Why is the RPG Maker name so hated?

Discussion in 'Commercial Games Discussion' started by Hamilcar, Jun 10, 2014.

  1. kovak

    kovak Silverguard Veteran

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    I'd like to say one last thing: look for kickstarter games that uses rpg maker, check their quality and you will notice that the amount of money wasted on them was worth it.


    Most of time you can't run away from it, your wallet will bleed.


    Some of you will notice that most of them were funded under 100k and i'd like to state that you'd need at least 300k to make something with really great sound and artstyle and I'm not even taking about coding or gameplay, just what you hear and see when playing.
     
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  2. Areeis

    Areeis Villager Member

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    I love your post as a whole, Pierman. Thank you so much for your links and your hilarious metaphor.


    May I have this quote printed on a shirt, please?





    I think if you see a bunch of bad games coming out, all made with the same engine, you'll start developing a dislike for said engine no matter what. Just take a look at Unity. Wasteland 2, Slime Rancher, Pillars of Eternity, City Skylines, Fallout Shelter and so many more are all made with Unity, but what the engine is best known for is those piles of 'games' on Steam Greenlight.


    Engines will advertise themselves with their games one way or the other. It's the same with any creative tools really.  
     
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  3. kovak

    kovak Silverguard Veteran

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    Now that you mentioned the tool thing i haven't seen people saying that Gimp is for crap art yet.
     
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  4. HexMozart88

    HexMozart88 The Master of Random Garbage Veteran

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    All I say to all of this trash-talking about RM games is: hey, would you prefer Sonic '06? I don't think it's possible to make a game that buggy in any RM. 
     
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  5. bgillisp

    bgillisp Global Moderators Global Mod

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    @HexMozart88: Challenge accepted! Now presenting the game where you play as Eric, and due to bugs you can walk on walls, walk through walls, and crash the game if you don't do things in the magical order that only I know. Now presenting, The Worst RPG Ever!
     
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  6. UNphiltered_khaos

    UNphiltered_khaos Game Dev. Artist. Veteran

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    DL link, please?


    I don't think RM gets as much hate as we seem to think. Even reading the comments in the links Pierman put up, there are a lot of people defending RM and its users. And RPGMakerBullS*** was a guys site where he put up his own crappy (by his telling) games. I don't think he was disparaging the engine, so much as his lack of skill.


    I think the hate gets amplified, latched onto, and remembered more than praise. Or there is a dedicated community of Trolls that just automatically write off whatever looks like RM. Lol, one person said "Just program your own engine and avoid RM BS." The response was, you'll get much worse crap from custom coded engine than you ever will with RM. Coders aren't generally known for their art ability. Lolololol.
     
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  7. Marquise*

    Marquise* Veteran Veteran

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    OMG!  Ohhhhh no! not for a dyslexic like me.  On the other hand, those imploders... they can really and sadly cost a company with their pomposity.  They are usually the very first proud of their own coding and when asked to turn around a problem or solve it with more code, they are the first to tell others how unrealistic are their expectations rather than try to solve the problem.


    There is a 2D animation software company like that in Montreal.  In the past, we started toknow we had a problem with it having to use Photoshop on the side and then one day at the end of a camera move...  hours to try to explain that a real camera don't use BEZIER in a EASE-OUT panoramic.  (we had an elastic bounce on the cam like on a pneumatic superball) Guess what was their answer?  Paraphrasing here "But it is bezier controlled, aren't you happy it is that smooth?  It is beautiful.  If you want you can use the handles!"  Yes but nope!  don't work!  Even with the worsest pile up of keyframes on the cam to STICK the cam on path!  %$^%$%^$%^$%^$#%$#$%  (Just imagine dizzy cam on video games... but in a 2D cartoon!  o_O  How can you mess with a cam in a 2D cartoon?  High tech bezier or not... FRAG this!  Get me to your boss or come here tell me how to do our job!!  XD LOL)


    @kovakI am a photoshop user you'll hear me swear crap if you put me on Gimp maybe.  Although, I have a less sensationalistic head than most of the population because I don't want everything yesterday with efforts I didn't putted on or money I don't have.  So I kinda respect GIMP as a whole for the peoples unable to afford the platinum tool.  But, seriously before I sprite from scratch... I kinda etch a sketch my chars on paper and folks following my monthly progress might had saw it.  You could put in my hand a piece of coal and recycled paper and I would sprite you something better and faster than on computer... as long you can scan and resize it after and I can use my animation disk and light table. 


    @everyone else, take just what I typed to kovak and translate that to game.  Not something that makes you physically sick but strengthen your patience and tolerance.  An ape might learn to use an asset tool, almost even a RPG tool, but to get something good out of it we have to remember this is just a tool and we are WAY past the ape stage and we should think farther than just suck money from others first.  We have to think of our limitations and use our strengths. (I would gladly use Unreal ed if I could just stop having an ape fit each and every time I block on a shadow or a polygon, a curve or a boolean, rather than just 2D it out and go on with my story!  Sheesh!  Nobody  wanna see Marquise in a primate fit!  It might be at the tenth of Marquise on a bed bug nest, but it is enough to call an emergency rage quit!)  By having a formidable yet simple palette of tool, RPGMaker allows everyone to make a game.  Except we rarely want to play with everyone!  I knew an amazing movie poster artist who made his posters using merely Prismacolors... like the real wooden crayons.  And he still does!  We know when he don't on what he works and we miss the crayons. Except all color crayon haters just gets that stabbing pain in the chest when learning he is a non-tech guy and no one can do as well as he does!  Folks... I know that RPGMaker is made so that even a kid can use it!  Except, some folks have to stop acting like brats spitting in its direction.  I suspect many RPGHaters doing that cannot even handle the standard quality they expect so much and would end up teaching how to do RPG to others rather than actually DO what they hope to preach without any good example!  (And I know who are the best teachers, they are the ones praising the technique of folks who can do a good job over the simplest and most rudimentary tools instead of the snobbing from others using advanced tools that may fall in the garbage each 6 months!  You can go to the grocery with a Peugeot or a monocycle, I'm not sure anyone wants to scratch their BMW limo there!)
     
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  8. UNphiltered_khaos

    UNphiltered_khaos Game Dev. Artist. Veteran

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    So, there is a "game" on Steam...


    1 Sound effect. 1 animation (player movement). No enemies, no collectibles, no story, No Music. 10 levels and they loop. AND they use the same art as another game. I have not yet been able to determine if the art is a rip, a purchased asset or what the deal is, so I am unsure about whether they were obtained ethically, but it's weird seeing the 2 different games, and 1 has actual gameplay. Apparently all this was after a promised Openworld, variety of enemies and weapons with bosses, nice music and the works promised in Greenlight (It was apparently a short campaign). How it made it to Steam without even having music is beyond me. And it's very disappointing. Funny thing is, this isn't even an RPG Maker game, as far as I can tell. But I ask you, are there any RPG Maker games so shameless in their lack of "Game"? I am not trying to rip on a fellow developer, but this product itself should bring shame to whoever pushed this onto steam in it's current form. It needs a lot of work, in my opinion. I have seen some lazy RM games, but they at least had things to do.
     
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  9. Marquise*

    Marquise* Veteran Veteran

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    o_O not sure it is RPGM but the trailer is a black square and... o_O  Oh well it isn't Poop In The Soup!
     
  10. HexMozart88

    HexMozart88 The Master of Random Garbage Veteran

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    That is a truly disgusting looking game. I could literally create something like that in six hours or less. All I need is a platformer script and I'm good. 
     
  11. tlbearer

    tlbearer Veteran Veteran

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    I love the RPG Maker Series because one of my favorite games was made on it, the Aveyond series. It shows just how good a game can be made if the person truly tries and truly wants to show the world just how awesome their game world/idea is. I have learned so much from just playing around with the different engines than I ever learn when I had unity on my computer and tried to use it for a couple of months. I also love the nostalgia feeling that I get when playing games made with 2D graphics. I do use lots of DLCs in my projects and ask a bunch of questions on how to do things, which to me is all part of the learning experience. I think people hate it because people who want to in a sense make quick money just put out a product with no real thought or idea behind it.


    I am having my first game, Demon Seals, play tested all the way through as it is mostly done but there is still a ton of things that I want to do with it before I release it in December. I love the community here and have even made some good solid friends from here, but that being said, it also seems that some can't take criticism or can't take being told when something isn't wrong properly. I have already got feedback from some of my play-testers of a few things that need to be changed and I plan on fixing those issues to make the game run better/smoother. It also seems that once a game is out the creators/publishers don't bother to keep up with the game and put out updates when bugs are found that weren't found in play-testing. I plan on updating my game after December if bugs are found so that the players/fans of the game get the best experience possible.
     
  12. Engr. Adiktuzmiko

    Engr. Adiktuzmiko Chemical Engineer, Game Developer, Using BlinkBoy' Veteran

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    yay another RM lover because of Aveyond... me too, I learned of RM's existence because of Aveyond
     
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  13. tlbearer

    tlbearer Veteran Veteran

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    I actually have been doing a playthrough of the series on my youtube channel.
     
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