What are you tired of seeing in RPG Maker games?

[ain]

Title essentially explains it. 


I am wondering what people always use/do in their creations that just irks you & can ruin the playing experience for you. 

 

[lolshtar]

Default battle system,


MP and TP doing the same thing,


boring skills,


imitating a combat system instead of being original,


2+ seconds to do a normal skill,


items use in every single game,


guard command no one ever uses properly,


too many encounters,


useless HUDs.


1) Do you dislike the default battle system because you are just totally tired of it, or does it have inherent flaws? 


It is badly flawed due to how uninspired it is. Maybe seeing it too many times also changed my point of view that is true. I cringe everytime I see a game using the default system with default enemies with the commands "Attack" "Special" "Guard" "Item". You're better off not doing a combat system at all.


2) So you want the MP & TP to do entirely different things? e.g MP for more magic-based skills & maybe TP for Faith-Based skilled


Using and MP and TP for skills even if different is doing the same thing, be creative, there are plenty of things you can do it with. Else you're better not using it at all as it's another resource for another set of skills. You want simplicity, not complication, you're not forced to use everything the default system offers.


3) "2+ seconds to do a normal skill" Can you explain this please? 


If the time between pressing the skill and finishing it so you can act again is longer than 2 seconds, then it will be a skill players will be annoyed to use after a while. The same applies for enemies. You don't want enemies skills that takes this time to do. In my game, I don't think I have a skill that lasts longer than 1 sec.


4) "Items use in every single game" Are you saying you want a game that doesn't use items? Or you want a game with more specific uses for items?


I'm tired of the usual full revive and 99x potion that save people asses everytime without any strategy at all. "Oh the enemy killed my allies because I spammed attack, better use that full revive so I can fulltime spamming attack again!" Again, just be creative if you're going to use it, just don't put it there because the default system told you so because there's an item command.

 

[Dalph]

Human characters.


Really, I had enough. There are many animals\robots\mythological creatures out there, it doesn't take much to come up with an interesting and unique race. Mass Effect did this very well.

 

[Srpg]

I'm not a big fan when it comes to commercial games using 100% RTP and nothing customs in them. The default BS is also a let down for me when trying their demos or taking a look a youtube previews. Even if the story gets a good rating, my preferences go for a Custom Battle System/Menus and at least some new graphical assets before purchasing any rpg maker game. Custom Characters portraits also go into my list since I not a fan of the auto character generator or any portraits taken from the RTP. I prefer diversity in a game that does not contain already-seen assets/systems found on other games. So far, I've not been very impressed by the list of commercial games that has been released since XP - those that I enjoyed are Alpha Kimori and Echoes of Aetheria for the moment.


The one that has piked my interest for this year is definitely Arcadian Atlas which is a tactical rpg and it is nice to see something fresh in the rpg maker horizons.

 

[Wavelength]

A damn good list from @Fisherolol.


In addition to pretty much everything he said:

• Releasing a game in a language the writer/editor clearly was not familiar with
  
• Scrolling Text intros
  
• Use of default maps, classes, enemies, skills, or items
  
• Heavy use of "cutscenes" that are almost entirely text with little animation or movement
  
• Gear treadmills (that is, needing to upgrade equipment to the next tier at every town I visit)
  
• Horror-genre tropes and themes
  
• The overuse of Yanfly's excellent scripts (particularly in VX Ace where they were less flexible)
  
• "Pile of Stats" enemies (in fairness I guess this is moreso the underuse of creative troop/enemy design)
  
• Boss Enemies at the end of every dungeon
  
• Characters that start with zero or one skills
  

 

[Helladen]

Copying other game designers rather than making your own style of game. That is both your own and not a blantant clone of another game. Clones are bad everywhere, it is hard to be original anymore and requires a thick attention to detail.

 

[Warpmind]

Skipping proofreading/substituting Autocorrect for actual proofreading is a pain... I still recall coming across a game where the sewers reeked with that "sceptic smell"...
Poor sense of dramatic timing/gross mishandling of dramatic tools - a jumpscare when you're not expecting it can be effective, but a jumpscare for the sake of a jumpscare is just sloppy and poorly thought out. Horror tropes and themes can be fine, so long as it's done thoroughly and thoughtfully. (A single locked door in a haunted house, for example, is going to creep out the player more and more the longer it stays locked...)
Sloppy copying of combat systems - if your idea for a combat system is just a carbon copy of some other system, don't bother. If you're not going to do anything innovative by yourself, you might as well use the engine default, or one of the available scripts with default settings.
Shameless fetch quests that don't offer anything relative to the narrative, whether the main plot, subplots or character development.

Frankly, a game made with the default menus and battle system can be perfectly fine, so long as it's done well. Learn how the system works and WHY it works, and you're off to a better start than you might think.

 

[stupid enough to like FF13]

Squished text. Especially with the default font. It looks terribly amateurish. Even more so when it's a six-letter name next to a barely-legible thirty-letter name.


Also, menus or even battle screens where it's obvious that the creator put more emphasis on showing off their pretty art than making windows that look good and function adequately.

 

[Chorvaqueen]

Fangames hastily made for the sake of bandwagon. Plus points if they're entirely made in RTP and the main characters look like a sprite hack job. 

 

[Makio-Kuta]

Feature creep.


Houses that are either way too big on the inside or have a shape that defies logic on the outside.


Mix and matching graphic styles that don't work together.


Young hot blooded male protagonist, meek childhood friend female mage/healer, third wheel male tank character combination from snoozeville. And just uninspired characters all around. Is it so hard to get some creative character dynamics up in here?


Horrifying screen tints and over the top lighting.


the rampent denial that any of the above things (and some things other people mentioned) are wrong.

 

[Matseb2611]

Adding some more. Most of mine are to do with story and world-building.


- Humble beginnings. The main character is always a farmboy or some other underdog from a simple background taking on an enemy far superior to them in every way.


- Evil empire vs noble rebels, elves, mages, or some other oppressed faction that is objectively good and has no bad qualities.


- The main antagonist being the main protagonist's dark mirror, i.e. exactly identical in origin, personality, and fighting style, except fighting for evil. Ok, it's interesting to see this every now and again, but this is way overdone now.


- A game that tries to emulate the old Final Fantasy and Dragon Warrior/Quest games to the letter, as in with all the problems and inconveniences that came with it because of nostalgia, such as excessive grinding, illogical dungeon designs, illogical enemies, bosses that are immune to every status, bosses whose strengths and weaknesses you have no way of knowing or logically predicting upon first try, and so on.


- Slimes, rats, bees, and spiders as the first dungeon's main enemies. Please, let's use a bit of originality.

 

[Mega Man Volnutt]

1. Default battler templates


2. Meme usages


3. Front view battle


4. "Hey guys I'm gonna release my 5% complete game hope you like it guys" (I know, I fell victim to that but I already explained my reasoning to that...)


5. Trying to copy Aio Oni and IB.


6. "Hi, my name is (Your name here) The warrior"


7. Default menus

 

[Kyuukon]

Cliche, non-realistic stories.

 

[AwesomeCool]

Fantasy Races following the same patterns every time.


EX:


Elves are almost always oppressed in some way (and generally slaves).  Also, almost always peace loving and bow + magic users.


Dwarfs are isolationists and want nothing to do with the other races.  Also, this race is bad with magic, but good with technology (every time).


Humans are the strongest current empire and almost always mistreat all the other races (generally for some bland humans are naturally evil reason).


Half-Elfs are always hated more then any other being in existence.


half-dwarfs do no exist... ...ever.


Dragons are always said to be incredibly smart and wise (although they almost never show any of these characteristics) and tend to be incredibly selfish and not care about current events (and tough).


Some god-like race that looks almost exactly like one of the other races (if shown), but way more powerful and more technological advanced (till some unnamed catastrophic event left only ruins which always happen to be the most essential part of the main plot).


All other races end up being pure evil monsters with very little intelligence (goblins, orcs, etc).\


Finally, Original races do not exist due to fear that the plot could be to innovative and stick out to much (meaning that expectations might make people except it to be a good story).


The funniest thing is that if one of these things are true, almost all of the rest are also true.  Plus the ones that do not follow this pattern get more popularity (due to people talking about it) for this reason alone, yet most indie devs still stick with copying older works with only one twist added (which makes them forgotten about like a generic WWII shooter, MMO, or Moba in there prime era).  

 

[Euphony]

items use in every single game,


guard command no one ever uses properly,

Can you expand on these? Like...you don't like items being used, period? And how does one misuse the guard command? I'm curious what you mean exactly.


Ditto to pretty much everything @Makio-Kuta listed. Especially the hodgepodge of graphic styles. That always bugs me when I see it, and it's pretty common. Yes, it's fun to gather resources from various artists/sources, but take a little extra time to get them to match. Sometimes just adjusting the colors can make a world of difference for consistency.

 

[Little Adventurer]

Flat characters, particularly the flat protagonist. I know the point of those is "You're supposed to project yourself into them! They're YOU! You think up your own personality for them!"


...I've never been able to do that. If the character has no personality, if they never react to anything or say anything, then why should I care about their plight? It just seems lazy to me, since the designer puts so much more effort into the rest of the cast, that the main character having no personality sticks out like a sore thumb. When it's done with the villain, they're not seen as a threat. When it's done with a love interest, they're seen as vapid and shallow. But the protagonist is A-OK?! What's wrong with having the main protagonist having a personality? Why shouldn't he grow and change like the rest of them?


Hypothetical example: You play as character A. Character A is flat and emotionless, unless you project yourself onto them and give them a personality yourself blah blah blah. Character A, for plot purposes, falls for Character B. The problem is, the player doesn't really like Character B as a person for whatever reason (outside of character not as the protagonist) and wishes to either remain single or get together with Character C or whatever (who may or may not feel the same). However, unfortunately, Character A is forced to get together with Character B and there are no other options to deny their love (or if there is an option to say that they don't love them then it changes practically nothing in the end). Considering that Character A is supposed to be the player, that means that the player is being forced into something they don't want to do, but must anyway, because they have no choice and it feels harsher and more personal since Character A is supposed to be them.


Whereas if Character A had a personality... sure it's still bad for the player personally, but it feels less so since it's not YOU being forced into it, just your character. You can still connect with a character even if they have a personality, perhaps even moreso if they've gone through similar life experiences that the player has gone through as well, such as they were bullied and worked through it, lost someone they loved dearly but managed to move on from it, has a compassionate inner child within themselves enc.

 

[ain]

Before I start replying I would like to point out that I am a totally fresh face when it comes to any RPG Maker program and making games in general. So if my questions leave you wondering "How does this guy not understand what _____ means", please don't get mad


Fisherolol:

Spoiler

Default battle system,


MP and TP doing the same thing,


boring skills,


imitating a combat system instead of being original,


2+ seconds to do a normal skill,


items use in every single game,


guard command no one ever uses properly,


too many encounters,


useless HUDs.

1) Do you dislike the default battle system because you are just totally tired of it, or does it have inherent flaws? 


2) So you want the MP & TP to do entirely different things? e.g MP for more magic-based skills & maybe TP for Faith-Based skilled


3) "2+ seconds to do a normal skill" Can you explain this please? 


4) "Items use in every single game" Are you saying you want a game that doesn't use items? Or you want a game with more specific uses for items?

Dalph

Spoiler

Human characters.


Really, I had enough. There are many animals\robots\mythological creatures out there, it doesn't take much to come up with an interesting and unique race. Mass Effect did this very well.

So for example if you made a medieval-based rpg you would have races such as elf, dwarf, orc, gnome, dark elf, a race resembling an Ent, etc


All with there own unique cultures, looks of course. 

Srpg

Spoiler

I'm not a big fan when it comes to commercial games using 100% RTP and nothing customs in them. The default BS is also a let down for me when trying their demos or taking a look a youtube previews. Even if the story gets a good rating, my preferences go for a Custom Battle System/Menus and at least some new graphical assets before purchasing any rpg maker game. Custom Characters portraits also go into my list since I not a fan of the auto character generator or any portraits taken from the RTP. I prefer diversity in a game that does not contain already-seen assets/systems found on other games. So far, I've not been very impressed by the list of commercial games that has been released since XP - those that I enjoyed are Alpha Kimori and Echoes of Aetheria for the moment.


The one that has piked my interest for this year is definitely Arcadian Atlas which is a tactical rpg and it is nice to see something fresh in the rpg maker horizons.

1) Commercial games using the defaults:


I understand this completely, a game should cost money if they don't really customize it. 


2) "The default BS is also a let down for me":


What does this mean? What is the default BS?


3) "my preferences go for a Custom Battle System/Menus":


Could you define what kind of changes are an example of something that is different enough to the regular battle system to be seen as "custom"?


- New graphical assets:


Could these graphical assets be taken from the free resources given from other artists? (Obviously try to keep the art styles similar)


- custom character portraits


I agree, custom characters always make a game have more life to it. 

Wavelength

Spoiler

A damn good list from @Fisherolol.


In addition to pretty much everything he said:

• Releasing a game in a language the writer/editor clearly was not familiar with
  
• Scrolling Text intros
  
• Use of default maps, classes, enemies, skills, or items
  
• Heavy use of "cutscenes" that are almost entirely text with little animation or movement
  
• Gear treadmills (that is, needing to upgrade equipment to the next tier at every town I visit)
  
• Horror-genre tropes and themes
  
• The overuse of Yanfly's excellent scripts (particularly in VX Ace where they were less flexible)
  
• "Pile of Stats" enemies (in fairness I guess this is moreso the underuse of creative troop/enemy design)
  
• Boss Enemies at the end of every dungeon
  
• Characters that start with zero or one skills
  

I agree/understand most of what you are saying so I only have one question:


"Pile of Stats" enemies (in fairness I guess this is moreso the underuse of creative troop/enemy design)


Could you explain exactly what this means? 

Helladen

Spoiler

Copying other game designers rather than making your own style of game. That is both your own and not a blantant clone of another game. Clones are bad everywhere, it is hard to be original anymore and requires a thick attention to detail.

Question: My first project is using lore from the popular game Dungeons & Dragons (Forgotten Realms) so I am using the same Gods/Goddesses, races, metals, etc. It does not clone the combat styles or any mechanics simply the lore. 


Would that be a turn-off? 

Warpmind

Spoiler

Skipping proofreading/substituting Autocorrect for actual proofreading is a pain... I still recall coming across a game where the sewers reeked with that "sceptic smell"...
Poor sense of dramatic timing/gross mishandling of dramatic tools - a jumpscare when you're not expecting it can be effective, but a jumpscare for the sake of a jumpscare is just sloppy and poorly thought out. Horror tropes and themes can be fine, so long as it's done thoroughly and thoughtfully. (A single locked door in a haunted house, for example, is going to creep out the player more and more the longer it stays locked...)
Sloppy copying of combat systems - if your idea for a combat system is just a carbon copy of some other system, don't bother. If you're not going to do anything innovative by yourself, you might as well use the engine default, or one of the available scripts with default settings.
Shameless fetch quests that don't offer anything relative to the narrative, whether the main plot, subplots or character development.

Frankly, a game made with the default menus and battle system can be perfectly fine, so long as it's done well. Learn how the system works and WHY it works, and you're off to a better start than you might think.

I agree with with pretty much everything thing you said I simply wanted to say that I read what you said . (I'm not planning a horror game. I feel like that would be really difficult to pull off)

lilyWhite

Spoiler

Squished text. Especially with the default font. It looks terribly amateurish. Even more so when it's a six-letter name next to a barely-legible thirty-letter name.


Also, menus or even battle screens where it's obvious that the creator put more emphasis on showing off their pretty art than making windows that look good and function adequately.

"Squished text" I am guessing are talking about the space between letters/words. Does the default text squish it all together in your opinion? Could you give an image example of this?


Noob Question: What are windows when it comes to menus or battle screens? Are you talking about like the item/skill/party area in the menu? 

Chorvaqueen

Spoiler

Fangames hastily made for the sake of bandwagon. Plus points if they're entirely made in RTP and the main characters look like a sprite hack job. 

Help me out here, 


RTP means the default graphics, audio, etc that come with the RPG Maker program? 


What is a "Sprite hack job"? Is it when you "steal" sprites from other people and each of them are different art styles so they don't mix? 

Makio-Kuta

Spoiler

Feature creep.


Houses that are either way too big on the inside or have a shape that defies logic on the outside.


Mix and matching graphic styles that don't work together.


Young hot blooded male protagonist, meek childhood friend female mage/healer, third wheel male tank character combination from snoozeville. And just uninspired characters all around. Is it so hard to get some creative character dynamics up in here?


Horrifying screen tints and over the top lighting.


the rampent denial that any of the above things (and some things other people mentioned) are wrong.

"Feature Creep" - I didn't know what this meant, looked it up and now I know a new phrase. Thanks


I agree with all your other points as well  

Matseb2611

Spoiler

Adding some more. Most of mine are to do with story and world-building.


- Humble beginnings. The main character is always a farmboy or some other underdog from a simple background taking on an enemy far superior to them in every way.


- Evil empire vs noble rebels, elves, mages, or some other oppressed faction that is objectively good and has no bad qualities.


- The main antagonist being the main protagonist's dark mirror, i.e. exactly identical in origin, personality, and fighting style, except fighting for evil. Ok, it's interesting to see this every now and again, but this is way overdone now.


- A game that tries to emulate the old Final Fantasy and Dragon Warrior/Quest games to the letter, as in with all the problems and inconveniences that came with it because of nostalgia, such as excessive grinding, illogical dungeon designs, illogical enemies, bosses that are immune to every status, bosses whose strengths and weaknesses you have no way of knowing or logically predicting upon first try, and so on.


- Slimes, rats, bees, and spiders as the first dungeon's main enemies. Please, let's use a bit of originality.

So you want your game to have a little bit of grit to it. A sheen of realism; not everything it good/bad black/white


I never played FF, dragon warrior/quest before so I guess I don't have to worry about that  

Minun

Spoiler

1. Default battler templates


2. Meme usages


3. Front view battle


4. "Hey guys I'm gonna release my 5% complete game hope you like it guys" (I know, I fell victim to that but I already explained my reasoning to that...)


5. Trying to copy Aio Oni and IB.


6. "Hi, my name is (Your name here) The warrior"


7. Default menus

1) I am guessing using free resources is a-ok as long as you follow the TOS in your book?


2) People use memes in games? 


3) -


4) Agree


5) Never played either personally.


6) Do you mean there are games that literally say "Hi, my name is (Your name here) the warrior"? Or do you mean the game programs it so it says "Hi, my name is (Ain) the warrior". If it's the second option why is that a bad thing?


8) Agree

Kyuukon

Spoiler

Cliche, non-realistic stories.

I agree  

AwesomeCool

Spoiler

Fantasy Races following the same patterns every time.


EX:


Elves are almost always oppressed in some way (and generally slaves).  Also, almost always peace loving and bow + magic users.


Dwarfs are isolationists and want nothing to do with the other races.  Also, this race is bad with magic, but good with technology (every time).


Humans are the strongest current empire and almost always mistreat all the other races (generally for some bland humans are naturally evil reason).


Half-Elfs are always hated more then any other being in existence.


half-dwarfs do no exist... ...ever.


Dragons are always said to be incredibly smart and wise (although they almost never show any of these characteristics) and tend to be incredibly selfish and not care about current events (and tough).


Some god-like race that looks almost exactly like one of the other races (if shown), but way more powerful and more technological advanced (till some unnamed catastrophic event left only ruins which always happen to be the most essential part of the main plot).


All other races end up being pure evil monsters with very little intelligence (goblins, orcs, etc).\


Finally, Original races do not exist due to fear that the plot could be to innovative and stick out to much (meaning that expectations might make people except it to be a good story).


The funniest thing is that if one of these things are true, almost all of the rest are also true.  Plus the ones that do not follow this pattern get more popularity (due to people talking about it) for this reason alone, yet most indie devs still stick with copying older works with only one twist added (which makes them forgotten about like a generic WWII shooter, MMO, or Moba in there prime era).  

I agree! I plan to have dwarfs, elves, etc in my first project. However, I plan to have different factions of each race that have different cultures, religions, ideologies, etc. 


(I will try to give them all a little twist as well)

Euphony

Spoiler

Can you expand on these? Like...you don't like items being used, period? And how does one misuse the guard command? I'm curious what you mean exactly.


Ditto to pretty much everything @Makio-Kuta listed. Especially the hodgepodge of graphic styles. That always bugs me when I see it, and it's pretty common. Yes, it's fun to gather resources from various artists/sources, but take a little extra time to get them to match. Sometimes just adjusting the colors can make a world of difference for consistency.

Thanks for the tip when it comes to adjusting colours  

Little Adventurer

Spoiler

Flat characters, particularly the flat protagonist. I know the point of those is "You're supposed to project yourself into them! They're YOU! You think up your own personality for them!"


...I've never been able to do that. If the character has no personality, if they never react to anything or say anything, then why should I care about their plight? It just seems lazy to me, since the designer puts so much more effort into the rest of the cast, that the main character having no personality sticks out like a sore thumb. When it's done with the villain, they're not seen as a threat. When it's done with a love interest, they're seen as vapid and shallow. But the protagonist is A-OK?! What's wrong with having the main protagonist having a personality? Why shouldn't he grow and change like the rest of them?


Hypothetical example: You play as character A. Character A is flat and emotionless, unless you project yourself onto them and give them a personality yourself blah blah blah. Character A, for plot purposes, falls for Character B. The problem is, the player doesn't really like Character B as a person for whatever reason (outside of character not as the protagonist) and wishes to either remain single or get together with Character C or whatever (who may or may not feel the same). However, unfortunately, Character A is forced to get together with Character B and there are no other options to deny their love (or if there is an option to say that they don't love them then it changes practically nothing in the end). Considering that Character A is supposed to be the player, that means that the player is being forced into something they don't want to do, but must anyway, because they have no choice and it feels harsher and more personal since Character A is supposed to be them.


Whereas if Character A had a personality... sure it's still bad for the player personally, but it feels less so since it's not YOU being forced into it, just your character. You can still connect with a character even if they have a personality, perhaps even moreso if they've gone through similar life experiences that the player has gone through as well, such as they were bullied and worked through it, lost someone they loved dearly but managed to move on from it, has a compassionate inner child within themselves enc.

Thank you for pointing this out. I've been having trouble choosing whether to allow the player to make choices or give the main character an actual just base personality that shifts with the game play. I think you make some good points, and I now plan on fleshing out the main character just as much as the other "cast members"  

 

[Ms Littlefish]

• Mage spell tree consisting of "fire" and "better fire." Effect is "damage" and "more damage." 
  
• Fighters being sword wielders, magic users holding staves and calling upon divine interventions, ect. 
  
• Very easy puzzles. Beyond easy. As in, hu-what?
  
• All of my old skills and old equips becoming garbage later on.
  
• A blue menu. 
  
• Characters that are heal bots. Why even have items?
  
• Volcano dungeon, forest dungeon. Totally cool with elemental dungeons but we can be more creative that this, please!?
  

 

[stupid enough to like FF13]

"Squished text" I am guessing are talking about the space between letters/words. Does the default text squish it all together in your opinion? Could you give an image example of this?
 
Noob Question: What are windows when it comes to menus or battle screens? Are you talking about like the item/skill/party area in the menu? 

Example:

The code that draws text usually has a specified amount of space, and if that amount of space isn't enough for the text, it scrunches it like that. It looks terrible, especially with the default monospace font.


"Windows" are the panes that make up the menus or standard message boxes or the display in battle, for example. The in-game menu, for example, has three separate windows: the party status, the sub-menu commands, and the gold display.

 

[Little Adventurer]

Actually had an argument with a friend over the "RPG flat protagonist" thing a couple days ago. I consider it my fault, because I kept trying to reiterate my point that I disliked the concept, when I most likely said my piece the first time. I dislike the concept in any game, not just RPGs (though I consider it justified if you're able to create the character from scratch- Elder Scrolls, Dragon Age, Stardew Valley, Quest for Glory), whereas for him he likes it.