of it.

Actually, not only in a shooter, but in arcade fighter, platform games or even the action rpgs.

No matter if it's 3D or 2D.

That's why hit boxes should be smaller than the objects.



It's also a well known "cheat" among those "best arcade players".

Know where the hit boxes are = able to dodge effectively. 



I've not seen any 3D games that uses the exact pixel collision yet(rendered movies with real polygon surface detect on physical engine yes, real time render no), don't think any home machine is powerful enough to deal with it yet. Outline collision can be seen in some high spec required games. But up to date, hit boxes is still the best solution to performance saving.

I believe you can easily tell which one needs the least math process in the collision types below ;)



This effect performance directly.

And oh, in some shooter games, the projectile by player actually has bigger hit box than enemy's projectile, even when they are using the exact same graphic. ;)

But for most ABS we see in VXA, they are using the default tile based collision, the actual X Y used is 32x32 tile based coordinates. So unless you overwrite that part, normal ABS that uses this coordinate is stuck with the 32x32 box if they want to use the events as enemies on the map. Well.. 32x32 box that acts as a single dot of pixel to be precise. The battle system itself is tuned to fit the tile base collision of the default RM engine even though the concept is of those shooter/arcade games. They simply work differently on math but still kind of work effectively in a way to achieve action battle on screen. ;) The problem with it is, when an object is on the move outside of the 32x32 tile made an collision with another object on the move. Player will get a feel that the collision is "off" when the object "slide" into it's tile position during the collision.

Some ABS uses the true x y of the events and add a hit box to it(yes character objects has 2 types of x y coordinates in VXA). This actually works closer to what a real shooter game is doing. The only difference is the events are preloaded, not time-line based. So depending on how you implement your "anti-lag" or "off-screen event process" script, it can cause lag or turn out smooth. ;) Especially on how you deal with the off-screen bullets and bullet generation on events on screen. (limiter is still needed here)
 

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If Khas ABS is limited to 32x32 boxes, I am afraid I can't help anymore. But I don't wanna serach to see what is going on, especially when we haven't heard from the OP.

I the OP does not care to reply, well I am sorry but neither do I.
Let me sum up my questions for him again.

I suggest we should wait for a reply.

So, @mrlavender9999 do you own MV or GG Maker?

Are you planning to buy any of these?

Or shall we stick with the Ace scenarios? I

mean, it would be good to hear from you too, so we can focus on the best options you might have available.
 

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