Why not have some central hub for any possible 'achievements' made in engines?

Nereid

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As it is people can create them using separate plugins, but nothing would ever centralize them online anywhere... and if people want to link them online they'd still be on a variety of sites... so, has nothing central ever been thought about?
 

Andar

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who would pay for that hub?
who would develop the software needed and keep it updated?
who would make sure that no one cheats on getting any achievement there?

those questions are only the beginning, and they are not trivial to solve...
 

Nereid

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There's already multiple sites to cater to just a single software, why would it be impossible to host another db?
 

Andar

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because it needs to be more than a single db, it also needs to have data security on a very complex level.

after all you're giving away the access to enter values into the database to a lot of people, and need to prevent anyone from changing data not added by that person.
otherwise the entire database would be useless because someone would just write a plugin "give me all achievments from every game".
 

Nereid

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Is that really the reason why it was never done? There's all sorts of people who volunteered to do all sorts of things around here, I'm sure there'll be some who'd do that too, and even if there's nothing someone from metagamerscore would usually notice...
 

Shaz

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Why wasn't it ever done? 1 - nobody requested it; 2 - nobody wanted to do it.

Just because people volunteer to do stuff doesn't mean anyone would want to do that - there's a lot of stuff people ask for that nobody volunteers to do. And nobody is obligated to to fill a request if they don't want to.
 

Nereid

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It would even possibly attract more people to the software by its coincidental advertisement inherent in the process, but I guess some are resistant to change (and, anyway, it's not like a poll has been conducted)...
 

ATT_Turan

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I don't really get the point of what you're asking about. If people embed Steam achievements into their RPG Maker game, their friends and such can see what achievements have been unlocked.

Is that what you're talking about?
 

Nereid

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The point is that it doesn't need to be tied to Steam, or any other site... with regards to that specifically though, as it happens, there's no way I'm paying a ridiculous amount of money just so I could get a game listed, much less to have a list of quests tied to it, so it'll need to be another site... but even then, the point is that whichever people use will be different every time, and there's no centralization - most sites are having that, lately... now, there could be resources issues, but if so many sites do it already it can't be impossible...
 

kirbwarrior

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Having read through this a few times, I'm not actually sure what is being asked. Do you want a centralized place for hosting games? Plugins? Common achievements? A place where you can get achievements? A place that tracks achievements? Some sort of quest system built into going through a site?
 

ATT_Turan

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That very long sentence really did nothing to clarify to me exactly what you're talking about, so...cool.

Having read through this a few times, I'm not actually sure what is being asked.
I'm with ya, brother :guffaw:
 

Nereid

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A place that tracks achievements?
That... everything else already exists, but as it is they can only be tied to separate sites, so they're all over (if there are any, since nothing is centralized and it's not easy to set them up on other sites people often don't bother linking them at all).
 

kirbwarrior

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So, just so I'm clear, do you want a centralized hub for achievements people have gotten in a given game, regardless of which sites sell and host the game?

I could see the bonuses of that, but you'd really want it to be for games where people either have to connect online (something we can already see in multiplayer games) or are assumed to connect online (last I checked this was forced with the xbone), and with no reason to cheat the system (when there is no reason, then only the especially bored and determined people would even try, if they happened to want to).

You'd also want to tie it into how the game is even made so it can communicate that to outside systems. I don't think, for example, this would work for Steam Achievements because the coding for those is very specifically for only Steam to see.
 

Nereid

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Sure, this is why something centralized is better... maybe people can still have them on multiple sites, but if this software made it easier to have them on something centralized then more people would have them (as opposed to merely symbolic, internally, if they have anything at all)... it could connect online without multiplayer I assume, momentarily, if a game does indeed have this feature...
 

kirbwarrior

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Well, my simple guess as to why it doesn't already exist is just a lack of want. I barely care about my own achievements, I like won't use them in my own games, and I forget they exist when I'm not playing a game that has them. For a developer who does care, they'd code it into the game, but also figure out where to host the game and achievements first. And there's no shared way of adding achievements into your game.

Really, you'd want the development engine itself to have a specific way to make sure your game both has achievements and in a way that doesn't require two games to be alike about it. Then, because all games made by it use similar code, a centralized hub could take all of them and post them in a place where people could see. I think there's a spot on this site about asking for specific wants in the next installment of RPG maker and I think you could get enough people together to want this. Once the development system is in place, then people can work together (namely, you alongside whoever else wants this) to make it happen.

Steam gets around this problem by instead having a centralized hub already and showing developers how to put Steam Achievements into their game so that people can easily see them. I can't think of any game ever that shows achievements from different systems together (I don't think even Overwatch does that and it's probably the easiest game to do it with).
 

ATT_Turan

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So, if I'm understanding correctly, you're asking for a server where people who buy a given game on Itch or Steam or whatever can see the achievements of other people who have purchased that game, regardless of platform?

I just don't think anyone cares. I mean...maybe I care less than the average gamer, but between my Xbox, Playstation and Steam, I have looked up achievement statistics for any game zero times. I don't know of any of my friends who have ever bothered to look at my achievements for a game.

Plus, there's non-trivial setup and maintenance for this. You're talking about:
- creating and maintaining a server
- creating a way to access the data (via a Web site or application)
- making the owners of the games create some kind of account so that this system knows it's a unique person sending this data
- having the game author code a hook into their game so that the player would log in using that account for the game to send the achievement data.

That's a lot.
 

Shaz

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It would even possibly attract more people to the software
If people wanted it, they would have asked for it. Nobody has, and even you aren't asking.

Just because you want it doesn't mean everyone else does (or anyone else does). And if you're not prepared to pay for it, why would/should someone else be?
 

Nereid

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Well, I assume PSN, Steam etc. all had this discussion about costs, so... if it's so disadvantageous how come that since about 2006 more and more sites have implemented it? I know those are some bigger corporations, but smaller sites have too (like retroachievements, metagamerscore, and all the sites with flash games), and if I had to guess the latter sites might possibly make less than a company that sells units of software, and even units of sounds, at such a price... each. So... I mean, I suppose in the end it's not absolutely necessary, but I'm wondering about the very premise of cost benefit...
 
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Andar

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in all those cases you mentioned, those sites have a direct revenue that is several orders of magnitude higher than what Degica makes, and they are using the achievments as advertisement to increase that revenue.
and that only works because their revenue is much higher, so that the minor advantage of achievments can pay the cost for that. In case of Degica, such a system would never gain that money back due to lesser sale numbers.
 

Nereid

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Well, as I said, the latter sites don't... mgs has, it seems, one sponsor... this site has, what, Kadokawa behind it? Or is that just the software?
 

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