Frankster300

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Note: I'm using "RPG Maker" as the general term for the company that owns this website. I dont know the real company (companies?) that own this website, but i am referencing them when it comes to saying RPG Maker.

So as a child of two parents who went to law school... i find this in the terms of service and rules to be very scary.

Link: https://forums.rpgmakerweb.com/index.php?help/terms

"The providers ("we", "us", "our") of the service provided by this web site ("Service") are not responsible for any user-generated content and accounts ("Content"). Content submitted express the views of their author only."

(Skipping a few lines)

"You are granting us with a non-exclusive, permanent, irrevocable, unlimited license to use, publish, or re-publish your Content in connection with the Service. You retain copyright over the Content."

I understand that these two phrases basically means that even though i own the ownership to my content, RPG Maker can do whatever it wants with the content, like selling it as DLC without giving the content owner a royalty cut (As seen from the thousand + worth of dlc in the steam store). This raises two big questions i have that relate to ownership of content.

1: When you say "the Service", do you mean the forums, the project maker software, all of the above... what?

I need to know exactly what this "service" is. All it says is the service provided by this website, and that could literally be anything. What if i bought rpg maker on steam and never went to the website? Just because i can buy rpg maker on this website, does it mean it filters into steam as well? What if i hired outside sources to make my content for me? Does it mean that whatever they make on the program (that has nothing to do with the website), RPG Maker now owns?

To clarify, i use the words "owns" and "own" loosely, in reference to the "your granting us" statement.

2: If someone re-publishes my content without my permission, does RPG Maker now own that content because it was posted onto the Service?

Id like to say no, since it talks about how you shouldn't use the service if it infringes copyright laws. But theres a catch in your statements...

I understand that you have a strict policy about republishing content thats not yours... But the "unlimited license to use, publish, or re-publish in connection with the Service" part of your terms of service is the key issue here.

Nowhere in your terms does it say that it guarantees that if my content is published onto your website without my permission, that you do not own rights to that content now. I dont want to assume social/cultural law of content creators, i want to know for sure that if i catch anyone posting my content here on this website without my permission, that i still own the rights to that content and RPG Maker doesn't.

That includes every type of content: Music, sprites, pictures, references, story ideas, names and locations, etc. Everything.

For example, if someone is talking about their "project they are working on" and references one of my character ideas, i need to know if RPG Maker now owns the character idea since it was posted on the websites "Service".

I have a few more issues, but those can be solved on my own time. These two big ones are the main things i want to talk about in this discussion.

I would appreciate if a developer would answer my concerns, due to the issue of "X was mistaken so if you have issues your SOL" problem that can come if i bring this up in the future. I have no problem with anyone answering these for me, just a developers answer counts way more then anyone elses when it comes to its legality.

My goal is to make the "next generation indie game" series. I'm very passionate about my project, and my ideas, and i dont want anyone to steal or own ANY of my content without my exact/specific permission.

I REALLY LOVE RPG MAKER! This program is perfect for my goal, but after reviewing what i have seen online, i need to know for sure if this is something i want to commit my ideas to.

Thanks for reading, Frank

P.S: If i like the answers i see on this forum, i would like my next thread to be a hiring page for a resource content creator. I'm not trying to double post, i just want to know if theres someone i can DM about this about before i post anything new to the website. You can also privately message me instead of posting it on here, so no double posting has taken place.

Cool? Thanks
 

JtheDuelist

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@Frankster300 I don't know much about legal stuff ( I'm the son of a freelance florist) but you can't do paid commission stuff until you have "Veteran" status, which is 30 meaningful posts.

Also, your profile pic is from "Avatar: The Last Airbender" right? It looks familiar.
 

bgillisp

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From what I've seen, #2 just means they can show off your screenshots and work on other platforms to show what one can do with RPGMaker. But they will not sell it without permission, as that would be a violation of the part of you retaining the copywrite.
 

TheoAllen

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I need to know exactly what this "service" is
I believe the "service" is the RPG Maker itself. Could be technical support to, but mostly the program itself I guess.

What if i bought rpg maker on steam and never went to the website?
Well that's okay, a lot of people do that anyway.

Just because i can buy rpg maker on this website, does it mean it filters into steam as well?
I'm not sure what do you mean by this. But if u buy RMMV here, u have an activation code to activate RMMV on steam, iirc. If that is what you mean

What if i hired outside sources to make my content for me?
You can even make your own contents, so I don't see outsourcing is a no. But whether the resource is legit (not plagiarized / stolen) from the person u hired, it's your responsibility.

Does it mean that whatever they make on the program (that has nothing to do with the website), RPG Maker now owns?
Of course not. Your content, your resources, your IP, yours only.

2: If someone re-publishes my content without my permission, does RPG Maker now own that content because it was posted onto the Service?
Everyone can't (re)publish your content without your permission.

i need to know if RPG Maker now owns the character idea since it was posted on the websites "Service".
Again, your IP is yours only. The idea is yours. But if you created character from RM character generator for example, you share the copyright. Idea is yours, but the resources used (generator part) is from RPG Maker. Thus you're tied with RM terms of service which you can not use the image (from generator, even if it's your character) on different engine/platform, afaik.

------------
Granted, I'm just an average user here. Better wait for some officials to clear up some information.
 

Frankster300

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A lot of fast responses! Thank you! BUT, something like this is something i have an issue with:

I believe the "service" is the RPG Maker itself. Could be technical support to, but mostly the program itself I guess.


You can even make your own contents, so I don't see outsourcing is a no. But whether the resource is legit (not plagiarized / stolen) from the person u hired, it's your responsibility.


Of course not. Your content, your resources, your IP, yours only.


Everyone can't (re)publish your content without your permission.


Again, your IP is yours only. The idea is yours. But if you created character from RM character generator for example, you share the copyright. Idea is yours, but the resources used (generator part) is from RPG Maker. Thus you're tied with RM terms of service which you can not use the image (from generator, even if it's your character) on different engine/platform, afaik.

Granted, I'm just an average user here. Better wait for some officials to clear up some information.

What your saying contradicts yourself greatly. If RPG Maker itself is the service, that means that everything i put on the program is now owned by RPG Maker.

The IP is mine yes, but its also theirs and they can do whatever they want with it. Which means they can in fact publish my content without my permission. They can also sell my content without my permission as well.

This also means even if i dont use character generation, they own the content of whatever is on the program.

Also they own the content if i use character generation?! Thats a really big issue!

Saying "im just an average user here" is fair, but your speculating instead of saying "these are facts". These kinds of statements can make or break if i want to use this program or not. This is why i would like a developer to clarify my issues instead of the average user.

I need hard, official facts. I dont want to make my game and suddenly have issues i could have prevented in the past!

No offense to you of course, your input is important!

@Frankster300 I don't know much about legal stuff ( I'm the son of a freelance florist) but you can't do paid commission stuff until you have "Veteran" status, which is 30 meaningful posts.

Also, your profile pic is from "Avatar: The Last Airbender" right? It looks familiar.

Could you show proof that it specifically says i cant make a game for commission until i hit the Veteran status? I have no problem with gaining the status itself, but this is another thing i need to do before i publish my game (when i make it).

Also yes, its the Cabbage Man from Avatar: The Last Airbender. Hes funny =3
 

CleanWater

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These terms of use are from the web forums. For the terms of use from the softwares, you need to check them.

In the terms of use, there's no implication that they can use your work freely (developed games in the engine).
 

mlogan

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Okay, I think you are mixing up a lot of things. This website is owned/run by Degica, the western distributor for RPG Maker products, which is produced by a company called Kadokawa. It says clearly in those terms that the "Service" refers to this website. So, it is referring to the content of these forums, not what you make with RPG Maker.

In addition, all of the content packs sold in the store here and on Steam is not just simply Degica stealing content from what is posted here or put in people's games and sold without compensation. The artists must submit the packs and yes, receive a cut of the profits from it. Degica just helps them distribute their work here and on Steam.

The Veteran status is not about you making a commercial game. This forum has a Classifieds section where members can offer paid work or seek paid work. You have to reach Veteran status to view that area, as we offer as an extension for those who are active members here. It is an attempt to discourage people from simply using the community as a drop by money making tool without becoming a part of the community. You can make a game, and sell it wherever, without ever needing a single post here.

Again, I reiterate, you are confusing this site and the content on it with using RPG Maker. RPG Maker has it's own set of terms and conditions. The ones you are quoting are just for these forums.
 

Sharm

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Let me plain english the lines that you're worried about.

"We, Degica, aren't responsible for things that people post on the forums, the things they say are only the opinions of the people that are saying them. By making posts on this forum you're letting us keep the stuff you post on the forum forever. But we can't do anything else with it, because the stuff you post is still yours."
 

Frankster300

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Okay, I think you are mixing up a lot of things. This website is owned/run by Degica, the western distributor for RPG Maker products, which is produced by a company called Kadokawa. It says clearly in those terms that the "Service" refers to this website. So, it is referring to the content of these forums, not what you make with RPG Maker.

In addition, all of the content packs sold in the store here and on Steam is not just simply Degica stealing content from what is posted here or put in people's games and sold without compensation. The artists must submit the packs and yes, receive a cut of the profits from it. Degica just helps them distribute their work here and on Steam.

The Veteran status is not about you making a commercial game. This forum has a Classifieds section where members can offer paid work or seek paid work. You have to reach Veteran status to view that area, as we offer as an extension for those who are active members here. It is an attempt to discourage people from simply using the community as a drop by money making tool without becoming a part of the community. You can make a game, and sell it wherever, without ever needing a single post here.

Again, I reiterate, you are confusing this site and the content on it with using RPG Maker. RPG Maker has it's own set of terms and conditions. The ones you are quoting are just for these forums.

Thank you for clarifying a lot of this information. If im mixing stuff up i want people to tell me!

I want to be apart of this community as well, i just dont want to be hit by something out of the blue that causes me to lose all the effort i put into my project. I'm a very passionate person when it comes to my ideas!

That being said, would you mind linking me the correct terms and conditions with using RPG Maker MV? I took a few minutes to search and i dont know which one is the correct T&C.

Thank you mlogan, Frank

P.S: I never assumed or stated Degica stole content, i simply said that they could if they wanted to, which now im not sure they can just because i have the wrong terms and conditions! Whoops!
 

mlogan

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I understand that these two phrases basically means that even though i own the ownership to my content, RPG Maker can do whatever it wants with the content, like selling it as DLC without giving the content owner a royalty cut (As seen from the thousand + worth of dlc in the steam store). This raises two big questions i have that relate to ownership of content.

Well, it was this sentence that I wanted to clarify that, as it does make it sound as if you believed that that is how Degica got the content of the packs sold in the store and on Steam.

The providers ("we", "us", "our") of the service provided by this web site ("Service") are not responsible for any user-generated content and accounts ("Content"). Content submitted express the views of their author only.

This part is defining terms for later on in the document, so that they do not have to type "this website" or "The providers" every time and make the language flow a bit more. You can reread the rest of the terms mentally replacing "Service" with "this website" if you wish.

You agree to not use the Service to submit or link to any Content which is defamatory, abusive, hateful, threatening, spam or spam-like, likely to offend, contains adult or objectionable content, contains personal information of others, risks copyright infringement, encourages unlawful activity, or otherwise violates any laws.

Pretty self explanatory, I believe.

All Content you submit or upload may be reviewed by staff members. All Content you submit or upload may be sent to third-party verification services (including, but not limited to, spam prevention services). Do not submit any Content that you consider to be private or confidential.

We review content for various reasons. We review Game Development topics, tutorials, script/plugin submissions, and classifieds submissions before that are viewable to ensure they meet a standard of quality. We also review anything that may be reported - if someone says or contributes something that violate our website rules, for example.

We reserve the rights to remove or modify any Content submitted for any reason without explanation. Requests for Content to be removed or modified will be undertaken only at our discretion. We reserve the right to take action against any account with the Service at any time.

This goes along with the above. We have deleted comments or replies before that we feel are not beneficial and/or harmful to the community. For example, if someone started going on with hate speech, we would remove that.

You are granting us with a non-exclusive, permanent, irrevocable, unlimited license to use, publish, or re-publish your Content in connection with the Service. You retain copyright over the Content.

As bgillisp said, this is mostly for promotional type uses. If you check RPG Maker Web's Facebook page you will see that they share screenshots and stuff or promote certain topics on the forum. You retain the copyright means they do not own your work. Imagine if they had to try to get individual permission to post anything to Facebook that contained content from here? Want to promote a thread? Have to get permission from every person individually who posted in that thread? This is just saying you give them that permission overall.

These terms may be changed at any time without notice.

If you do not agree with these terms, please do not register or use this Service. If you wish to close your account, please contact us.

Again, I think this is pretty self-explanatory.
 

JtheDuelist

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Could you show proof that it specifically says i cant make a game for commission until i hit the Veteran status? I have no problem with gaining the status itself, but this is another thing i need to do before i publish my game (when i make it).
No, no, no- you misunderstood me. You can't do paid commission for resources until 30 posts- if you don't see a section called "Classifieds" on the forum, you can't access it.
 

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