What are the advantages of RM2k3?

[Sieginder Niederlage]

You know, I want to buy RM2k3. Badly. I have some nice memories of games made with it.
Aaaand disturbing ones (that I regard fondly all the same) because of Yume Nikki and OFF. Mostly Yume Nikki.

But you know? Things have moved pretty nicely. The way RM works now is very different. I mean, it's insane how much it's changed, even if some people don't notice.

And now we get an official release of RM2k3 here. You could do that with MOTHER 3, you know Nintendo? 
And I checked a bit and it says that it's been upgraded.

But listen, the eventing system could make things that worked like scripts, right? How? Is it simple?

I'd buy RM2k3 out of sheer nostalgia. But the cold, logical part of my brain says "Don't be dumb.What's the point of a thing like that if it's not as good as the one you have right now?"

So, what are the things that make RM2k3 good? Did the eventing get changed from how was to something better?

What things make RM2k3 SO good that they decided to bring it here?
 

 

[EternalShadow]

I think you forgot a bit of sentence there

 

[Sieginder Niederlage]

I think you forgot a bit of sentence there

Sorry. I typed the ENTER key accidentally.

I just finished putting the rest up

 

[Rezca]

For me, a large part of it was the HUGE amount of default RTP monsters/battlers. Everything imagineable was there - RPG staples like your typical dragon, skeletons, goblins...  To Myths and Legends like Fenrir, the Midgard Serpent, Quetzalcoatl, and my personal favorite the sea serpent Leviathan... To mundane creatures like Crocodiles and similar... And everything else you could imagine.  Later makers had a fraction of the amount of creatures here, sure they were detailed but there was much less to pick from.

So, if you do own 2k3 you can use these in other makers you also own!

The Side-view battle by default was a plus for me as well, but not everyone would agree ;P

The main downside to 2k3 compared to later makers is the lack of accessible scripting. Clever eventers can do quite a bit even so, but it's the only real drawback to it I can think of right off the top of my head.

 

[Felix Trapper]

To  me, the main appeal of the older engines has always been stylistic. RM2k3 is the easiest way to make a game look like an authentic SNES era RPG. 

 

[Sieginder Niederlage]

Wait a sec. I heard that RMVXAce's steam version needs to be online all the time. Is this the same for RM2k3?

 

[Andar]

Wait a sec. I heard that RMVXAce's steam version needs to be online all the time. Is this the same for RM2k3?

Since that is wrong (Steam-Ace works fine in offline mode), you can assume that it's wrong for RM2K3 as well...

 

[Ralpf]

Wait a sec. I heard that RMVXAce's steam version needs to be online all the time. Is this the same for RM2k3?

That's not true for XVAce and and 2K3 should work in offline mode too, you will likely need to have Steam online the first time you launch the program, but after that it doesn't matter.

 

[MikePjr]

The main advantage really is, a side view battle system in place without the need to script. Also, making 16bit graphics can be a LOT easier than making higher rez graphics like in the newer one.

I am hoping that the next RPG Maker has an option for lower scale graphics... in the 16 x 16 range of things rather than being stuck with the 32 x 32 range of things.

The disadvantages for me are...

1. The colors are limited to 256 per image.

2. You can't animate monsters

3. No audio loop points for MP3s(only midis)

4. No scripting options

5. You can't get rid of ATB and just go turn based(i don't like making games with ATBs)

I think there are a few more but those were the disadvantages right off the top of my head.

 

[Felix Trapper]

The main advantage really is, a side view battle system in place without the need to script. Also, making 16bit graphics can be a LOT easier than making higher rez graphics like in the newer one.

I am hoping that the next RPG Maker has an option for lower scale graphics... in the 16 x 16 range of things rather than being stuck with the 32 x 32 range of things.

The disadvantages for me are...

1. The colors are limited to 256 per image.

2. You can't animate monsters

3. No audio loop points for MP3s(only midis)

4. No scripting options

5. You can't get rid of ATB and just go turn based(i don't like making games with ATBs)

I think there are a few more but those were the disadvantages right off the top of my head.

That's a great list, but the question was what are the advantages. =)

 

[Milennin]

One of the main advantages, in my opinion, is the extra mapping layer RPG Maker 2003 has over VXA.

The disadvantages for me are...


1. The colors are limited to 256 per image.


2. You can't animate monsters


3. No audio loop points for MP3s(only midis)


4. No scripting options


5. You can't get rid of ATB and just go turn based(i don't like making games with ATBs)


I think there are a few more but those were the disadvantages right off the top of my head.

 
1. I think the colour limit only helps with creating the feel of an old school RPG. Besides, with the lower resolution RPG Maker 2003 runs in, it's less of an issue than it would've been in VXA.


2. If/when a DynRPG is developed for this version of RPG Maker that should no longer be a disadvantage.


3. I guess.


4. See point 2.


5. See point 4.

 

[Iavra]

I don't know if i am allowed to post links, because the game was obviously created with the illegal version of RM2k (not even 2k3, iirc), but german developer Lachsen once started a game called "Velsarbor". You can find Let's Plays on youtube (in german, obviously) and see what he managed to do with events only. The game was in development for about 8 years, but sadly never got finished.

 

[Marston]

I don't know if i am allowed to post links, because the game was obviously created with the illegal version of RM2k (not even 2k3, iirc), but german developer Lachsen once started a game called "Velsarbor". You can find Let's Plays on youtube (in german, obviously) and see what he managed to do with events only. The game was in development for about 8 years, but sadly never got finished.

It's also canceled by now. But yeah, Velsarbor is probably one of the most technically advanced games that were ever created. I've also seen Tactical RPGs, Jump'n'Runs, Shoot'em'Ups and other stuff, it's possible but definitly harder to do with the older maker.

 

[King Arthur]

Off the top of my head, other genres of games that have been made with RM2K(3) include full-fledged card games (Deus Cards being the chief example), pixel-movement sidescrollers, two-player tactical RPGs, strategy RPGs such as Aurora Wing (think Fire Emblem and Advance Wars, for those unfamiliar with sRPGs), and multi-ending visual novel/RPG hybrids (most famous of which is Romancing Walker).

All that and more without any need for scripting. RM2K and RM2K3 are truly extremely powerful engines where the only limit is your creativity. RPG Maker 2000 and 2003 are known as legendary and still beloved by long-time RM veterans for a very good reason.

 

[- Aërendyll -]

Some of the advantages I know of:
 
- Faster event command processing (less lag in-game).
- More tutorials and flexibility with eventing in general.
- Allows 16x16 tiles, which is nice if you prefer a lower resolution/more retro look for your games.
- Large amount of sideview battle enemy graphics.
- Sideview ATB battle system is default, though your mileage may vary on this one. (I figure you can make empty animation sets for in-battle party sprites if you prefer front-view?)

There's also plenty of interesting story-driven/horror/weird games out there, which were made using either RM2k or RM2k3 (since they don't use the battle system, there's not all that much of a difference).

RM2k examples: Ib, Mimicry Man

RM2k3 examples: Yume Nikki, Desert Nightmare, Taut, Melon Journey
 

5. You can't get rid of ATB and just go turn based(i don't like making games with ATBs)

 
Depending on how much work you're willing to do, there's people out there who have made extensive tutorials on how to make an evented battle system from scratch or some even have a download link to a template project with custom battle systems in them. There's an absolutely huge amount of resources available for RM2k3 users, (since the engine has been popular for longer than RMXP has even been around) which includes downloadable event systems and expansive tutorials. Making custom battle systems takes patience and hard work, however.

NOTE: This does not mean that it takes the 2k3 battle system out of your project - it simply means you won't use it and instead use maps with events in them that handle battles instead.

 

[MikePjr]

That's a great list, but the question was what are the advantages. =)

I did go over the advantage... side view battle without scripting.. THAT is pretty much the only one in my mind. So i decided to go over the non advantages myself.

 

[Necromus]

It's also canceled by now. But yeah, Velsarbor is probably one of the most technically advanced games that were ever created. I've also seen Tactical RPGs, Jump'n'Runs, Shoot'em'Ups and other stuff, it's possible but definitly harder to do with the older maker.

I wouldn't say harder, just less convenient. Having done a sideview battle system and custom menus in both 2k3 and Ace, knowing hot to script is definitely faster and just feels smoother, but you need to know what you're doing in both cases.

Velsarbor wasn't just great beacause of its technical design, but also due to the awseome visuals, everything was just really smooth and polished. So far I honestly haven't seen a single commercial RPG Maker game aside from to the moon (which lacks the technical side) that comes even close to Velsabor.

 

[Razelle]

Surprised no one said how much easier it is to make characters and tiles for it, since they're so much smaller. They get blown up once they are inside the editor and in-game. This captures that retro feeling perfectly, and is definitely a reason people still use it today.

I'm tempted to do so myself if only to see how robust the eventing is. I wouldn't use the default battle mechanics either since the wait time in between attacks in an ATB system make me sad.

 

[Ksi]

The main advantage really is, a side view battle system in place without the need to script. Also, making 16bit graphics can be a LOT easier than making higher rez graphics like in the newer one.

I am hoping that the next RPG Maker has an option for lower scale graphics... in the 16 x 16 range of things rather than being stuck with the 32 x 32 range of things.

The disadvantages for me are...

1. The colors are limited to 256 per image.

2. You can't animate monsters

3. No audio loop points for MP3s(only midis)

4. No scripting options

5. You can't get rid of ATB and just go turn based(i don't like making games with ATBs)

I think there are a few more but those were the disadvantages right off the top of my head.

I animated monsters. Just took a bit of creative thinking and eventing. ^.^ I used battle animations~

When you're dealing with 8-bit games, you don't really need more colours. ;p

That said, it's still a great little engine.

 

[Erika Fuzzbottom]

The only real advantage is that it has a side-view battle system built in.

For me, though, it goes beyond that.  RM2k3 appeals to me because it's not as powerful.  I know that sounds weird, but the modern RPGMs intimidate me, largely due to the Ruby scripting system.  I know you don't have to use the scripting system, but it's pretty much the only way your game can get noticed.

RM2k3 doesn't have that.  The only way you're making anything is with the basic point-and-click system.  But that just means I gotta get more creative if I want to make something special, and I like the challenge.  RPG Maker 1 on the PS1 is one of my favorites for that very same reason.  Heck, I've only ever finished making one game, and it was a collect-a-thon on RPGM1.  I had fun pushing the limited system to create something that it wasn't supposed to create.

So hopefully with less pressure to create something FF-quality on RM2k3, I'll actually wind up making something again.