Why does anyone use fanservice?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Bellflowers, Jul 9, 2018.

  1. Aesica

    Aesica undefined Veteran

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    Sorry, I wasn't able to reply until just now. After looking at the picture, the only thing that bothers me is the succubus-like character on the right, but it has nothing to do with her attire (which is actually pretty tame for a succubus) but rather, the placement of her wings--they should probably be higher. The soldier's right leg (your left) seems to have the knee placement a bit off as well, but again, that's more an anatomy mishap than a problem with her attire.

    That said, the fact that you're exploring the possibility that fanservice is actually okay is very good, as many people with what seems like deeply-rooted opinions never once venture outside their comfort zone. For that, I applaud you.
     
  2. trouble time

    trouble time Bearer of the Word Veteran

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    I can actually explain this, if you were standing behind her the wings attract your eyes to her ass, and since shes a succubus i dont need to explain that further.

    Anyway, @Bellflowers, i feel like Hell may have frozen over since someone changed their opinion on the internet. Like i sometimes forget that can even happen. Good on you. I have a WHOLE LOT to say on using fanservice, but i dont want to get started on it right now cause im on my phone and hate touch keyboards.
     
  3. Touchfuzzy

    Touchfuzzy Rantagonist Staff Member Lead Eagle

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    @Bellflowers Of course more variety is great! I've said that from the beginning. But the point is that that you were relegating anyone who made a variety of characters (even FFVII had a variety of bust sizes, Tifa was huge, but Aeris was about average, and Yuffie didn't have big boobs either (and going outside of the playable characters you still had variety)), as doing it wrong because they included someone with big breasts.

    There is of course the fact that you tend to see more idealized body types in video games, playable characters don't tend to be ugly, and if they are, they are usually joke characters (Torneko, Steiner), but its hard to pinpoint if the whole trope of everyone just being pretty is actually all that harmful.

    I mean, I'll be honest, I don't tend to like playing as unattractive characters, male, female, or other. Especially as a main character.

    Also RE: Nier: Automata, the blindfolds are symbolic. The scenes where they tend to take them off and you see their eyes are usually ones in which things are revealed to them and they see the truth that was hidden from them. It's one of my favorite games of all time, but occasionally they get really heavy handed with the symbolism.
     
  4. Andar

    Andar Veteran Veteran

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    The difference between fanservice and lolicon is that lolicon is about young children, and children (especially pre-teen children) can't really defend themselves. And that is not about strength or body-size, it's about experience and learning - most ten-year old can't really think or argue on an adult level against some opinions. That goes to the point that young children can be indoctrinated by their parents to belief really wrong stuff like racism or other extremes.

    So there are some points where fanservice can be too much (as a lot of people always argued here), you just can't generalize to every form of fanservice. And that is the entire point of the rating systems - to make sure that no one gets too much inappropiate content while being too young to really understand what something is about.

    And even there there are cultural differences - America is (in my opinion) much too lenient on blood and gore, while being too strict on nudity. Here in Germany I've seen movies rated Age-12 for children that include full nudity scenes (as long as those scenes are NOT sexual) while gore-heavy movies that are allowed for teenagers in america are getting an Age-18 restriction here even after the worst scenes have been removed.
    And you could use that as an argument for the fact that more blood on TV and games lead to more public shootings (which seem to happen at least once a year in the USA based on some newsletters, while it is once every ten years here in Germany).
    Personally I think that statistic has nothing to do with the amount of blood on the screens but more with the much more lenient USA laws on gun ownership - in Germany you'll need a special permit (which is NOT easy to get) to be able to purchase guns that are above extremely small calibers.
    But again, that is the point - it takes a lot of research to go from opinion to fact. And unless you integrate a lot of data, all statistics will be of limited use.
     
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  5. Rubescen

    Rubescen Veteran Veteran

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  6. Aesica

    Aesica undefined Veteran

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    Ha! I suppose that's fair enough. :)
     
  7. Astfgl66

    Astfgl66 Veteran Veteran

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    Thank you for actually finding them! It was really easy to get full length texts once I had the complete references.
     
  8. Tai_MT

    Tai_MT Veteran Veteran

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    @Touchfuzzy

    Hey, I don't mind you holding a far different opinion than me and thinking that more can be done to be inclusive in video gaming for women. Or, to make it a safer space for them.

    I just don't feel the same on the subject. For me, I think it's all pretty much equal and it's just a small minority of women with a political agenda "crying wolf". But, I hold no real proof of that beyond what has hit the "mainstream" on the subject.

    I've seen guys engage in standard misogyny in insults and engage in harassment. I mean, it's terrible, but I usually chalk it up to "The nature of the internet". Such people would likely never say such things in person, where people know who they are and can ostracize them in public.

    But, that's my opinion. If people want to continue to fight for more equal treatment for women and better treatment for women, I have no problem with it. I only want to add my own flag to theirs and ask for more equal treatment for men and better treatment for men on top of it. I don't like being told that I'm some [Expletive Deleted] gay person any more than a woman likes to be told to "get in the kitchen and make me a sandwich". In general, I wish the toxic behavior of online gaming would stop, but that's neither here nor there.

    Back to the subject at hand, however, I'm in favor of fanservice on either side of the aisle. I'm not in favor of it shoved in my face or anyone else's face... But, it is what it is. Why deny the base instincts of humanity and try to stunt our growth as a species?

    To be honest, I'm far more concerned how we've "normalized" violence in every day life than we are in normalizing "racy clothing".
     
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  9. Touchfuzzy

    Touchfuzzy Rantagonist Staff Member Lead Eagle

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    I think the problem is that there are very few measured voices. People tend to get pushed more extreme by opposing extreme opinions until the massive middle ground just disappears.

    To me, the truth is that there are issues, but they are way more complicated and grey than people want to admit.

    Also, I think that most people want the online toxicity to drop. Except manchildren who act like it is their divine right to act like a jerk on the internet.
     
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  10. Tai_MT

    Tai_MT Veteran Veteran

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    Well, I don't mind the normal "I'm frustrated, so I'm yelling insults at you to vent". I absolutely despise the, "learn to play, scrub" and "my team freakin' sucks" along with the massive amount of people just harassing and insulting each other for no reason, other than they have no self control.

    I mean, when I was starting to game online, you got along with your team and chatted during the match, and sometimes commented on someone going like 2 and 10 and being like, "man dude, you fed the freakin' team". You'd get to "post game chat" and you'd sometimes get a GG, or you'd get like 20 seconds of trash talk and complaining from the losers, but then it was over. Next game, everyone was back to being cool again and having fun.

    I have no idea what happened other than suddenly people decided it was okay to fill absolutely every single second of time the mic is on their face with stuff that angers other people.
     
  11. ShadowHawkDragon

    ShadowHawkDragon Veteran Veteran

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    And here I thought I was done with this thread. I'll admit I was losing my patience and got a bit snarky here and there myself.

    look up 'Etrian Odyssey 5 Necromancer' and you'll see why I called those 2 designs 'kiddy'. If you had posted these I wouldn't have had much to say in defence. The men are also topless if that means anything. Now back to the search and replace 'Necromancer' with 'Fencer' and then 'Dragoon' and you'll see that heavily armoured classes are also playable. Not to mention after the first mission you can 'swap classes' while keeping the original portrait so you can still play a Necromancer with the armoured Dragoon portraits if that floats your boat.

    You don't have to suddenly like 'fanservice' just don't hate others for liking it. Some people do like it, for some it may even improve the experience and its there for those who do.

    To identify where 'fanservice' is done well it helps to know when its done bad. Most Compile Heart games such as Hyperdimensional Neptunia and Mugen Souls fall under the extreme, its a very niche preference and is where I personally draw the line on 'fanservice'. But that's just me.

    The worst offender, something I try to keep in mind when designing my battlers is double standards. By this I mean having men in full plate mail while women are lucky to get a bikini and yet they have the same defence value, its not even realistic. I said this back on the first page, what you do to women you should do the 'equivalent' to men. Do take note of fashion equivalents, skirts may or may not equal trousers based on skirt-length and overall culture.

    By the way, with that ridiculously busty succubus I'm planning I'll also be making a variation on my Buff Mushroom (posted back on first page) with a more human like appearance and probably no more than a loincloth for clothing. Both will be designed to be ridiculous over-representations of the human body and parodies of 'fanservice tropes'. I may also do a naked 'pretty boy' complete with 'sparkle censorship' down below to parody bishounen manga/anime. Its only fair ;)
    Do note these are examples of the extreme being done as a joke.
     
  12. HexMozart88

    HexMozart88 The Master of Random Garbage Veteran

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    @Bellflowers I've read basically the entire thread up to your post, and your eventual change of opinion is commendable.
    There's no one way fanservice can be used well. I'm not generally into it, as I don't really get aroused by anything in that sense. But, I think it's appropriate if that's the purpose of what it's in, for example, in dating simulators, it can be of use. Here's generally where I can appreciate it.
    1. If there's some kind of backstory.
    For example, one of the things I actually enjoy about Yandere Simulator (I'm about to get burned at the stake for this, I can sense it now) is how Kokona was very likely just meant to be a simple character with enormous boobs, but her story was turned into her using her appearance in order to get money to pay off her father's debts. This is the kind of time where I find it fitting to use.
    2. If it's a part of the culture.
    I'll give you an example from my own game this time. One of my main characters, Kumiko, comes from a place where they generally wear very little clothing into battle because they embrace a heroic death. Kumiko herself is skeptical of this, however, but even though she hasn't lived there in years, she still feels as though she needs to wear some degree of her cultural dress. However, some of the more exposed parts, such as her biceps and stomach, are balanced by more shapeless clothing, such as the green armour plate on her chest. Some other characters have decent sized breasts compared to the rest of their bodies. However, my game takes place in medieval times, and they most likely wore corsets at some point (some may still). They may not have visible belly fat.
    3. It makes logical sense.
    This could be referring to the character's personality which dictates their clothing preference, or a specific trait which would make them look a certain way. For example, a character who is confident with their body, as long as they are not in a society which disallows expressive and revealing clothing, would just be reasonable to give them that kind of clothing. And for example, if you have a skilled archer, male or female, they'll need a heck ton of upper body strength, so more defined biceps and shoulders are completely appropriate. You have an assassin or a rogue who needs to run constantly? It's perfectly plausible -- and in fact, I would encourage this -- to give them larger legs and rears.

    When I tend to dislike it is
    1. When they are nothing but their fanservice-y features and they have no personality, and the player is supposed to be rooting for them.
    2. When the breasts are so impossibly large, it's a wonder they don't have scoliosis. Unless of course it's a joke, which leads me to my next point.
    3. When it leads to a lack of seriousness in a story whose purpose is to convey a serious message.

    Welp. That was way longer than I intended it to be.
     
  13. bgillisp

    bgillisp Global Moderators Global Mod

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    @Bellflowers : It's my old college username which the system assigned me way back when and I just stuck with it. As for your question, that is a valid question, which is why you look to see if you can find more articles which back up the study, and do not circular reference each other (as in A says it is true because B does, and B says it is true because A does). If you cannot find too many other articles which show the same result that means one of two things:

    1: The study is new and has not had time to be replicated yet (and as a result should NOT be taken as fact).

    2: The study is the outlier and the opposite is actually true.

    As for the paywall thing, that is a problem in how the academic world does things more than anything. I work in academics myself as a university teacher so I get free access via my school as they pay for us to access those, though it does depend on the cite as they prefer to give us access to quality cites and not just random journal X.

    However do be careful. Recently it was exposed that one journal was accepting anything you wanted to publish in it, whether or not it was true. All you had to do was pay them $1000. And since most schools require their teachers to publish an article each year or be fired, at least here in the US, you can guess what has been happening from here.
     
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  14. trouble time

    trouble time Bearer of the Word Veteran

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    Okay, I'm back at my computer so I can start talking a bit more about fan service and how I think it should be used. Reason number one should always be because you want to, I know its super simple and obvious but if you want to you should.

    Now I'm going to talk about what I've done to use fan service. I'll explain why I made the decisions i made as well.

    I'm probably going to reference the blue girl from the image posted earlier (Laura) because she was made the way she is for very specific purposes tied not just to the setting but also for a specific meta purpose (Well they all were, but she was made for a specific problem I noticed). The enemy faction's vanguard are succubi, and each of them use any method they can to corrupt their enemies to their side since its more valuable than killing them in most cases. If I didn't have the Lich culture the way I did the game might come off a bit puritanical since the other main characters are a knight from a pseudo-religious order and a former soldier from a culture that integrates military ideals and doctrines into every aspect of their lives. I don't actually mean to make the game anti-sexuality, so I decided I needed someone more sexual with the main cast. That's where Laura comes in.

    Just making her act a bit more sexual would be boring though. The other two main characters Iii (who's picture was never posted in this thread) and Merry (the soldier elf) come from cultures that are about iron hard discipline and military ideals and values, one being from a knight order and the other a culture that inserts military philosophy into most facets of life. So I decided that the Lich culture needed to be different to justify Laura being different. One main difference is that Liches were spirit beings that came to occupy physical bodies. Their bodies are consumer products, and several poorer liches use mass produced bodies with the only difference being their haircuts and clothing. Showy clothing is common because its one of the easier ways to have individuality. Coming from this culture Laura already had different standards of modesty than the other two. The other two's upbringing and culture likely wouldn't have produced soemone like Laura, and if they did there'd likely be some story behind it. Her culture is one where her flirty attitude wouldn't be out of the ordinary. Having a shy, modest girl walking around with a lot of exposed skin doesn't make much sense, she needs a personality that makes sense with her clothing. In Laura's case the culture helps explain where her personality developed from, not to mention she recently got the highest quality of Lich body available and really wants to show it off, though she's a bit concerned her girlfriend might have a problem with the fact she looks completely different, and she doesn't like that she's shorter than she used to be. She not only serves her meta purpose, but she blends into the world while doing it. It also helps she's fun to write.

    To summerize it in a single sentence, fan service should be diagetic. Diegesis refers to the source film music comes from, basically if the characters can hear it and its coming from a source in the movie then its diagetic, if the musics only there for the audience (like an insert song for an action sequence with no speakers anywhere nearby). Basically the fanservice should derive its existence from a source inside the narrative. It shouldn't be there just because it'd be hot.
     
  15. Tai_MT

    Tai_MT Veteran Veteran

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    @Bellflowers

    Well, here's the thing: The media portrayed "Gamergate" as some sort of sexist issue in the gaming industry. The problem was... I was one of the people who was on board with the, "WTF? Why are game devs sleeping with game journalists and doing favors for them in order to get good press?". Then, I was ubiquitously labeled a "misogynist" for my viewpoint, because I'd sided with those who wanted the ties between Game Journalism and Game Developers to be severed entirely, or at least for them to provide absolute 100% transparency about all their ties to everyone in the industry.

    I was on the receiving end for a lot of that vitriol for the simple opinion of, "I don't want corruption to exist in the Gaming Industry because I want consumers to obtain value for the money they spend and I want Video Games to improve in quality".

    Everything that came after that was a massive smoke screen to hide the fact that there was such widespread corruption in the Industry and was an attempt to "shift blame". Heck, just a few days afterwards, all the major gaming journalist outlets all released similar articles saying, "Gaming is Dead" and "All Gamers are Misogynists". If there was ever a shred of doubt in anyone's mind, they needed look no further than the coordinated effort to attack all gamers, and not just ones that were terrible people.

    Are there gamers who are misogynists? Absolutely. Are they the vast majority of Gamers? While I don't know the answer to that, I suspect the answer is "no". I suspect it's more like, "They are a fringe lunatic group that simply enjoys Gaming". Every group has fringe lunatics. Gamers try not to let those fringe weirdos define all of us. Other groups... Don't care so much about who associates with their group.

    Do I think women should be treated in a sexist manner online? No. But, for the same token, I'm tired of being treated in a sexist manner in real life and online as well. Nobody should have to deal with Sexism. One should not get preferential treatment based on color, creed, sex, religion, sexual preferences, or other things completely out of their control. Likewise, I don't think some of those women involved in Gamergate, who had engaged in the corruption, should've gotten death threats either. Do I believe they received harassment and death threats? Absolutely. People hate when you threaten something they love and mischaracterize them as people based on their hobbies or opinions. Do I think it was as many as they claim? No, I don't. Most of the responses I saw were what I call "measured outrage". That is, people publishing articles and leaving comments and making videos to pick apart the arguments, prove people were lying, calling their behavior reprehensible, and calling the people out on their corruption. These same people likewise urged people who read their articles and watched their videos to not harass the people involved. Frankly, I agree. It's sickening that people do that. But, that's the internet. The internet is a scary and dangerous place and it never forgets. So, it's always a good idea to not make yourself out to be a target that can unanimously be declared as "evil" by swathes of the internet. But, that's sort of true anywhere in the public eye. If you make public statements, you should be prepared for the public to provide its feedback and you should be prepared for all the consequences of those public statements.

    Doesn't make the harassing behavior less wrong. But, one should realize that they're likely to get it before engaging in the public eye like so many do. It's a risk you take. Sort of like living on a Fault Line.

    I did also hear that some of the harassment that was received by the women involved was also generated by them to garner public sympathy. I don't know if that's true or not, so the validity of it is suspect. However, if someone was already a corrupt liar... I have a harder time doubting accusations like that. Call it Human Nature.

    As for the "behind the scenes" stuff with Mass Effect Andromeda. It's... pretty scary stuff actually. I'd suggest you YouTube a man named "Manveer Heir". He was essentially the guy in charge of the game. He makes frequent racist posts on Twitter about how White People are the absolute worst and even openly supports Muslim extremists who engage in Jihad (who really don't treat their women very well). There's a lot of videos out there about him and the things he's posted (complete with links to all the sources, if you visit the right videos). I'm not sure who's decision it was to make all the ladies "ugly" in Mass Effect Andromeda, but I'm not really sure I care all that much. I mean, I wanted to date a girl in a skin-tight outfight, who was an alien, and her suit was actually an environmental suit because she didn't have an immune system and it was basically impossible to be intimate with her in any way. I didn't even get to see her face until the third game. So, obviously, looks aren't a priority for me. Before that girl, I dated what was essentially a Butch Military Brat of a woman who was also a xenophobe. She wasn't pretty either. But, she was into the military and poetry and was willing to learn to stop being Xenophobic if I talked to her enough about it, so I really liked her. Short reply on that is simply that I don't really care that the ladies were that ugly in Mass Effect Andromeda. But, it did make me angry that they'd taken actually good looking actresses and then made their models uglier on purpose. I don't like that sort of pandering. Why not just use more plain looking actresses in the first place if that's what you want?

    As for you liking Mass Effect... Eh, that's your opinion. You don't have to like it. I thought the first was amazing, the second sucked, the third was "okay" and Andromeda was garbage. The main lure of it is the characters and the way the story of the universe is told through those characters. But, it's a Sci Fi setting, so you're not going to have a lot of "takers" there in the first place. I, personally, liked that I was making moral decisions that actually mattered and was meeting people and learning about them enough that I cared about who they were. You don't get that in many games anymore. In fact, Mass Effect was the last RPG I played where I was invested in the characters and even the story. Most RPGs, I tend to give up on them about 2 hours in because there's just nothing compelling about the characters or the story to draw me in.

    But, to each their own. Again, you don't have to enjoy it.
     
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  16. Lunarea

    Lunarea Artist Global Mod

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    First, let me say that I was really hoping that the topic would be about this precisely, as I find it very interesting. How does a developer cater to their fans and interact with their fans directly without compromising their own vision for their project?

    In general, I think a good rule of thumb is that it should add something of value to the scene. In other words, the plot/story/dialogue of the scene should be affected in some way. If the player/viewer is thinking "ok, let's go back to the show, now", then you're breaking immersion and run the risk of turning off or annoying your audience.

    It's easier to see the value in fan-service such as cameos, pop references or breaking the 4th wall - because it tends to add some humor or lighter moments that can later be used as a contrast against more intense/dark themes or used as something to continue building up the lighter nature of the show.

    For physical depictions, it helps if the outfit or the provocative pose says something about the character's personality, current mental state or the culture/society they live in. For example, that shirtless guy scene has a lot more value if it's used to showcase the character's scars/tattoos and the fact that he happens to be training for a major battle - as opposed to the shirtless guy scene where all we learn that the character is capable of taking a shower by himself.

    I think this kind of approach allows fan-service to seem like a more natural part of the overall experience.

    Another possible approach is to make that type of content optional (for example: an image gallery that the player can decide to view or ignore or a short story set in the same universe) or use it as a form of reward (for example: extra scene for doing a long side-quest chain). This approach would allow you to engage the players who want this type of content, but not force it for everyone.
     
  17. Touchfuzzy

    Touchfuzzy Rantagonist Staff Member Lead Eagle

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    I think a good fanservice scene is in Captain America: The First Avenger when he steps out after getting the super soldier serum.

    It helps emphasizes the difference between the Steve Rogers we've seen for the first part of the movie, with Steve Rogers as Captain America. But it also provides some serious eye candy.
     
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  18. Kes

    Kes Global Moderators Global Mod

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    @Bellflowers I think it might be a good idea to edit your opening post with something cleared labelled 'Edit' to say that you have changed your mind and giving a link to your post #99.

    The reason I suggest this is that very often people new to a thread read the first few posts, think they know what the thread is about and reply accordingly. However, this one has changed dramatically, and such replies would be out of keeping with where we are now.

    I would also like to add that it takes a lot of courage to admit that one has changed one's mind having strongly defended a particular position. It's no slight thing that you did.
     
  19. Celianna

    Celianna Tileset artist Global Mod

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    I was probably the only one who was disappointed and liked the CG body more hahaha.

    Back on to when to give good fanservice, I concur with what Lunarea said; if it breaks immersion or you're asking yourself "Why is this here?" then it's not good fanservice. No one is going to raise any eyebrows if one of your girl characters loses her bikini top during a beach scene because your game is about sexy cute girls playing beach volleyball. However, people will give you a side-eye if your game is a strategy game and everything had been serious so far and suddenly one of the women loses her top. Well, awkward.

    This is one of the reasons I stopped liking Fairy Tail. The fanservice where the female characters would lose their clothes - or hell, the entire 'let's go to the hot springs' episode - it was getting too much. Too much focus on panty shots, too many breasts bobbing around. It was getting in the way of the story, and as a female reader, it was bothering me immensely how the female characters were being treated.

    Fanservice shouldn't alienate your fans. It should make them excited about a little freebie you gave them, something you know fans have been dying to see. Using tropes here wouldn't be a bad idea.
     
  20. Bellflowers

    Bellflowers Veteran Veteran

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    Sorry I’ve been gone so long, like I said I bought Nier Automata, and after spending like 3 hours dying against the first boss (its cause there’s no place to save for the first hour or so that it actually took so long).


    @Aesica well I don’t quite have the objections I used to about the art. I do still think that storyline justifications for fanservice aren’t 100% great, but I’m now thinking that it depends what the justification actually is, you know some justifications are better than others. Still I do prefer the soldier and the other character sheet I saw from that game.


    @Touchfuzzy I’ve actually heard on Tvtropes Aeris is modeled with larger breasts but just has more layers of clothing or something, but you can’t actually trust tvtropes. I DO actually think its a bit of a failing that Tifa and Yuffies costumes are really similar besides the weird armor peices on Yuffie.


    @Andar Oh I wasn’t talking about like actual children or anything, I was more thinking about the general way its done in anime, the character is actually around the other characters ages but looks younger or something. Talking about violence and guns is something I could probably go on about, but I don’t want to derail the thread.


    @ShadowHawkDragon Wow its like an even skimpier version of the other character design. As for liking fanservice, I’m not really sure on that. I remeber when my parents wouldn’t let me play magic due to cards like Demonic Tutor/ Pact I acted like I hated the game and kinda beleived that I did, but once I started playing it again I remembered that I had loved it before I was forbidden from playing it. Its a bit like that, I feel like if I explore the idea I can figure out how I really feel about it without someone else's influence. To tell you the truth all I really know about Neptunia was that the frame rate was terrible in the first one, and most people say it got better as it got sequels. I do get what you mean about plate and bikinis. While I don’t think games need to be realistic, they should be consistent, if men really need all that plating women probably should too, if you can justify it with magic armor then I’d expect the males to be dressing light for mobility since it’d use less energy to move with it and it wouldn’t be as hot.


    @HexMozart88 I mentioned this earlier, but I’ve begun to think that a storyline justification can work, but not any justification would work, the examples you gave sounded good though, though. I’ve heard a lot about characters with obscenely oversized breasts, but now I’m being told what I had characterized as obscene wasn’t really that big.


    @bgillisp So I can pay 1000$ to publish a study proving that people who like pineapple on pizza are secretly evil lizardmen? I gotta get some money together.


    @trouble time I get what your saying about diegesis, and it does make sense. The idea of using fan service for a meta purpose is interesting too.


    @Tai_MT Well, now that I think about it, the media slandering someone criticizing the media makes a lot of sense. I also looked into it, and Brianna Wu definitely pretended to harass herself on steam and forgot to log out of her developer account.


    @Lunarea I see what you’re getting at. Though I’d disagree on 4th wall breaks, I don’t really like it when that happens. Making fanservice something extra at the end of a questline might depend on the audience though.


    @Kes I’ll go edit my post after this one, that’s a really good idea, and did I really hit right on post 99? Nice.


    @Celianna Well to be fair, I never thought Fairy Tail had much story for fanservice to get in the way of. Though I’m wondering about panty shots and the like, for example let's say two characters are very busty and fighting in skirts with, I dunno some martial art with high kicks, do you think it’d still cause a problem if it weren’t things like camera zooms calling a ton of attention to it?
     

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