What does "Made with RMMV" mean?

Shaz

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A few people have asked this question, wondering how far can they depart from the editor while still being able to claim that their game was made with RMMV.  We've been waiting for official word on this so we can give you an accurate answer rather than opinions, and try to avoid confusion.


Obviously some are wondering if they can still use the default resources and their edits, considering the extent of their modifications.  Others are simply wondering if they can still say the game was made with MV.


The answer is below, but here are some snippets from the EULA that help define things (the EULA can be found by selecting Help > Contents > End User License Agreement (scroll all the way down, it's just a little above the JS Library) > English EULA (italics mine):

This End User License Agreement (henceforth, “Agreement,” including game distribution terms) shall apply to all relationships between KADOKAWA Corporation (henceforth, “Company”) and the Purchaser (includes cases where a different person installs this Software on a computer device, and shall henceforth be referred to as the “User”) of the Company’s “RPG Maker MV” (henceforth, “Software”).

Article 5: Licensing


The Company shall license use of the Software as follows limited to cases where the User is a Licensed User.


1. Creation of original games (henceforth, “User Games”) using the Software (including the computer programs comprising the Software) and the assets (referring to text, music, images, etc., henceforth, “Company Assets”) recorded in the Software. Furthermore, the User cannot record or use, etc. Company Assets in the original games they create using creation tools, etc. they created or provided by third parties without obtaining the Company’s advance written consent.
This is the official statement:

If the mods are done to such an extent that MV is not needed at all, then it can no longer be called a "mod". It's a separate piece of software that's not related to RPG Maker and it cannot be allowed to use any resources that come with MV, nor can it use the resource packs we have for sale in the store.


If the developer is only using MV only very briefly to stay within the "made with MV" rule, they're also out. The game should, at its core, be made with RPG Maker MV -- using the editor for mapping, eventing, databasing etc. They're welcome to tweak the engine so it's personalized to their game, but not to the point where the engine is no longer needed.
So, if you are not making your game primarily in the editor - if you are doing as much outside the editor as possible and changing the scripts as much as possible so the original MV scripts are no longer used - your game is not "made with MV".
 
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Kaliya

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Thanks for the information Shaz!
 

nio kasgami

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wait whattttt? 

So if I decide to rewrite the core code  (rpg-blabla) of MV at a point this not the same coding....it's not longer a MV game? 

so I can't edit the coding of my game like I want ? even if I do the mapping and databasing inside the rm editor? 
 

byronclaude

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Addon clarification requested:  Am I correct in saying that, based on the EULA info shown above:  RPG Maker MV resources (rtp) may ONLY be used with RPG Maker MV (and may not be used with other rpg makers such as Vx Ace, or rm2k3).

I ask for clarification because a response post from Andar on Dec 6th states that any rpg maker rtp may be used with any rpg maker program (so long as all involved rpg maker engines were purchased legally).

Can someone please clarify once and for all specifically:  If I own both MV and VX Ace, can I for example, create a character in MVs character generator, and then use that character image in a VX Ace project?

Please and thank you.
 

Uzuki

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wait whattttt? 

So if I decide to rewrite the core code  (rpg-blabla) of MV at a point this not the same coding....it's not longer a MV game? 

so I can't edit the coding of my game like I want ? even if I do the mapping and databasing inside the rm editor? 
It says you CAN edit the coding of the software as long as you are still using the editor and database.
 

Shaz

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@Nio, if you are using the editor to do your mapping and eventing and databasing, and you are just changing the scripts, but you are actually developing your game in the editor, then it is an MV game.


@byronclaude, yes, you CAN use the default MV assets in other RPG Makers that you own. This has always been the case, and there is another thread that does have an official statement to that effect.
 

byronclaude

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Thank you Shaz for a fast and detailed response  :)    MV is still not working correctly on my system, so at least having acquired the resources and generator for current and future Ace projects makes the purchase worthwhile.  Thanks again! 
 

estriole

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so basically using

http://forums.rpgmakerweb.com/index.php?/topic/50752-tiled-plugin/

would mean that it not made in MV?

since we do the mapping outside the MV editor...

or it still ok?

(since the concept is same as parallax mapping. we create map outside... import it inside the game...)

also... what if we use above and rewrite most of the core plugin...?
 
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Shaz

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If you are doing the databasing and the eventing inside the editor, you can use TileD to make your maps. We did give you a plugin ;)


If the majority of your game is done in MV, then you can say your game is made with MV.
 
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Tsukihime

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What if I created my entire game in MV, then exported it to my own engine that is designed to run game data built in MV, but not using the core MV scripts?
 

Shaz

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It specifically says you cannot use the resources in your own engine.
 

KisaiTenshi

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In context, "How much RPG Maker MV is required to make it RPG Maker MV?"

This was discussed elsewhere, but basically there are two "sniff tests"

- If the game can be re-opened in the editor, saved, and played, it's still an RPG Maker MV game (no you don't need to allow players to do this, either by license or by packing)

- If the game engine can be jettisoned (anything/everything in the JS directory), it's not an RPG Maker MV game.

In the case of the first point, it's a game that does not us the RPG Maker MV tools is not a MV game. In the case of the latter, it's not using the RPG Maker MV game engine. The latter you can tweak with plugins extensively and it's still the MV engine until you start removing dependency on those files.

But if you write a new game engine, it becomes fuzzier. Let's say for example you write a new game engine with Unity, and still use the data/*.json files along with the MV assets, and used MV to actually create the game, but used Unity so you could run the game on the Wii U or PS4. This is one of those edge cases where you would likely want to ask permission to do this, since the RPG Maker license(s) say they must be run with the RPG Maker MV engine, but technically what you'd have done is made a MV-compatible engine inside of Unity, but it's not MV.

The kind of thing that would bother me, and likely get RPG Maker dev's bring out the pitchforks is a case where the assets get repackaged with another "compatible" engine. I have seen stuff like this before, as there are many "sprite-rip" sites out there where users claim they made the sprites when they really just ripped them out of other games, but then turn around and made "RPG Maker" chipsets (aka tilesets) with them. 
 
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felsenstern

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Honestly I was trying to understand the meaning of this rule for more than 3 hours and while I wrote and deleted like 20 posts, I couldn't decide what I find more stupid, rules that limit a game creator in her or his creation process or people who are using RPG-Maker only as excuse to access the RTP. I am going to bed now and will not waste another thought on this anymore.

No offense Shaz!
 

Hudell

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Well, I guess I'll have to recheck all my assets to make sure I have the non-RM license of them. I'll have to change some sound effects, but I think that's all.

Or will it be a problem that I'm using part of the original scripts?

My situation:

I don't use events;

I used the database at first, then started modifying the JSON files manually;

I used the map editor for all my maps, but I wanted to move to tiled;

I don't use plugins or the plugin manager, instead, I change what I want on the JS code;

I removed loads of stuff from the default code: Everything battle related, the Game Interpreter, and many other things;

But, the game would not exist if it weren't for RPG Maker.

So I have no idea what my situation is.
 
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Seriel

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My situation:

I don't use events;

I used the database at first, then started modifying the JSON files manually;

I used the map editor for all my maps, but I wanted to move to tiled;

I don't use plugins or the plugin manager, instead, I change what I want on the JS code;

I removed loads of stuff from the default code: Everything battle related, the Game Interpreter, and many other things;

But, the game would not exist if it weren't for RPG Maker.

So I have no idea what my situation is.
I would think as long as you continue to use MV for the mzps it would count...?
 

Shaz

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What is mzps?


Please remember this is a legal issue and people asking want official answers, not opinions.


@Hudell, it sounds like the majority of your game is not being made with MV. If you're modifying the json files manually, using tiled for maps, changing JS code manually and have removed most of the default scripts, what ARE you using that IS from MV?


@felsenstern, we are not limiting what creators can/can't do in their creation process. We are saying that if they do everything they can do to avoid using MV, the editor, then they cannot claim their game was made with MV purely for the purpose of using the MV resources. If you don't want to use MV, don't use it - ANY of it. If you want to use the resources, you HAVE to use the editor as well.
 
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Hudell

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What is mzps?

Please remember this is a legal issue and people asking want official answers, not opinions.

@Hudell, it sounds like the majority of your game is not being made with MV. If you're modifying the json files manually, using tiled for maps, changing JS code manually and have removed most of the default scripts, what ARE you using that IS from MV?
The 40.000 lines of code that I didn't remove.
 

felsenstern

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@felsenstern, we are not limiting what creators can/can't do in their creation process. We are saying that if they do everything they can do to avoid using MV, the editor, then they cannot claim their game was made with MV purely for the purpose of using the MV resources. If you don't want to use MV, don't use it - ANY of it. If you want to use the resources, you HAVE to use the editor as well.
The thing is I don't know at which point MV is no longer MV or what exactly defines MV, compared to Ace, VX, XP and so on.

The editor can't be it, because TileD is a valid alternative and Ace with your converter is valid as well. And since the system files are human readable, a text editor would work just fine too (to change or correct the right map order as an example). What about a tool or an alternative editor which would add version control and collaboration features? I am sure when MV spreads such attempts will be made or a manual edit mode for auto-tiles or a different presentation for switches, variables and common events, where system and file structure looks exactly the same as created with MV?

Well the engine is another point here. And until now (Ace, VX, XP...) for me the engine was a bit like an operating system, that kindly offered me all the tools and function to create my game but left me the freedom do write my own code as well or to even skip system routines if I wouldn't need them. On the other hand I could just optimize, change and extend system routines or use the system library of Windows to further extend the possibilities in my games, that made RGSS a base but not a limit.

And then there is the form of the game. Is an action side scroller with gravity, pixel movement, extended sprite animation, alternative collision detection and a pixel / mask oriented path finding solution still an RPG-Maker game as long as it opens and saves in RPG-Maker editor?

Many things have changed with MV. And approaches which would have left the RPG-Maker community in awe for the coding skils and efforts in Ace is now a reason why a game is no longer eligible to be called made in RPG-Maker in MV.

There are a few more things I would like to write about the other side about protecting the further development of RM and stuff, but I have no time left... and as before, I mean no offense here and I am not trying anything bad here, just things are not as easy as they appear in the first moment. If something sounds aggressive, than that is rather out of my clumsiness in conversations.
 

Seriel

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What is mzps?

Please remember this is a legal issue and people asking want official answers, not opinions.
I meant maps, it's just a simple typo.

And I know, that's why I put "I think"
 

Hudell

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RPG Maker MV can be split into two things:


1 - The Editor;


2 - Everything that is copied to the game folder when you start a new project;


Number 2 includes all the code that makes the game run and all the RTP assets.


This code is built on top of different free / open source projects and is what makes an RPG Maker Game run.


Number 1 is just an editor made with this code and assets in mind. And not a great one.


Everything that the editor does, there are other tools out there that do it better.


If there isn't a tool to do something that MV's editor does, one will eventually be made:


Tiled is a better map editor;


I've seen external plugin managers being made by the community;


I've seen external database editors being made by the community;


I've considered making a better event editor in the past;


All of those are just separate tools that can be used to help make a better game.


But you can't use any of that if you didn't start a new project on MV. So even if it uses several different tools instead of being modified on MV's editor, how can someone say it's not an MV game, when MV is the only of those tools that was essential for the game to exist?
 

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