Which Maker to buy?

Discussion in 'Product Discussion and Support' started by Codeex, Dec 6, 2018.

  1. Codeex

    Codeex Warper Member

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    Hi there!

    So i've been considering getting into game development, and the intuitive and "easy" way of doing it with RPG maker seems like a brilliant place to start. The thing is, im a student, with a hella of a thin wallet.
    Thus making my question rather simple.

    If I buy the RPG Maker VX Ace - could i upgrade to RPG Maker MV later down the road, without having to pay full price again? - or is it two completely different softwares?
     
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  2. Kes

    Kes Global Moderators Global Mod

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    It's 2 different engines which incompatible with each other so you would have to boy both. If you wait until after Christmas there might be a sale with big discounts.
     
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  3. Codeex

    Codeex Warper Member

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    Thank you for the fast reply! I will look into that!
     
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  4. Tuomo L

    Tuomo L Oldbie Veteran

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    Skip Ace and buy MV instead.
     
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  5. Shaz

    Shaz Veteran Veteran

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    MV is definitely the way to go if you can afford it. Grab the trial version for now (if you have time to start working with it), and play with it until it expires (20 days, I think). And keep an eye out for Steam sales, RPG Maker Web sales, and humble bundles.
     
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  6. Codeex

    Codeex Warper Member

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    Is the MV version on steam??

    - And another question I might add. - When i buy MV, will i have all the assets as shown in most youtube videos? Or is that something i would have to spend money on elsewherE?
     
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  7. kamuipsyus

    kamuipsyus Professional Murder Hobo Veteran

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    Yes. MV is on Steam. However, I would buy the stand alone version over the Steam version. If I remember correctly, when you buy off the website, you get the stand alone and a steam key as well.

    MV comes with a good amount of assets. They will be fine for making your first few games.
    On Humble Bundle and randomly throughout the year, Steam and RPG Maker website will have sales on most of their asset packs.
     
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  8. bgillisp

    bgillisp Global Moderators Global Mod

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    Here are the pros and cons of each:

    ACE:
    Pro: More stable on older computers, has more resources and scripts for it.
    Cons: Old software, no more updates coming. Capped at 640 x 480 resolution (though that might not be a con if you don't care about that).

    MV:
    Pro: Newer, still being updated. Can run on higher 720p and 1080p monitors with less upscaling. Can develop for mobile if you wish.
    Cons: Javascript is slow as $%@^&, and will run slower than a turtle on old computers. Your players will be stunned at how high your system requirements will be to run your games. Making art for higher resolutions is a pain. Still being updated means you will need to pick a version and stick with it, else risk your project not working as intended. Less plug-ins for.

    I'd say it comes down to how badly do you want high resolution and mobile support. If 640 x 480 cap isn't a bother for you, I'd pick ACE honestly as it feels more stable and complete to me. In fact that's why I still make for ACE, as trying to keep up with the 720 p then 1080 p and now it is 1440 p crowd is a losing proposition in my opinion.
     
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  9. Helladen

    Helladen Deviant Designer Veteran

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    Javascript is a very fast language, way better than Ruby. The engine utilizes less CPU than any RPG Maker to date. MV definitely is not slower than VX Ace.
     
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  10. cabfe

    cabfe Cool Cat Veteran

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    LOL. :guffaw:

    I have never gotten 1 frame per second on any Ace game, whereas with MV...
     
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  11. elpeleq42

    elpeleq42 Veteran Veteran

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    Well...Javascript is kinda 10x faster than ruby... but anyway....(yes it's a link)

    I recommend buying MV. It has as many scripts as VX Ace, but while those MV's scripts are going to increase and be updated, VXA scripts won't for the most part. Also, Javascript is lots of times faster than ruby, and a lot easier to run in multiple platforms(Windows, Linux,Mac, android, iOS and well... the web), so MV games will perform better and be easier to spread.

    About plugins compatibility: I nearly never had the problem that bgillisp said(of having to stick to a version of MV/plugin(s) because of problems). In a project of mine, which I worked on for over a year, I had around 40~50 plugins, and had at best 2 or 3 problems with incompatibility between then(and just 1 case in which I had to remove or not update one). The situation is pretty stable.

    On top of all that, MV and VXA(at least on my region) have basically the same price on steam( R$10 difference, ~2,5U$) so I honestly see no reason to pick VXA.
     
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  12. cabfe

    cabfe Cool Cat Veteran

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    I'm not saying that Javascript is slower than Ruby, just that MV in general is slower than Ace.
    That's a fact that nobody can contest.
    There is more at work than Javascript. The HTML5 part has a lot to it in the overall process.
    MV games were simply unplayable on my old computer where I had 60 fps with Ace games.
     
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  13. bgillisp

    bgillisp Global Moderators Global Mod

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    @Helladen : False. I can play ACE games fine on this computer, MV games cannot run except at bad frame rates. So it's either the language or how they coded it, but something is making it slower than ACE games on same spec computers.

    Though I will admit it is probably how they coded it, as I've heard one of our programmers redid the entire engine and made it blazing fast. So maybe that is the issue really.

    @elpeleq42 : You probably don't see all of the posts of I updated to MV version (whatever) and now my plug-ins don't work. And then they learn those plug-ins are not going to be updated as the maker has left the community but heaven forbid you can't have that plug-in anymore. That's why I said pick a version, stick to it.

    Besides, you wouldn't change Unity versions mid development would you? That would just be silly. So I really don't know why anyone expects changing MV versions mid-development to go any better for them.
     
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  14. Lornsteyn

    Lornsteyn Sleepy Dragon Veteran

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    Every RPG Maker has its Pros and Cons.
    Only because the MV is the newest, it doesnt mean its the best.
    I own 2k/3, VX Ace and MV, the 2k3 is my favorite and Im working currently with the VX Ace.
    My advice, download the trials, test them and buy the one you like.
    If you plan to make own graphics and are a beginner, I recommend 2k3 or VX Ace, because its easier to pixel stuff for them.
    But this is just my opinion.
     
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  15. Helladen

    Helladen Deviant Designer Veteran

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    Ruby is only good on rails, it's not good for anything else.

    The problem with Ruby is it is inherently slow when it comes to processing a lot at a time. RPG Maker XP could barely have any scripts before running super slow. RPG Maker VX and VX Ace were better, but they still aren't great.
     
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  16. Kes

    Kes Global Moderators Global Mod

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    It doesn't matter how well Javascript is optimised, the way that MV is constructed means that it cannot run at more than a few fps on any AMD computer, irrespective of how high its spec is. (It's not just MV which has this problem on AMD computers, a lot of other software does as well, but that is irrelevant to the discussion.) As I want my games to be accessible to any player, I'm sticking with Ace. Also, I sell a lot of games in countries where it is usual to have mid-range hardware at best. Ace can run on older, lower spec machines without difficulties.

    This may not be relevant to all devs, but I thought it worth mentioning when thinking about the choice between the two.
     
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  17. DerVVulfman

    DerVVulfman Resident Werewolf Veteran

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    Oh, hell no, Helladen. I still RMXP. And I have a project with a massive 200+ scripts within whilst still running its standard 40fps rate. I would say it would be lousy scripters who cannot manage resources or timing systems that might have caused issues you may have encountered.

    As to your later engines, I personally distain their mapping systems as serious downgrades. VX's framerate on the maps may have been an improvement, but they seriously removed terrain tags and 'simplified' their code. VXAce might be an improvement in this aspect, but the mapping is still poor.

    Oh, and with a decent resolution script and some know-how, you can typically get beyond the 'fixed' 640x480. I made my own tilemap script that handles up to 1024x768, coded in ruby (Personal script). If I could C+ DLL it, gawd, watch out. An RMXPAce mighta been a better idea.
     
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  18. Helladen

    Helladen Deviant Designer Veteran

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    Do you not understand how a scripting language works? The compiled executable run the script inside an emulated environment. The speed of the scripting language is directly related to the programming language used.

    MV can run in Electron, on the web, converted to run on older machines. Every PC has a browser, MV is HTML5 and JS. You are not a programmer, I program for a living. You just don't know how to solve your compatibility issues. MV also does not require a RTP installation either.

    The scripting engine is weaker, that's my point. MV can have plugins with 50,000 lines of code.


    Maybe MV's default Windows exporter sucks for AMD users. Anyway my point still stands...
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2018
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  19. DerVVulfman

    DerVVulfman Resident Werewolf Veteran

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    Well, I know the differences between scripting languages and compiled code, Helladen XD I programmed in the Dos 2.0 era. Even with a cheap piece of garbage such as a Texas Instruments 99/4A home computer, I crafted my own 'Starfighter' game. And when my previous boss had a HDD crash, I wrote a point-of-sale program for his Windows Environment.

    The speed of the actual engine running the code also has a significant bearing. While I prefer RPGMaker XP, I am also familiar with an open-source package that, while defaulted to 40fps, can run ruby 2.0+ easily at 120fps.

    I stated 200 scripts, not lines of code. And my scripts tend to be 1000 to 6000 lines per script in script systems. I just glanced and very likely met your 50,000 line criteria from RMMV if not exceeded. Or are you suggesting that someone wrote an individual plugin, a single plugin, that boasted 50,000 lines in itself?

    As to RTP installation, wasn't that by enterbrain's design?
     
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  20. punchybot

    punchybot Veteran Veteran

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    Buy all of them.
     
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