VX ACE or MV for a Mystery Dungeon / Elona+ Game? + Questions

Discussion in 'Product Discussion and Support' started by ophaq, Sep 12, 2019.

  1. ophaq

    ophaq Villager Member

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    My main goal is to create a really big & complex roguelike that functions like Elona+ / Mystery Dungeon. It's going to have many spells with specific effects, unidentified item system, summoning / pet system, relationship system, crafting skills, a ton of different variables that influence stats, etc.

    This guy did something close what I wanted to achieve but mine would be more complex.


    I just got MV on sale but I also saw that VX ACE is on sale for $13 as well on humble bundle and ends in like 17 hours as of this post. I've been looking around for trying to find as many scripts as I can for specific mechanics since I don't know much about programming. MV has some really good features like bigger resolutions and bigger tiles and it's in javascript. But it also has way less scripts than VX Ace and I've been finding hardly any methods to implement them for MV.

    Graphically, I'm fine with 16x16 or 32x32. 48x48 is nice but not exactly necessary as I mainly just want really detailed systems. I will also be making the game at a 16:9 - 1920x1080 as an option so there will be really big maps. Performance wise, I feel like MV might be a better choice if it's going to be a huge game but I've read that VX Ace performs good too but it's just more CPU intensive. I don't think it will matter if it's a roguelike system anyway except for processing all enemy actions on the loaded map.

    For things like custom menus, they are slightly more available for VX Ace but still hard to find for what I want to achieve. But I'm at an impasse on what I should learn first to accomplish my project. Ruby seems less time consuming than Java to learn if I need to learn it at all with the scripts in VX Ace. With MV though I will most likely end up having to learn some detailed Javascript to accomplish custom features. I've even found a few good VX Ace dungeon generation scripts where MV kind of lacks good tutorials or scripts for.

    A few other questions I have are:

    1. In regards to scripts, do people still develop VX Ace scripts / are they even as active compared to MV's script community?

    2. Is there an equivalent to YEP scripts for VX Ace like MV's?

    3. Can I use 48x48 sized graphics. I don't mind having a 32x32 grid but graphically, can it be bigger & more detailed? I have some 48x48 resources I want to use for spells and the player model which operate on 48x48.
     
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  2. bgillisp

    bgillisp Global Moderators Global Mod

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    Well for starters, if you want 1980 x 1020 MV is the only choice. None of the others can go beyond 640 x 480.
     
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  3. ophaq

    ophaq Villager Member

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    Not even with scripts? Dang.
     
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  4. Engr. Adiktuzmiko

    Engr. Adiktuzmiko Chemical Engineer, Game Developer, Using BlinkBoy' Veteran

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    1) Yes but not so much

    2) Yes, yanfly has scripts since XP at least afaik

    3) Sprites can be of any size as long as the format is correct

    Anyway, if you want native 1080p, MV is the only one with native support. For Ace, you need to get the RGD to do that. Take note though to make sure that 1080 is divisible by the grid size else it can lead to graphical glitches.
     
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  5. bgillisp

    bgillisp Global Moderators Global Mod

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    Nope, it is hard coded into the .dll, and anything that is hardcoded in the .dll that ACE uses cannot be changed with scripts at all unless someone writes a new .dll which will then probably break every script out there.

    There is a project to try to replace the DLL with one that does it through directx and does allow for resizing of the screen, but that is in Beta. You'd be taking a chance if you did try it as the project might never finish. And many scripts might not work with it either. So it would be a gamble.

    Or you can just use 640 x 480, it upsizes pretty nicely I find. It's a 4:3 resolution so you'll have some black bars on the side though, but *most* don't care too much about that (but those that do really care about them, so be careful).
     
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  6. ophaq

    ophaq Villager Member

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    Thanks for the info!

    1.) Is there a place I can download all the YanFly Core scripts like YEP's bundle of core scripts or are they all separate?

    2.) So with RGD I will be able to accomplish 1080 or something at least around the same size? I'm fine with upscaling as long as I can use higher quality graphics than 32x32.

    3.) How would I implement a 48x48 tileset into VX Ace format? Like an animation tileset that is 480 x 96.

    Thanks that sounds like trouble but if it's 4:3 I think I'd be fine with it. Something like 1856×1392 would adhere to that ratio. I would just need to figure out how to get a tileset based off of 48x48 graphics in the proper format. Would you know of any guides to do that?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 12, 2019
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  7. NinjaKittyProductions

    NinjaKittyProductions Professional Murder Hobos Veteran

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  8. ophaq

    ophaq Villager Member

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    Thanks, but I had that for MV already. I decided to use VX Ace for my project due to more resources being available script wise and easier to learn Ruby language.

    With that said, is there a collection for yanfly core scripts for VX Ace?
     
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  9. TheoAllen

    TheoAllen Self-proclaimed jack of all trades Veteran

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    There's a script to force it beyond 480p without changing the DLL or even Game.exe, but the performance is worse than MV with the same screen size. There's also one that replaces the Game.exe (RGD) to allow you to go beyond 480p with slightly better performance, but the last time I tried it was still in beta and probably has some graphical glitches.

    Edit:
    Do note that I once tried RGD in 720p size and the frame rate wasn't as smooth as I expected. Really if you really want 1080p that bad, just use MV

    Side note:
    If you force your game to be 1080p, people like me who use laptop screen (768p) won't be able to play your game.


    Yes, try to search "Yanfly RGSS3" or something (I'm too lazy to link the site)

    Hard to do since Tilemap class is hidden. You might as well as just choose MV.
     
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  10. ophaq

    ophaq Villager Member

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    Thanks for the advice!

    I will still use VX Ace though and try that first because it has way, way more scripts that will allow me to do what I want with little programming compared to MV which will make my head explode. Especially because it's lacking in scripts of specific features I want.

    I don't mind not being able to run the game at 1080p either, as long as the window can be upscaled that's cool.

    For the graphics, I'll just need to find a way to implement 48x48 or downsize and re-adjust the placeholder graphics for my needs. The end graphics will most likely be simple instead of highly detailed anyway for the sake of less blurring and a cleaner look.
     
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  11. Engr. Adiktuzmiko

    Engr. Adiktuzmiko Chemical Engineer, Game Developer, Using BlinkBoy' Veteran

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    For tilesets, either you do your maps via parallax mapping, or fit your 48x48 tiles into the Ace sized tilesheets but that would mean each of your objects will take more tile space (if you dont resize)

    I agree with Theo on the screen problem, forcing a 1080p resolution would mean everyone who dont have a 1080p creen wont be able to play your game, thus limiting your audience...

    Also, 1080p would mean that your visible map will be big which also impacts the performance of the game, especially if you put a lot of events in there since a lot of them would be visible and thus get updated every update, which has considerable impact on performance.

    RGD for Ace seems to work fine in my 720p trials, but yeah its still in beta so some problems are still abound.
     
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  12. ophaq

    ophaq Villager Member

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    Yeah I agree. And depending on the graphics, you really don't need it 1080 in my opinion. If I settled for an upscaled fullscreen with simple graphics or the highest resolution that would fit in a 1920x1080p 16:9 monitor but at a 720p 4:3 ratio, it wouldn't impact performance and would be less of a headache. The main reason I mentioned 1080 is due to it being the norm in a lot of games today but I also didn't know you could upscale the graphics to fit the screen better.

    I also just found out that I can use something like ragnarok online graphics for the character sprite in 32x32 bit with a double tile sprite. I'm not sure how to implement that, but if it's possible to do that in 32x32 then I'll work with that lol. I was thinking of doing something graphically like ragnarok anyway but maybe a bit more simplified so it doesn't compress or blow out and blur graphics as bad if it upscaled a lot.
     
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  13. Engr. Adiktuzmiko

    Engr. Adiktuzmiko Chemical Engineer, Game Developer, Using BlinkBoy' Veteran

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    For sprites, you can use any size as long as you follow the cell/frame formatting correctly, no need for any extra stuff.. For example, we have tall sprites for Ace that are twice the height (so each cell is actually 32x64, while the game grid itself is still 32x32).
     
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  14. ophaq

    ophaq Villager Member

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    Right.

    Also, thanks for mentioning parallax mapping. It looks really useful but a ton more work, haha. I don't know how well that would play with randomized dungeon parts either unless theyre made where nothing is cut off at the edges of the maps and all of the tiles would have to blend with each other. Since I'm also going to implement destructible walls, using a tile set with more simplified graphics would be more optimal.

    There is a way to change a sprite's image when a specific action is done to it through events right? I was thinking of a mining system where some dungeons are made of dirt walls that can only be mined with a tool and then transform into a cracked wall when they're almost about to break.
     
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